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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: Peggy13 on Sunday 05 July 15 23:36 BST (UK)
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James Beggs Robinson is on the 1911 census, as a carpenter, married, living with his mother and siblings. There is a granddaughter Thomasina to Mary, his mother, but whose child is it? James is the only one in this household who is married. I found a marriage of a James B. Robinson on familysearch Oct-Dec 1910. Is it him? Does anyone have further information on this marriage? It is not on Emerald Ancestors. James' father was also James and his mother was Mary Lawson Beggs.
Thanks for any help
Peggy
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Likely marriage is James Robinson (son of James) 9 Dec.1910 Newtownabbey district to Isabella Burns (daughter of William). You can view the certificate from GRONI to check grooms occupation, etc. to see if it's a match and if he signed his name James, James B, etc.
Here's a link to the 1911 census entry (please include this in your posts so that we can see the entry and to save us from searching for what you've already found)-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Coggrey_Town/108952
Likely match for Thomasina-
Thomasina Robinson born 17 June 1907 Antrim district (mother- Service)
Which seems to match with this marriage-
Sarah Service (daughter of William) 12 July 1904 Antrim district Thomas Robinson (son of James)
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Hi Aghadowey,
You did find the correct James Robinson marriage, due to checking occupation, and parentage and area of marriage.
As for the census, I find it curious that James is there, but not his wife. Thomasena is there but not her parents although that is not as curious. But I couldn't find the parents elsewhere or James' wife.
I paid for the death of Thomas and it was the correct person. He is married so Sarah died after him, which was Feb 25, 1957. They had a son James as well as he was present at his father's death and a J. Robinson was present at Thomasena's death (she married Harold Henshaw).
thanks for your help
Peggy
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Bella Robinson with Burns parents 1911 census
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Doagh_Mills_Town/109089/
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That is a terrific find, helenar. It even says married under one year which confirms marriage date found. Thank you
Peggy
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Remember that the census only shows who was in a particular household on a particular night. It doesn't mean that James & his wife were living apart, Thomasina didn't live with her parents, etc.
I paid for the death of Thomas and it was the correct person. He is married so Sarah died after him, which was Feb 25, 1957.
The death certificate says Thomas was married at the time of his death but does it actually give his wife's full name? Sarah could have died earlier and Thomas remarried (possibly even to another Sarah).
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Hi Aghadowey,
No, Thomas' death certificate does not give his wife's name. His son James was present at death. I haven't found Thomas and Sarah in 1911 to see if James was born before then. As we know, Thomasena was with her grandmother.
Cheers
Peggy
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Went to GRONI's database searching for children with parents Robinson (father) & Service (mother) and found something interesting.
Thomas Robsinson married 12 July 1904 Sarah Service- as posted earlier
Jane Robinson (13 July 1904 Antrim district)
James Robinson (13 Apr.1906 Antrim district)
Thomasina Robinson (17 June 1907 Antrim district)- as posted earlier
Thinking that Jane might be unconnected but James could be Thomas & Sarah's son, I checked 1911 census and found the Service family with 2 Robinson grandchildren- Jane & James!
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Kilbride/Walkmill/110363
still looking for Thomas & Sarah...
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This Thomas Robinson a widower (which would explain the 3 children with relatives)- but census says 4 children with only 1 living-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Ballyeaston/108831
Service family in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Kilbride/Village_of_Burnside/919138
Can't see Thomas & Sarah together or widowed/married Sarah on her own.
Off to check for Sarah's possible death... but couldn't find one.
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Hi Aghadowey,
Thanks for your help. I was just going to post that I had found Jane and James with their grandfather William Service on the 1911 but you beat me to it. So thinking maybe Sarah did die young. I am pretty sure Thomas lived until 1957. I did find a Sarah Robinson death Mar 8, 1968 but it is not on Groni.
That Thomas, widower, doesn't fit as we know there were 3 children living, unless they got it wrong and there was 1 deceased, not 1 living.
Thanks again.
Peggy
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Hi, I was looking for a distant relative and noticed this thread. My Grand Father was James Beggs Robinson. My mother was one of his daughters Margaret. I noticed some time ago a Thomasina" mentioned and i have been trying to place her relationship to my Grand Father. Yes, he married Bella my Grand Mother and they set up home in Douglas Terrace, Burnside.
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Hello,
I am happy to hear from you. James was the uncle of Thomasina, who was the daughter of James' brother Thomas, wife Sarah Service. I only have one child Sarah for James Beggs Robinson, due to the 100 yr. restriction on births. Can you tell me when Margaret was born and what other siblings there were?
I do have his wife as Isabella Burns, daughter of William Burns and Mary (do you have a last name for Mary)?
Hoping to hear from you.
Peggy
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Yes, certainly... First born Eileen, then Sarah ( one time landlady of the "Wayside Inn" the local pub )
Then my mother Margaret, born 4th March 1918, them Henry, followed by Willie and lastly May. All sadly passed on.
James and Bella are buried in Rashee Burial Ground at the Five Corners. Bella passed away around 1958 and James a couple of years later.
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Thank you so very much. I guess I found the wrong date of death for James Beggs Robinson, as I had a possible date of Mar 27, 1950.
James grandmother Margaret Beggs nee Boyd and my gggrandmother Susannah Boyd were sisters. How far back have you researched the lineage?
I think I will send you a PM.
Peggy
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Yip, looks like a wrong date. I was born in 1952 and remember him well. He was quite thin and wiry and sported a little moustache. He used to enjoy standing in his doorway chatting to passers by while smoking his pipe. Hes mentioned ( as are othermembers of the family in Florence Mary McDowells book "Other days around me" and the follow up "Roses and Rainbows" The McMeekin family who owned the mill are mentioned in this too. I live near Ballyvoy and Owensland.
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This is so exciting. Actually found someone who lives near Ballyvoy and Owensland. I found some entries that say Ournsland which I thought was really Owensland, such as where James Robinson was born (that would be James Beggs Robinson's father). I have that James Beggs Robinson's sister Jane aka Jennie Robinson married Isabella's brother Robert Burns. Robert and Jennie had a son Herbert who died age 2 and a son William who died aft 1962 as he was present at his father's death. There may be others but there is that 100 yr rule.
I will have to get those books. I wonder if the McMeekin family is the same one who married into the Boyd family.
I live near Vancouver, BC,Canada and am dying to get to Ireland.
Peggy
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Can I jump in here - I would not worry about Thomas having said he had 4 children and one alive. Sometimes they did not really understand the question. My GGM said she had 8 children born and 8 alive - I have birth certificates for ELEVEN and deaths for three before 1911 so the info she gave was wrong - it should have been 11 children and 8 alive.
I was very interested in this post as I had actually adopted Thomasina into my family and now have to chuck her out - reason I adopted her was this - an Agnes Robinson my great grandfather's cousin is on 1911 census at
http://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Court_Ward/Wellwyne_Street/150161/
She has a daughter Thomasena Robinson with her aged 3 - and only Thomasina on births was the one in 1907 - you know all about her.- Agnes also had a brother Thomas whom I had not been able to find. Also her father was James who was a CARPENTER. All my lot jelled with info on your lot. When I got the birth for Thomasena and then the Thomas Robinson/ Sarah Service marriage and his dad was James a carpenter I thought the Thomasena with Agnes was her niece not her daughter - Just goes to show there can be massive co-incidences when you have a common name like Robinson.
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This is how this family looks to me so far. ? marks indicate uncertainty. Is this how others see it, as well?
1. ? Thomas Robinson? m.
2. James Robinson m. 1872 Mary Lawson Beggs, b. abt. 1853, dau of ? Beggs and Margaret Boyd [ Mary was a sister to James Beggs]
3. Thomas Robinson, b. abt. 1876; m. 1904 to Sarah Service, dau of William Service.
4. Jane Robinson, b. 1904
4. James Robinson, b. 1906
4. Thomasina (Thomasena) Robinson, b. 1907; m. Harold Henshaw
3. James Beggs Robinson, b. abt. 1880; died around 1960; m. 1910 to Isabella (Bella) Burns, dau of William Burns; buried in Rashee Graveyard.
4. Eileen Robinson
4. Sarah Robinson, b. 1912, ?Doagh?
4. Margaret Robinson, b. 1918
4. Henry Robinson
4. William (Willie) Robinson
4. May Robinson
3. Henry (Harry) Robinson, b. abt. 1883; m. 1909 Martha Alice Montgomery of Rashee; married in Canada.
3. Jane (Jennie) Robinson, b. abt. 1886; m. Robert Burns, son of William Burns (see above).
4. Herbert Burns, died young.
4. William Burns, died after 1962.
3. William Robinson, b. abt. 1891.
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What you've posted is incomplete (and difficult to follow). Mary Robinson says in 1911 census that she had 10 children but only 3 living (the number born is correct but not those alive)-
James Robinson m.(1872) Mary Lawson Beggs (c1853), dau. of _ Beggs & Margaret Boyd
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Coggrey_Town/108952
1. Thomas Robinson (2 May 1873-25 Feb.1957) m.(12 July 1904) Sarah Service
Birth: Thomas Robinson (2 May 1873) https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F567-7VM
1911 (Sarah) www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Doagh_Mills_Town/109089
1911 (James & Jane) http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Kilbride/Walkmill/110363
1911 (Thomas ?) http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Ballyclare_Rural/Ballyeaston/108831
a. Jane Robinson (13 July 1904)
b. James Robinson (13 Apr.1906)
c. Thomasina Robinson (17 June 1907) m. Harold Henshaw
2. James Beggs Robinson (27 July 1874-dy)
Birth: James Beggs Robinson (27 July 1874) https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FPS5-VMZ
3. Henry Robinson (1 May 1876-10 Mar.1883).
Birth: Henry (1 May 1876) https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FRQ9-CYF
Note: brother Henry born day after he died.
4. James Beggs Robinson (8 Oct. 1878-c1960), carpenter, m.(9 Dec.1910) Isabella “Bella” Burns (d.c1958)
Birth: Beggs Robinson (8 Oct.1878)
a. Sarah Robinson (12 May 1912)
b. Eileen Robinson (16 May 1916)
c. Margaret Caroline Robinson (4 Mar.1918)- family
d. Henry Robinson
e. William “Willie” Robinson
f. May Robinson
5. Son (17 Sept.1880)
Birth: Son (17 Sept.1880) https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGKW-QZ6
6. Henry Robinson (11 Mar. 1883) m.(1909 Canada) Martha Alice Montgomery
Birth: Henry (11 Mar.1883)
7. Jane/Jennie Robinson (25 May 1885) m.(29 Aug.1913) Robert Burns
a. Herbert Burns (13 Oct.1913-24 Aug.1915)
b. William Burns (d.aft.1962)
8. Daughter (19 Feb.1888)
9. Susan Beggs Robinson (8 Apr.1890-28 May 1890)
10. William Robinson (2 July 1891-aft.1911)
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Added-
Henry Robinson death registration confirms birthdate, place & parents-
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FLBJ-VBF
Year of birth slightly off for marriage registration-
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JD8G-6MG
1911 census- https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV9P-TRWC
see www.automatedgenealogy.com for complete record
Martha Alice Robinson's death- https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FLTR-NNB
Marriage for daughter Sheila- https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JD86-4L6
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The son born Sept 17, 1880 was Samuel Carson Robinson in the Parish of Kilbride and he died Feb 12, 1882 in Owensland.
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Thanks for your input, aghadowey. I looked over what I had put and what you wrote, and there really wasn't that much of a difference except that I had omitted Susan. My main interest in this family concerns the Service (Servis) connection as it may tie in with my McCauley ancestors. If that is the case, I would say that it is likely that this branch of the Robinsons will also be somehow connected to my Robinsons of Ballyalbana and Ballycor. I am still working on finding the connections which has proved to be time consuming. Once again, thanks for all researchers input and output.
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Thanks for your input, aghadowey. I looked over what I had put and what you wrote, and there really wasn't that much of a difference except that I had omitted Susan. ...
It seems as though you didn't read carefully enough :-\ but to make it clearer here's a comparision of the children you posted with details I added in red-
Thomas Robinson, b. abt. 1876; m. 1904 to Sarah Service, dau of William Service.
1. Thomas Robinson (2 May 1873-25 Feb.1957) m.(12 July 1904) Sarah Service
2. James Beggs Robinson (27 July 1874-dy)
3. Henry Robinson (1 May 1876-10 Mar.1883).
James Beggs Robinson, b. abt. 1880; died around 1960; m. 1910 to Isabella (Bella) Burns
4. James Beggs Robinson (8 Oct. 1878-c1960), carpenter, m.(9 Dec.1910) Isabella “Bella” Burns (d.c1958)
5. Son (17 Sept.1880)- Peggy supplied his name in later post
Henry (Harry) Robinson, b. abt. 1883; m. 1909 Martha Alice Montgomery of Rashee; married in Canada
6. Henry Robinson (11 Mar. 1883) m.(1909 Canada) Martha Alice Montgomery- more details posted later
Jane (Jennie) Robinson, b. abt. 1886; m. Robert Burns
7. Jane/Jennie Robinson (25 May 1885) m.(29 Aug.1913) Robert Burns
8. Daughter (19 Feb.1888)
9. Susan Beggs Robinson (8 Apr.1890-28 May 1890)
William Robinson, b. abt. 1891
10. William Robinson (2 July 1891-aft.1911)
So, as well as giving 4 more children besides Susan that were not in your list I have given birthdates, etc.
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Aghadowery, no, I read your response carefully enough; it is that I usually don't bother much with children who died young or with adults who died unmarried. Dead lines don't offer much value to basic family research. I also just usually just go for the year an event happened and cut the day and month. Sorry for my lack of exactness, but.....
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I've never heard of someone researching their family who leaves out 'children who died young or with adults who died unmarried' ::)
Added- just to emphasise the importance of full details take these 2 sons-
2. James Beggs Robinson (27 July 1874-dy)
4. James Beggs Robinson (8 Oct. 1878)
Eldest registered as James Beggs but younger as Beggs although he later went by James Beggs. It would be easy enough to find the earlier birth and assume it was for the surviving child.
Ignoring exact dates also omits details which might go unnoticed such as-
3. Henry Robinson (1 May 1876-10 Mar.1883).
Birth: Henry (1 May 1876) https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FRQ9-CYF
Note: brother Henry born day after he died.
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Hello,
Looking at previous post, there is a first James Beggs Robinson born in 1874-dy. What does the dy mean? Obviously, he died before the second James Beggs Robinson was born.
Peggy
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Hello,
Looking at previous post, there is a first James Beggs Robinson born in 1874-dy. What does the dy mean? Obviously, he died before the second James Beggs Robinson was born.
Peggy
dy= died young
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I was guessing that was what it stood for. Thanks
Peggy