RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Bedfordshire => England => Bedfordshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: KEOS on Tuesday 02 June 15 19:35 BST (UK)
-
Hello,
I'm looking for information on a Phillip Sykes, born in Nether Dean. I believe he married a woman called Mary Bayes in Rushden, Northamptonshire in 1723, but I know very little else about him. Any information on his family in Nether Dean would he hugely appreciated.
:)
-
The excellent site http://www.rushdenheritage.co.uk/ shows no such marriage in Rushden. Are you sure you're not confusing it with a 1723 marriage in Rushden between Philip Bayley and Martha Freeman?
If the marriage place and date are wrong it would tend to affect the baptisms in Dean of a Philip Sykes, which you'll find on the IGI at www.familysearch.org, ie if he married in 1723 he wouldn't be the Philip Sykes baptised in 1712 unless it was a very late baptism.
-
It was actually on the Rushden Heritage site that I found the marriage. At the bottom of this page here: http://www.rushdenheritage.co.uk/Villages/registers/hf-M1715-1723.html
(Though technically it took place in Higham Ferrers not Rushden)
-
No technically about it! It did take place in Higham Ferrers.
Because you said it took place in Rushden I took you at your word. But you can still check Dean baptisms and marriages at www.familysearch.org, and for burials the index on www.findmypast.co.uk Perhaps he was a widower, and is one of the older baptisms in Dean. There were two Philip Sykes burials in Dean post 1723, in 1727 and 1731. Either, or neither, could be your Philip. Perhaps he's the Philip half of Philip and Dorothy who baptised children in Dean. Dorothy was buried in Dean in 1714. I can't see that Philip and Mary baptised any children in Dean, so perhaps it was a later in life marriage.
-
Sorry about the confusion. During my research Higham Ferrers and Rushden often seem interchangeable in the records. I should have been more specific. But thanks for all your help bedfordshire boy, I really appreciate it.
-
From Dean PRs....
Philip (1) & Jane Sykes baptised 9 children between 1673 & 1688 including son Philip in 1677. Wife Jane was buried 1695 & Philip in 1704. Beds Archives have the will of Philip Sykes, miller of Nether Dean ref ABP/W 1704-5/34.
Philip (2) & Dorothy baptised 3 children 1708 to 1712 including Philip 1708 buried 1708 & 2nd Philip in 1711/12. Wife Dorothy was buried in 1714. He most likely married an Anne as there are 2 children of Philip & Anne baptised 1716 to 1719. Philip was buried 1727. Again Beds Archives have the will of Philip Sykes, miller of Nether Dean ref ABP/W 1728/4.
There's an Admon ref ABP/A 1732/4 for Philip Sykes (3), senior miller of Dean at Beds Archives and this is for the Philip Sykes buried 3 Apr 1731, son of Philip & Dorothy Sykes. If this is the one baptised 1712 he'd be 21. And if he's senior where's Philip junior?
There are no children baptised to Philip & Mary at Dean post 1723. The Rushden site has burial of Mary Sykes, widow at Higham Ferrers on 25 Oct 1740. So where/when did her Philip die.
It'd be good to see the wills & admon at Beds Archives to see if they give more details
Cheers
John
-
John, There's a marriage of Philip Sykes and Ann Smith at Thurleigh on 20 Feb 1714, which on the face of it pre-dates the burial of Dorothy on 13 Jul 1714. But if the marriage date is the old calendar on the IGI then it becomes 20 Feb 1715 in the modern calendar, so the chronology works.
I'll be in Bedford on the 11th and 12th. Another funeral pm 11th. Booked the flight 20 mins ago. Fancy a beer or curry?
-
John, There's a marriage of Philip Sykes and Ann Smith at Thurleigh on 20 Feb 1714, which on the face of it pre-dates the burial of Dorothy on 13 Jul 1714. But if the marriage date is the old calendar on the IGI then it becomes 20 Feb 1715 in the modern calendar, so the chronology works.
The Thurleigh marriage on 20 Feb 1714/15 is Philip Sykes of Dean to Ann Smith - it don't say he's a widower, but it is after burial of Dorothy on 13 July 1714
-
From will of Philip Sykes, miller of Nether Dean 1704/5 dated 8 Aug 1704
.... to my daughter Sarah Glover, to son John Sykes, to daughter Hannah, to son James, to daughter Mary... sums of money to have when they reach age 21.
.... to my eldest son Philip Sykes my mill house, lands & closes....
From will of Philip Sikes, the elder, miller of Nether Dean 1728 dated 21 Nov 1727
.... to my son Philip Sikes the house & tenement in which I now dwell, my mill & close adjoining, paying out of the estate the sum of £3 a year to my now wife Mary for rest of her natural life...
.... to my daughter Dorothy Sikes £40 to be paid when age 21 plus gold ring which was her own mothers
.... to my son Thomas Sikes £40 when 21
.... to daughter Jane Sikes £40 when 21 plus a gold ring which was her mothers
Appoint Philip Sikes, sole executor & nominate brother John Sikes & Thomas Fox, both of Nether Dean, trustees & guardians for son Philip until age 21
Proved 31 Aug 1728 by brother John Sikes
From Admon for Philip Sykes, senior, miller of Dean 1732
... bondsman John Sykes guardian & curator assigned to Thomas Sykes & Jane Sykes natural children of Philip Sykes, late of Nether Dean, miller; lawful brother & sister of Philip Sykes, junior
So this Mary must be 3rd wife of Philip Sykes - be good have death/burial of 2nd wife Ann
-
So this Mary must be 3rd wife of Philip Sykes - be good have death/burial of 2nd wife Ann
From Beds FHS paper Bedfordshire Strays...
Anne Sykes - The Miller's wife (BTs wife of Philip) of Dean.......
....... buried 15 Feb 1718-19 as per Covington, Hunts PR
It'd be good to get some feedback from you KEOS
-
Sorry about the late reply. Thank you for all the research you've done JohnP, it's really helpful and definitely very interesting! Ultimately what I'm trying to do is find a link between the Philip Sykes who married Mary Bayes in Higham Ferrers in 1723 and a later generation of Sykes' who lived in Higham Ferrers and were having children in the 1770s. This later generation starts with John Sykes and his wife Fanny/Frances Sykes (possibly nee Fisher) who had lots of children there in the 1770s and 80s. I could find no baptism record for John in Rushden or a marriage between him and Fanny there, and before him there are no Sykes' mentioned in the Higham Ferrers records except Philip Sykes in 1723. So it would seem that they moved there from somewhere else.
It may be that there is no connection between Philip and John but it seems coincidental that there were no Sykes' in Higham Ferrers before he appeared and then after him lots start popping up in the area. I believe his wife Mary Bayes also returned there to be buried in 1740. Since John's first child was born in 1774, and people got married quite young back then, I've been working under the assumption that he was born around the early 1750s. Have you come across anyone called John Sykes in Philip's family that might have been born around that time? I believe John's wife Fanny was born in Bromham, Beds, where there is a marriage in 1773 between a John Sykes and Fanny Fisher.
Thanks again for your help with all this! :)
-
Is it just coincidence that a John & Fanny/Frances Sykes baptised 14 (plus another 2 buried that have no baptism) children at Higham Ferrers from Feb 1774 through to Mar 1792 and also buried 10 of them (plus another that must have been) following the marriage of John Sykes to Fanny Fisher at Bromham on 13 April 1773 - how convenient?
The Bromham PR marriage says John Sykes was of Stagsden and this is the only Sykes name in both Bromham & Stagsden apart from the banns read at Stagsden on 4 Feb 1773. Also I cannot find a baptism of a Fanny/Frances Fisher in Bromham - as Frances Sykes was buried in HF on 30 Apr 1826 aged 84 then she'd be born c.1742.
However there are 2 baptisms at nearby Biddenham on 23 July 1744 of Elizabeth & John, children of Thomas & Mary Sykes. This might be the John?
The United Brethren (Moravian church) records the birth/baptisms of children of Thomas & Mary Sykes of Biddenham - Mary 1747, Abraham 1749, Isaac 1756 & Sarah 1762. It also records a burial of 'stillborn' Sykes son of Thomas & Mary Sykes, died at Biddenham in 1755. It has burial of Mary Sykes age 50 married died 1766 at Stagsden, then the subsequent marriage on 3 Mar 1767 at St.Cuthberts, Bedford of Thomas Sykes, farmer of Stagsden to Mary Gummer. St.Cuthberts PR also has the marriage where Thomas is widower of Stagsden to Mary Gammer is widow, by licence.
Moravian burial record in April 1777 of Thomas Sykes age 66 married, died 29 Apr 1777 at Bedford of the smallpox "his corpse being in total putrefaction, he was buried privately in the night" He was buried St.Pauls Bedford on 1 May 1777. Beds Archives has the will of Thomas Sykes, yeoman of Stagsden ref ABP/W 1777/15 - it'd be good to see this in case it mentions son John of Higham Ferrers. Second wife Mary Sykes has Moravian burial 9 Dec 1810 being widow aged 88 died 6 Dec at Bedford.
Prior to all of this perhaps Thomas Sykes married first wife Mary Negus of Oakley on 29 Apr 1738 at Ravensden and baptised first child Alice there on 8 Apr 1739. This ties in well with the Moravian records having baptisms of children of Philip & Susan/nah Sykes of Ravensden between 1748 & 1759 plus a 2nd marriage for Philip to Mary Rodes in May 1766 at St.Pauls Bedford
Enough for now
Cheers John
-
The names Thomas and Mary fits well with the naming traditions of the Sykes' I'm looking for. John Sykes in Higham Ferrers had a son called Thomas, who had a son called Thomas, who had a son called John Thomas. John Sykes of HF also seems to have given his children names which match up with those of his potential brothers and sisters (including Abraham, Sarah, Mary and Elizabeth). I've noticed families often repeat the same names over and over again so that is a good sign. Is there a way to get a look at the will of Thomas Sykes to see if he mentions a John Sykes in Higham Ferrers? I'm not sure of the procedure for looking at these records.
Also, how is it that Philip and Susan/nah from Ravensden are linked to Thomas and Mary?
Thanks,
KEOS
-
Starting off, on 24 July 1741 Philip Sykes of Ravensden married Susannah Hains at St.Peters Bedford
Burial on 11 Mar 1742 at Ravensden of Thomas, infant son of Philip Sykes
At Ravensden, Philip & Susannah Sykes baptised Hannah 1743/44 & Susannah 1746
Subsequent Moravian baptisms of children of Philip & Susan Sykes of Ravensden from 1748 to 1759
Daughter Hannah buried 30 Apr 1756 at Ravensden aged 12 & upwards
Susannah Sykes, wife of Philip was buried Ravensden on 12 Nov 1763. The Moravian records say she was aged 49 & died on 10 Nov.
Philip Sykes widower of Ravensden then married Mary Rhodes, spinster on 27 May 1766 at St.Pauls, Bedford. Moravian records say he's a farmer of Ravensden & she is from Dublin
Philp Sykes buried 18 June 1768 aged 59, married; died 16 June at Bedford.
From the Beds HRS vol 68 The Moravian Church in Bedford there's an inference that Thomas & Philip Sykes are brothers, originating from Ravensden & then Thomas goes to Biddenham.
They could be sons of John & Ann Sykes of Ravensden.... John Sykes, widower of Ravenden age 67 was buried Bedford St.Peters on 2 Sept 1750. Ravensden PR has burial of Ann, wife of John Sykes on 2 May 1744. Based on date of burial & age at burial Thomas Sykes was born c.1711 & Philip Sykes born c.1709. looking for marriage of John Sykes to Ann ? then around <1708
-
John & Ann Sikes/Sykes were baptising children at Thurleigh.....
Philip 21 Aug 1709
Thomas 9 Mar 1711-12
Alice 17 Sept 1714
John 19 May 1717
Ann 7 Sept 1718
+ burial of blank daughter of John Sykes on 4 Jun 1720
Beds Archives ref MO4/1/7
Thomas Sykes farmer born Thurleigh 21 Mar 1711, received 18 Feb 1744/45, admitted 2 Jun 1745, restored after marriage Mar 1767 departed this life 29 Apr 1777 (this is him of Stagsden at death)
Beds Archives ref MO4/3/8
John Sykes born Nether Dean 1 Nov 1683 (NB son of Philip & Jane)
received 20 May 1747
admitted 19 Apr 1748
went home (ie.died) 1750
-
cross-reference .... link to same family on Northants board
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=722010.0
-
OK ..... the will of Thomas Sykes late of Stagsden but now of Bedford, Yeoman, signed & dated 18 June 1774, witnessed by John Martin Sykes & proved 19 May 1777 on the oath of executors & trustees Simon Trapp, lace dealer & Negus Easton, carpenter, both of Bedford.
.... to my dear wife Mary sum of £100 to be paid within 6 months of my decease and also all my household goods & furniture
.... to my youngest daughter Sarah Sykes the sum of £25 to be invested in securities to provide a legacy she can have when she reaches age 21
.... to my brother John Sykes such wearing apparel that executors think proper
.... all the rest & residue of my estate goes to my seven children, viz... John, Abraham, Isaac, Alice, Mary, Anna Maria & the said Sarah
So from birth/baptisms of children of Thomas & Mary Sykes of Biddenham
This is first wife Mary Negus of Oakley married at Ravensden on 29 Apr 1738
She's buried 23 Jun 1766 (Moravian) age 50
Wife Mary is Mary Gummer who Thomas married 3 Mar 1767 at St.Cuthberts
She died 6 Dec 1810 at Bedford (Moravian) aged 88
John baptised 23 Jul 1744 at Biddenham
Abraham born 17 Dec 1749, baptised 22 Dec 1749 (Moravian)
Isaac born 3 May 1756, baptised 3 May 1756 (Moravian)
Alice baptised 8 Apr 1739 at Ravensden
Mary born 16 Nov 1747, baptised 2 Dec 1747 (Moravian)
Anna Maria ? not seen her mentioned before
Sarah born 5 Oct 1762, baptised 13 Oct 1762 (Moravian)
? so where's Elizabeth baptised 23 July 1744 Biddenham
Conclusion .... John Sykes who married Fanny Fisher at Bromham is most likely son of Thomas & Mary Sykes, originally from Ravensden, then of Biddenham & then Stagsden.... but there's nothing that proves these are the couple baptising children at Higham Ferrers, but it is very likely.
-
Thanks for looking that up John.
Not sure who Anna Maria is. Perhaps that's another name for Elizabeth? Though it seems like quite an unusual name, especially in comparison with the names of the rest of the family.
My next step to confirm whether John Sykes and Fanny Fisher were the ones living in Higham Ferrers might be to look for the will of the HF John. If I'm lucky he might mention the same brothers and sisters that Thomas Sykes mentions in his will.
Hopefully someone on the Northamptonshire RootsChat forum will have access to the county will records.