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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: penpen64 on Monday 25 May 15 16:24 BST (UK)
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Can anyone help??
My Great Grandmothers brother was one ALFRED LAURENCE DUCE born 1881 District of Orsett.
In 1901 he was single/living with his mother and brothers in Stifford Road, South Ockenden. The family were now spelling the surname Douce.
Cannot find him in 1911 or a death certificate for Alfred L Duce.
I do however have one for an Alfred Lawrence Douce 1937 with an age of 56 years which fits.
The informant was a son.....looks like S.L.DOUCE.
Sent off for a birth certificate for S L DOUCE and the father was named as a WALTER LAWRENCE DOUCE married to Jeannie Ling. Very confused. Am I barking up the wrong tree? Alfred had a brother called Walter so he can't have been Walter too? Any help most grateful :)
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Actually, strange as it seems, there could have been two brothers both with the same name in one family. Not common but it does happen.
Pheno
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This is a strange one - is this the family with Walter in 1891? If so, where is Alfred?
RG12; Piece: 1375; Folio: 23; Page: 21
Eliza A Duce 53
William Duce 31
Charles Duce 19
Edward Duce 14
Henry Duce 12
Walter Duce 9
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S L Douce looks like Stanley Laurence Douce b 1908, Leigh on Sea, Essex.
His parents are Walter Laurence b 1882 and Jane (Jeannie from you and Jennie in m records) b 1880 in Shoeburyness Essex. Two more children Charles Walter b 1910, and William Patrick 1911.
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This is a strange one - is this the family with Walter in 1891? If so, where is Alfred?
RG12; Piece: 1375; Folio: 23; Page: 21
Eliza A Duce 53
William Duce 31
Charles Duce 19
Edward Duce 14
Henry Duce 12
Walter Duce 9
1901
Eliza 62
William 41
Charles 29
Edward 24
Henry 22
Alfred 19
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So it looks as if Walter and Alfred are the same person. I can't find a birth of a Walter Duce/Douce in 1881 or 1882.
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Think on the 1891 census a mistake was possibly made....
Henry Duce was christened Walter Henry and therefore the enumerator? had the name Walter in his mind when he should have written Alfred?
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There's a Walter Henry aged 32 born 1879 Bulvan Essex, living in South Ockenden with his brother John William aged 52 b 1859 both farm labourers. (You will have to look it up not sure about the rules on this census).
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Walter Henry Duce was born 1879
Alfred Laurence Duce born 1881
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So if that is correct, it still doesn't solve the problem of Alfred Laurence/ Walter Lawrence. ::)
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I know....very confusing!
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I can't find a death of a Walter either.
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1881 (to try and piece names of use) RG11 / piece 1755/folio 35/ page 2
William Duce 47 b 1834
Eliza A 43 b 1838 Downham
John W 21 1860
George W 17 1864
Arthur S 14 1867
Mary Ann E 12 1869
Edward C 9 1872
Sarah A 7 1874
Edward J 5 1876
Walter H 2 1879
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The 1937 newspaper reports about the sudden death of Alfred Douce, Caulfield Rd, Shoeburyness give his occupation as Railway Guard.
Have you checked the 1911 Census for Walter Laurence Douce and occupation?
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I have the death cert for Alfred L Douce which states cause of death s acute heart failure.
On birth certificate for Stanley Lawrence Douce his father "WALTER LAWRENCE DOUCE" was a .......Railway Guard!!!
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More frustratingly I cannot find Walter,Stanley or Jeannie/Jennie on the 1911 census!
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STANLEY LAWRENCE DOUCE was born at 3 Bailey Road,Leigh although his mother was resident at 20 Friar Street, Shoeburyness?
Also born 17 Oct 1907 and birth not registered until 29 Nov?
Anything unusual there?
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There's a Walter Laurence Douce on the 1911 Census - cannot post details.
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STANLEY LAWRENCE DOUCE was born at 3 Bailey Road,Leigh although his mother was resident at 20 Friar Street, Shoeburyness?
Also born 17 Oct 1907 and birth not registered until 29 Nov?
Anything unusual there?
It depends whether that address was a private house or a hospital/nursing home.
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Thanks groom for the message...
Not sure what to think. Could it be one and the same person?
I will keep on investigating :)
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To summarise we have:
Two births - Walter Henry born 1879 and Alfred Lawrence born 1881
1881 census we have Walter H born 1879
1891 census we have Henry born 1879 and Walter born 1881
1901 census we have Henry born 1879 and Alfred born 1881
1907 we have Walter Laurence marriage
1907 birth of Stanley Laurence Douce father Walter Laurence
1911 census we have a Walter Laurence born about 1881
1937 we have death of Alfred Laurence registered by Stanley Laurence son.
What a puzzle!!! It almost sounds as if Alfred adopted his brother's name for some reason.
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Completely baffled ???
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I've just found a couple of entries on the WWI Service Medal and Award Rolls, 1914-1920. Unfortunately there don't seem to be any service records though.
Alfred Douce - Royal Engineers 197893
Walter Henry Douce - Labour Corp 60918
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' Tis indeed a puzzle!
The two Edwards on the '81 Census are also a puzzle - Edward C aged 9 and Edward J aged 5.
These may be -
Edward Charles, Dec 1871, Chelmsford, 4a 203
Edward James, Mar 1876, Orsett, 4a 220
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Edward James Douce born 1876 died 1930 Orsett
Edward Charles Douce died 24th August 1949 Essex
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S L Douce looks like Stanley Laurence Douce b 1908, Leigh on Sea, Essex.
His parents are Walter Laurence b 1882 and
Jane (Jeannie from you and Jennie in m records) b 1880 in Shoeburyness Essex.
Two more children Charles Walter b 1910, and William Patrick 1911.
Walter Laurence Douce is a railway guard b Bulphan. Living in Cambridge Road, Shoeburyness.
No wonder you're baffled ! ???
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The 1937 newspaper reports about the sudden death of Alfred Douce, Caulfield Rd, Shoeburyness give his occupation as Railway Guard.
Have you checked the 1911 Census for Walter Laurence Douce and occupation?
See previous post. It's all a bit of a merry go round with their names.
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It all almost points to Alfred adopting the name of Walter doesn't it? Odd though that he may have married as Walter Laurence but died as Alfred Laurence. What a pity that Stanley Laurence Douce died in 1977 as he might have been able to answer a few questions.
It doesn't look as if Stanley or his brother William married, but Charles W Douce married Marjorie Goss in 1931 Rochford. There were two children from that marriage, one in 1931 and one in 1936.
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From 1891 EDWARD C became CHARLES EDWARD and EDWARD remained as he was :-\
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Don't want to get anyone in trouble but why can't I find the 1911 census info that others have found? ???
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I can only see it on FindMyPast, Ancestry doesn't seem to have it for some reason unless it's been transcribed incorrectly.
ADDED: If you are using Ancestry, it's been transcribed as Dover! Try looking for Stanley Lawrence born 1907.
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Thank you groom!
Going to send off for the marriage cert for this WALTER LAWRENCE DOUCE to see if I can confirm if he is one and the same as my ALFRED LAURENCE DOUCE :)
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The mystery deepens, as I've just found a probate record for WALTER HENRY DOUCE
Died 2nd September 1957 at Rosemary Park Road, Wivenhoe, Essex. Probate granted to Clifford Douce (hairdresser) effects £2406.3s.1d
However, the death registration on Freebmd is:
Deaths Sep 1957
DOUCE Wallis H 78 Colchester 4a 436
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Yes I have that too!
According to records I have found Walter Henry married Rose Maud Marshall in 1919.
She died in 1952, also leaving effects to Clifford Douce.
Was Clifford their son....I don't know!
Looking for the birth of a Clifford Douce the only one I could find was in 1926, Glanford Brigg.
I sent off for it and it stated the mother as being Sybil Douce a domestic servant. However a letter came with it stating that the birth had been re-registered under the Legitimacy Act 1926 on 9th May 1929. Make of that what you will!!
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from freebmd
June Quarter 1927
Sybil Douce married Arthur Cook
Lincoln district, vol 7a, page 1485
Birth
Mar, 1904, Glanford B, 7a, 680
Sybil Douce
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I think you're going to have to trace each of the family - see the 1881 below, and see where they lead.
William Duce 47 b 1834
Eliza A 43 b 1838 Downham
John W 21 1860
George W 17 1864
Arthur S 14 1867
Mary Ann E 12 1869
Edward C 9 1872
Sarah A 7 1874
Edward J 5 1876
Walter H 2 1879
In 1911 Sybil is with mother Mary b 1875 - so someone Douce married a Mary. FindMyPast is playing up so only can look on the free 1911 search.
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I think there are two families here with similar names.
In 1901 Sybil's family
Walter Douce 30 - 1871 b Blyton Lincolnshire
Mary A 27, 1874, Blyton Lincolnshire
Percival F, 2, 1899, Corringham Lincs
Reginald 0, 1901, Hillsborough Yorks
You may have to have a look at the Lincs family as well
1871 census (FindMyPast) edit: living in Blyton
John Douce 42, 1829, pob NK, lab machinist
Jane 43, b Goxhill (looks like)
Samuel 9 b Goxhill
Mary Jane 6 b Blyton Lincs
Clara 4 b Massingham
Fred 2 b Blyton
Walter 7 mths b Blyton
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It is all quite a mystery!
???
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Just a bit more info for everyone who tried to help with the Douce mystery..
The marriage cert for WALTER LAWRENCE gave his father as William Douce, the same as ALFRED LAWRENCE. W L was 26 yrs when married, putting his birth at c 1881, the same as ALFRED.
On the 1911 census it states Bulphan as the birthplace of WALTER, the same as ALFRED.
His eldest child was STANLEY LAWRENCE, who was the informant on ALFREDS death cert!!
Beginning to think for reasons we may never know ALFRED L and WALTER L are one and the same! Cannot find a WALTER LAWRENCE born in 1881 or a death :-\
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Forgot...both were Railway Guards.
One final similarity is that WALTER married a JENNIE LING from Eastwood.
Well, ALFREDS brother EDWARD CHARLES married a FLORENCE LING also from Eastwood.
Both LING girls mentioned had a father called George.
Highly possible for two brothers to marry two sisters in a short space of time!
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Certainly looks like the same chap.