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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Aberdeenshire => Topic started by: Austin De Brou on Monday 13 April 15 23:35 BST (UK)
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I am attaching a crop of an image to illustrate my question. It comes from the 1861 Census for Fraserburgh. You will note the , perhaps familiar, Braeheads, but also "John Nobles Lane" Now I have a John Noble (Bobbins) who passed away in 1865, married to an Ann Sim, resident then (1865) in Shore Street. Which appears to me to be something that Braeheads is a part of, or vice versa. I can find no evidence of a John Nobles Lane and so wonder if the enumerator spontaneously started naming rows, lanes and such after noted inhabitants (In this case for their age perhaps.)
Just above we can see "Robert Ritchie's Close", although no Robert Ritchie at the address there...
I'm lost folks ???, does anyone know the answer? Is there even a cogent question in there? :)
warm regards to cousins, extended family, and all others,
Austin
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It could be very much like now. The person the lane/road was named after is long dead but the lane/road name goes on. Occasionally you get remnants of the family still living there and due to naming patterns the names match.
This could explain why a person of the family surname is not living in the road.
It might not be arbitary at all :)
Roads also dissapear and get renamed btw
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Lanes and closes running off streets were often called after someone who lived there, was first to build there or had property there. These names often changed over the years.
You might find a large-scale 19th century map of Fraserburgh on the (free) National Library of Scotland maps website. If you click on "Series Maps", you will get access to large-scale Ordnance Survey maps, which you should try first.
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Have you checked Page 1 of the census which should give you the enumerator's route? Agree with the previous posters that I think it is just a coincidence that the road names tie in with your family names.
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Hi, I haven't checked the enumerator page, (think that would cost more on Scotlandspeople), but I'm happy to go with coincidence. What is confusing me is whether this is the John Noble who died in 1865, resident at Shore Street, husband of an Ann Sim. It seems likely, although there is an age disparity of a handful of years. I do know that a furious court battle raged after he passed away (John Bobbins Noble, that is, reported as 80 years old at death in 1865) between one of his surviving sons and a grandson of 'disputed' legitimacy. An age of 76 would make sense given the other census ages for 1851 and 1841, making a death in 1865 at age 80 plausible, and I think that Ann Sim was a couple of years older than John, so she could have been 78 in 1861, but 86 for both of them is confusing me further. Of course this could be another John and Ann Noble of approximately similar ages at a most proximate address.
I have also consulted street maps. (aren't they gorgeous?!) With no luck, except to determine that Braeheads does run on from Shore Street.
Thank you all folks,
austin
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Like you I have looked at several maps but not been able to find those specific street names although I did find Shore St and Braeheads. Smaller streets in the vicinity are not named on any of the maps I viewed.
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I have examined more closely a copy of the 1865 Valuation records which MAY assist.
Please tell me what you think. About the attached record I can say this: they seem to jump around. That is between 3 Braeheads and number 4 we find an address in Duke Street, then 4 Braeheads then Fishcross Street then Broad Street, Braeheads again and so on. The organisation seems not to follow a path as much as it correlates to ownership. So John Bobbins Noble has his properties listed then the widow's Noble, then William Noble "Bildie", Mariner, Then William Noble, a draper of Broad St, and so on.
So far as I can tell the neighbouring houses on the 1861 Census with Widow's in them (Barbara Noble 46 in 1861 and next door Elizabeth Noble 51 in 1861) both Braeheads could match with the 1865 No's 2 & 3 Braeheads. Making them, respectively Barbara, widow of John Noble, and Elizabeth, widow of Peter Noble.
I have checked John "Bobbins" Noble's sons, and he did have a son John, who predeceased him, but in 1862 (at sea, off the coast of Africa, from all that I can tell.) So neither this John, or Peter, were his sons. Neither were the widows his daughters, which doesn't preclude their being related, of course, but doesn't enable me to narrow them down yet.
Enjoy the handwriting.
Austin
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If you have a look on Freecen you'll see a John Noble's Close showing on the 1851 census. There are 21 people living at the address which definitely does not look like one of Fraserburgh's more salubrious addresses.
Jen
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Hey Jen,
Close not Lane? I'll take a look. I'm not mad, it does say John Noble's Lane in the image I have above right?
warm regards,
Austin
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Austin, I fear investigating Nobles should carry a health warning!! In 1851 it's John Noble's Close not Lane but if you 'walk' through the households you'll see that it appears to be positioned between Braehead and Kirkbrae. By the way, I can find none of these places on the late 19th century map at NLS ::). Maybe they were just known locally by these names? In Dundee there was a place called the Hennie Parkie I'm sure that never appeared on any map but if you lived in the West End of Dundee you'd know exactly where it was.
Jen