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Research in Other Countries => Europe => Topic started by: jila on Sunday 22 March 15 17:22 GMT (UK)
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Help Please Can't seem to find a death record for Ingeborg Jensdatter
She was born abt Feb 1786- baptized 3 Feb 1786- Haugere Jevnaker Hadeland Oppland Norway
Father: Jens Christensen & mother : Gunild Jensdatter
3 Husbands:
Anders Iversen Olimbdahlen- 2 sons- Henrich and Iver
Peder Gulbrandsen-( did not marry)- one daughter- Anna
Brynild Olsen- 5 children- only 2 sons survived childhood from this marriage-Ole & Jens
Ingeborg possible died between 1828-1865- cant seem to see her on the 1865 Census?
Can anyone help me ? I could not find a Forum for Norway ?? Perhaps there should be a New Forum?
Thanks in advance for your kindness
Jila
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Hi Jila
Do you know the whereabouts of Jens, Ole and Brynild Olsen in 1865?
Ian
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Brynild Olsen - I have he died March 1834- Halvorsrud Olimb Hadeland Oppland Norway
Son- Ole- born in Olimbeie Jevnaker Norway-died 1871- Bratvoldseie Jevnaker Norway( I think)- on 1865 Census- but no Ingeborg with him
Son- Jens-Born 1825-Olimbeie Jevnaker Norway- died 1892- Bratvoldseie Jevnaker - on 1865 & 1875 census but no Ingeborg showing with him either?
The last child I have for Ingeborg & Brynild- was Gulbrand -Birth abt 13 Oct 1828 in Olimbeie Jevnaker Norway ..Death abt 19 Aug 1829 in Olimbeie Jevnaker Norway
It is possible Ingeborg could have died between 1828 and 1865
Jila
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Hi
Thanks.
Looking at his death record from 1834 in Jevnaker and if I see it right (my Norwegian isn't that good) I think it says "huusmann(d) under Östre Olem".
Comparing to other records in the book the minister sometimes wrote "enkemann" meaning widow. I think then if Brynild was a widow it would then have said "enkemann".
So perhaps Ingeborg was alive in 1834.
Have you gone through all the records one-by-one?
Ian
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Hi Ian,
Many thanks for your help :) I will go back to the Records and take another look..Sometimes it is hard to make out the writing on the old records.(for me anyways)
If she was alive in 1834- then I will look from 1834-1965..someone had 1855-but I couldnt find any record that year.
I am also looking for 3 brothers of my GG grandmother Karen Nilsdatter- she was born 3 July 1836 in Fiskaretorpet Norra Skane By Parish Varmland Sweden . moved to Hurum in 1855 and married Johan Amundsen in Eidsvold 1865 died in Oslo-15 March 1905..
Her brothers were :
Olaf-Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs Varmland Sweden,
Nils- 11 nov 1843 in Huggenas Parish Varmland Sweden ,
Anders 21 Feb 1850 in Östra Uggelsäter, Huggenäs Varmland Sweden
Johnnes 12 April 1853 in Huggenas Parish Varmland Sweden -10 June 1923 in Östra Glänne Frykerud parish Värmland Sweden
=============================================
All the brothers immgrated to the USA or Canada..Johannes took the surname Tornqvist stayed in Worcester Mass USA for about 5 yrs then returned to Varmland
Their Parents were :
Nils Ringsfelt Hansson Uggelqvist- Born 18 Aug 1811 in Alster Parish Varmland Sweden -died-1 Nov 1861 in Ostra Uggelsater Huggenas Varmland Sweden
and
Lisa Olofsdotter Uggelqvist- Birth abt 19 Oct 1812 in Kvarntorp, Ny-Huggenäs (S) (Södra Ny Varmland Sweden -Death 19 Oct 1885 in Gillberga Södra Ny Varmland Sweden
They also moved to Hurum Norway abt 1853- but later returned to Varmland.
If I knew where the brothers immigrated to and which surname they used I might have better luck finding them. I recently found some of Johannes family but they dont seem to know about the missing brothers or Karen(kajsa)
I have a little info on the immigrations:
Olof-Nilsson, Olof Drng (unmarried man) b. 7/22/1840 in Huggens, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlan Emigrated 1/27/1860 from Uggelster stra, Huggens, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlto Norge Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 89 Emibas migration file ID: Huggens S 1860 001 This person did go directly to North America.
Nilsson Uggelqvist, Anders Drng (unmarried man) b. 10/6/1850 in Ny, Vrmlands ln (Vrmland Emigrated 8/23/1870 from Lsdrivare, Huggens, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlato Nordamerika
Nilsson Uggleqvist, Nils Drng (man) b. 12/11/1843 in Huggens, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlan Emigrated 11/22/1869 from Vle, Sdra Ny, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlato Nordamerika
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If you can help at all that would be great!
Thanks alot
Jila
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I think I might have found Ingeborg's death record- 4 Nov 1864 hard to read but looks like Halvorsrudeie Jevnaker - buried 12 Nov 1864- Just thought I would let you know :)
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Hi
It could be her but this Ingeborg was 85 years old in 1864, so being born in 1780.
Ian
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Hi
Just found the family in Värmland, Sweden and noticed that the father was a soldier.
Here is his record from the soldier's database:
http://www.ep.liu.se/databases/soldatregister/dbrecord.en.aspx?id=512603
Ian
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Hi Ian,
Yes Nils was a soldier and worked on the famous Canal in Varmland- then retired and moved to Hurum in 1855- but later moved back. he was given the soldier surname Ringsfelt too
It is the 3 sons Olaf, Nils & Anders -that I cant find? I think one or all of them could have moved to Minnesota? But being Johannes lived in Worcester Mass USA- I guess they could have lived there too?
Karen's daughter Caroline Elise- born 1875 married Peter Bernhard Pedersen /Peterson and they immigrated to Averill & Ferlton Minnesota then to Saskatchewan and eventually ended up in Vahalla centre Alberta
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Hi
I have found all 3 brothers in the books upto when they left Sweden. Where did you get the info for the 3 brother's emigrations?
Ian
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I think I receive the info from a Internet helper..But it did not say where they immigrated to? If I knew the State or Province where they went and perhaps a marriage or two that would help.. Looks like two of the brothers left Sweden unmarried.
Canada and the USA and very big countries and there are so many Nils Nilsen, Olaf Nilsen and Anders Nilsen it is difficult to find them :(
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I found out where your internet helper got their info from.
I went through the books to clarify all this and this is what the minister had written:
Anders Nilsson Uggelqvist in Norway left for America 23 Aug 1870
Nils Nilsson Uggelqvist left for America 12 Nov 1869
Olof Nilsson in Norway 27 Jan 1860
I think they all left from Norway as they are not in the swedish database for emigrants.
Ian
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You probably have this:
Johannes Törnqvist (was Uggelqvist) married Anna Lisa Jonsdotter in 1877 and died In 1923.
Family in 1890:
Törnquist, Johannes b. 1853
Jonsdotter, Anna Lisa b. 1847
David Nathanael b. 1879
Karl Jonathan b. 1881
The minister had written that Johannes was living with cobbler Törnvall in the early 1870’s. This I suppose was where he got his new name from.
Apparently Johannes had a deformed right foot.
Ian
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Hi
Just found your other forum threads so I now know how much you know. Just now to find where the 3 brothers ended up.
Ian
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You can take a look on this Norwegian site for passenger lists:
http://www.norwayheritage.com/pasquest.asp?nm=olof&su=nilsen&st=&ye=All
There are a number of Anders , Olofs and Nils Nilsen etc. Remember though that the names were probably spellt as Norwegian names.
Ian
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I have also checked the death databases and found no evidence of the 3 brothers returning to Sweden.
Ian
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Found your tree on Ancestry.
I suppose all the records apart from the Swedish ones are just guesses?
Ian
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Hmmm.. They all left via Norway? Yes I have been trying to find these brothers for some time and yes some of the info on my tree are guesses..
I did find a posting about one of the brothers(forgot which brother?) in Worchester Mass- but the date of birth was not the same -but it seemed to fit for the most part- so temporarily added his wife until I can confirm or eliminate him..
The record you found said this Ole had family ? I think I found the immigration record said he was not married? I did find one possible marriage in Hurum in 1873 to a Maja Greta Andersdtr..But is Olof immigrated in 1860 this would not be him-unless he returned to Hurum and then married?
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This is some Immigrations I found to Quebec:
12534 Oslo 116 1869 April 14 Nils Nilsen m G Arbeider 1843 V.aker Kvebek Norsk Concordia 12535 Oslo 117 1869 April 14 Elise Nilsen f G 1849 V.aker Kvebek Norsk Concordia 12536
Oslo 118 1869 April 14 Matea Ingebretsen f 1848 V.aker Kvebek Norsk Concordia 12537
Oslo 119 1869 April 14 Johannes Nilsen m Arbeider 1850 Elgøy
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Also found this record:
Olaf Nilsson Birth abt 1840 :in Sverrig Destination:Grand Rapids -Date: 22 apr 1873,
Departure: Köpenhamn Database Name: EmiHamn. Occupation/Title:Landmand Archive Call Number:2390 Principal Person:Nilsson Olaf
Jila
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There is no evidence of Olof having a family in Sweden.
I can add though that Nils Ringsfelt Uggelqvist Hansson died by drowning.
Ian
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Wow..Thats is not very nice- after living such a full life- to die at 50yrs old..if you want you can add comments to my tree :) Thanks alot
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Here is his record:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/gr/person/pg00000000978044
and
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NWK2-XYM
He drowned in the Xania Fjord.
His death record is in Östra Uggelsäter, Huggenäs and in Tofte, Hurum.
Ian
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Wow..Thank-you so much for all your help..I didnt know Nils died in Hurum? I thought he returned to Sweden and died there.I guess his wife Lisa returned to Sweden after this death..
I guess Olaf would never have seen his father again if he left for N. America in 1860..
Nils daughter was my GG grandmother Karen ( Kajsa) married in 14 Dec 1863 in Eidsvold to Johan Fredrik Amundsen and they had one daughter Anna Marie 28 June 1865..
I always thought (& was told ) Johan was the father of my G-grandmother Caroline Elise- born 19 July 1875 -June 18, 1876 in Gamle Aker kirke- But according to her baptism record and marriage record apparently her father was Ole Nielsen . Ole was born abt 1847 Hedmarken- address is given as Maridalsveien 84 in 1875
I have all Anna's family info but wish I could find more information about Caroline's father Ole Nielsen & his family too??
Thanks again
Jila
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Wow..Thank-you so much for all your help..I didnt know Nils died in Hurum? I thought he returned to Sweden and died there.I guess his wife Lisa returned to Sweden after this death..
Cheers.
Well, the thing is, is that there is no evidence that Lisa was in Norway. The minister had written that when he was in Norway around 1859 she was living in Ny Parish in Qvarntorpet. It is more likely that Olof was with him as the minister had written that he was in Norway in 1860.
Ian
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Hmmm...Looks like yu are right again..I guess I should learn more Swedish or use the Google Translate more often?
"from helper on internet-: 16, 1856-1860 Huggenäs p . 89 , East Uggelsäter : Lives in New parish, Qvarn croft . Catechetical AI : 17 , 1861-1865 Huggenäs p . 101 , East Uggelsäter : Moving to New Parish Catechetical 1862. AI : 18 , 1866-1870 Southern New p . 102, Kvarntorp : The widow Lisa Olsdotter Uggelqvist , widow 1861 November 1 Catechetical AI : 19, 1871-1875 Southern New p . 101, Kvarntorp : Household 1872. Catechetical AI : 20, 1876-1880 Southern New p . 117, Kvarntorp : Enka Lisa Uggelquist . Moves in 1887 (?) March 5 to p. 228. Catechetical AI : 21 , 1881-1885 Southern New p . 245 , homeless people : Lisa Uggelquist former hut . From Qvarn Croft 1881 March 4th"
Jila
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Looking through the books for evidence of the 3 brothers I found some info you might want to know:
Carl Törnqvist in Worcester, Mass. 1900:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11757-41888-82?cc=1325221
Carl Jonathan Törnqvist married Hanna Persson in Frykeryd Parish 27Dec 1906
Hanna’s parents were Jon Persson b. 8 June 1859 in Vitsand and Maria Jönsdotter b. 4 Sept 1856 Vitsand
There is no evidence of Carl and Hanna going to America.
David Törnqvist went to New York for 2 weeks in 1919 to see a friend Sune Edwall:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:J6W7-Z38
There is no evidence that he returned to America after 1919.
Ian
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That Carl Tornquist on the Census appears to have been born in July 1881-unless I am not reading it right ?
Does it give the parents names on that marriage record?
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That Carl Tornquist on the Census appears to have been born in July 1881-unless I am not reading it right ?
Yes it is July. Carl was born 23 July 1881.
Here is the passenger list with the same name as in the census:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JF1Q-744
Ian
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oh.sorry ...
Yes you mean Johannes son ..I have that family already and contacts too
However they dont seem to know what happened to Johannes 3 Brothers? Nor did they seem to be aware of Karen or Kajsa either..
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Does it give the parents names on that marriage record?
No parents' names but this:
"Both requested betrothal. Proposal proof given by mother and widow Maria Jönsdotter in Sandviken. The man not confirmed (confirmation). The woman not christened."
Ian
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ummmm...
The 3 brothers will be a bit of a problem I'm afraid. We'll see.
Ian
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Yes they are a bit of a puzzle..I thought I found one of them marrying in Hurum- I will double check which one..
Some of the witnesses to my Caroline Elise birth/baptism- I thought could have been Karen's brothers or their wifes ?
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Here is the possible marriage I found for Olof- but it is 1873?Name: Oluf Nilsen
Gender: Male
Age: 32
Birth Date: 1841
Marriage Date: 13 jan 1873
Marriage Place: Hurum, Buskerud, Norway
Father: Nils Hansen
Spouse: Maja Grethe Andersdr
FHL Film Number: 278196
Reference ID: 179-2
=================================
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The interesting thing is that Johannes intended to goto Minneapolis in 1892 but ended up in Massachusetts. I wonder why that was. It must mean that he knew someone there in Minnesota ...... perhaps a brother or two.
Ian
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Yes ,I think there could have been a brother or two in Minnesota--but which one ? What surname did they use Nilsen?Nilsson I guess?
Caroline Elise & Husband & family also came to Minnesota about 1906/07- to Averill and Felton Minn.. Her sister Anna's daughter Asta (Nilsen) Bakke worked on the cruise ships then married and lived on Long Island New York.
Caroline and Peter & family moved again to Saskatchewan Canada about 1911
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Hi
I have some info on Ole's family:
Ole Nilsen’s birth 6 March 1847 Stange:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NH4C-K4W
A number of births which could be Ole’s family from Stange and Hedmark:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01f1e/
Ole Nilsen Lillemor 1910 Census with same birth date married to a Swede:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01036528008621
Nils Olsen and Inger Paulsdatter in Stange 1865:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01038035006694
Hope this helps.
Ian
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Nils and Inge's marriage record:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/vi/person/pv00000002025553
Ian
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Here is the possible marriage I found for Olof- but it is 1873?Name: Oluf Nilsen
Gender: Male
Age: 32
Birth Date: 1841
Marriage Date: 13 jan 1873
Marriage Place: Hurum, Buskerud, Norway
Father: Nils Hansen
Spouse: Maja Grethe Andersdr
I took a wee look at this record and this could be your Olof. Olof and Maja were born in Sweden.
Ian
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Here is a link to the children of Oluf Nilsen and Maja Gretha Andersdotter in Hurum:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01f1g/
Ian
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I have checked the censuses after 1870 and there are no records of this family at all.
So I am sticking my neck out here but there is a Ovidia Nelson born 1872 in Norway with parents Ole and Mary Nelson in county Murray in Minnesota on the 1885 census.
The record is on Ancestry.
Ian
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Hi again,
Well. I dont know anymore ..I tried and tried last night to find anything ? any clue? to these 3 brothers.
Re: Anders- I was always wondering why I had two birth dates for him- one in Feb 1850 and the other in Dec 1850..Finally figured out that I think Anders #1 must have died and then Nils & Lisa had the #2 in Dec 1850 and called him Anders too..(I could be wrong though) I have changed the birth date to 21 Dec 1850 on my tree. I did find this grave record: Looks good -but who knows?
Name: Andrew Nelson
Birth Date: 21 Dec 1850
Death Date: 6 Dec 1936
Cemetery: Woodlawn Cemetery
Burial or Cremation Place: Allouez (Brown County), Brown County, Wisconsin, USA
Has Bio?: N
URL: http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-...
Re: Nils/Nels - so far I have 3 possible wifes for him(lol) I had Christine or Christina before as I think there was a Chistine Nilsen as a witness to Caroline Elises birth or marriage.. Now I also have a Eliza Jane Wilson(?) too.. And an Anna ..I seem to recall on one immigration record record I found before that one of the brother immigrated to Chicago Ill via Quebec..I cant recall if it was Nils or not? ..Eliza was born in Illinois- then her & her Nils- moved to Iowa & later to Nebraska..I think this Nels/Nils died in Nebraska..Of course he could have gone by the name of Gustaf(Gus ) too?
re: Olof/Ole ? I am not sure unless we have more info..But I do think one or more brothers may have lived in Minnesota and that info you found does look promising.
Re: Caroline Elise's father -Ole (born 1847-Hedmarken)- Stange is a possible connection- Caroline's father in law Klaudius Magnus Pedersen was born there in 1831- he went to deaf school in Trondheim and later in Oslo- was trained to be a shoemaker and family story is that he worked for the King? He married Johanne Petronella Jensdatter- born 1846 in Idd Ostfold.. Ole is listed on Caroline's birth & marriage record so I assume he must have been in Oslo at least in 1874-75. But he might have immigrated after that I am not sure? I did have that Ole Nilsen Lillemor as a likely father for Caroline and even put him on my tree but how do I prove it is the right person?
Bye for now
J
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Re: Anders- I was always wondering why I had two birth dates for him- one in Feb 1850 and the other in Dec 1850..Finally figured out that I think Anders #1 must have died and then Nils & Lisa had the #2 in Dec 1850 and called him Anders too..(I could be wrong though)
I took a look in the birth book and there is only one entry for an Anders to Nils and Lisa and he was born 21 Feb 1850.
The minister must have written wrong in the census books.
Ian
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really ? so this information is incorrect then?
Anders Nilsson. Born 21 DEC 1850 in Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:15 1851-1855 p. 92, Östra Uggelsäter). Husförhör AI:18, 1866-1870 Södra Ny p. 102, Kvarntorp: Flyttar till Huggenäs 1866, p.15. Husförhör AI:18, 1866-1870 Södra Ny p. 15 Bredene: Anders Nilsson Uggelqvist, dräng. Flyttat från Ny p. 102 år 1866. Arbetsattest till Norge 1868 Oct. 29.
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The month is wrong but the Anders is right. The census book is wrong just. The minister wrote 12 instead of a 2.
Ian
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Great :(
I did find this Anders/ Andrew Tornquist in Minnesota but it says he was born 1855:
Name: Andrew Tornquist
Age: 40
Census Date: 1895
County: Renville
Locality: Winfield
Birth Location: Sweden
Gender: Male
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1855
Race: White
LINE: 4
Roll: V290_92
wife=Emily
=========================================
there is also a Nels Nelson & Ingebor and family on the previous page
J
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I think we should put energy in Oluf Nilsen and Maja Gretha Andersdotter and family, Nils Oluf and Ovidia Marie.
This family does look promising.
Ian
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I don't believe the other brothers changed their name to Törnqvist. Johannes decided to do just that because, I think, of the shoemaker he was living with at the time.
Ian
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Yes I know he changed his name but you never know :)
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Here is Oluf Nilsen census from 1865 in Hurum:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01038094000170
Ian
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Yes I saw that one too- But I think it said somewhere that he went to Northamerica in 1860- perhaps they thought he did but went to Hurum first then USA
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1885 Census: shows Nels & Mary and Ovida- says they were all born in Norway
Name: Ovidia Nelson
Age: 13
Census Date: 1 May 1885
County: Murray
Locality: Iona
Birth Location: Norway
Gender: Female
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
Race: White
LINE: 24
Roll: MNSC_34
======================
Other siblings listed born in Iowa
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Yes.
If it is them then they probably wrote Norway for the sake of it or something. I just thought that this family fitted nicely.
Ian
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I managed to find the Olof Nilsson’s family. If he is your Olof he then didn’t go to USA.
Olof Nilsson death:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NWNZ-HZB
On the original record the minister wrote “from Sweden, married and living in Röken”.
He fell overboard and drowned.
Maja Gretha Andersdotter new marriage:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/vi/person/pv00000000036097
On the original record the minister wrote “husband sailor Olof Nilsen drowned 23 Nov 1873, buried in Strömsö.”
I couldn’t make out the rest.
Ovidia Marie in Sarpsborg on 1910 Census and married:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01036334008949
It looks as though Ovidia got married in Hurum.
Maja Gretha Andersdotter:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/dp/person/pd00000002080952
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/dp/person/pd00000000534617
Ian
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Hi Ian
Just dont know about this Oluf/Olaf.Interesting he drowned like Nils though.
I did some work on Johannes Nilsson Tornquist wife Anna Lise Jansdotter's family Her sister Sara- married Anders Petter Jansson..
Anders 's sister Anna Married a Nils Gustave Olofsson Holm - they immigrated abt 1879 to Maple Ridge isanti Minnesota and had a very large family there. Perhaps this is another reason the Tornquist were going to come to Minnesota.
Anna appears to have out lived all her children as she lived to be over 100yrs old
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=36342500&ref=acom
Perhaps this might be where the 3 brothers are or were hiding ? Just a thought
J
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Nilsson Uggelqvist, Anders Drng (unmarried man) b. 10/6/1850 in Ny, Vrmlands ln (Vrmland Emigrated 8/23/1870 from Lsdrivare, Huggens, Vrmlands ln (Vrmlato Nordamerika
Just read this again. It says "from Lsdrivare". Well, I looked it up in the book thinking this is not a place and it isn't. A "lösdrivare" is a vagabond, tramp or a hobo.
Which brings the question where did he get the money from? Did he become a sailor and jump ship somewhere?
Ian
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Hi again,
I would think Sailor? Just turned 20 yrs old- possibly his brothers Olof or Nils paid for him?
I did find this one:
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=10953071&ref=acom
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Hi
I traced that Anders earlier in the censuses and am pretty sure it isn't him.
He was quite easy to follow.
Ian
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Yes I dont think it the the right person either..But the date of birth matched the incorrect one that I had..
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It is possible that the brothers could have come to Canada too & perhaps filed for a homestead?
Three possible ones are listed here:
http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/land/land-grants-western-canada-1870-1930/Pages/list.aspx?Names=nilsson&
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Nils daughter was my GG grandmother Karen ( Kajsa) married in 14 Dec 1863 in Eidsvold to Johan Fredrik Amundsen and they had one daughter Anna Marie 28 June 1865..
I always thought (& was told ) Johan was the father of my G-grandmother Caroline Elise- born 19 July 1875 -June 18, 1876 in Gamle Aker kirke- But according to her baptism record and marriage record apparently her father was Ole Nielsen . Ole was born abt 1847 Hedmarken- address is given as Maridalsveien 84 in 1875
I have all Anna's family info but wish I could find more information about Caroline's father Ole Nielsen & his family too??
Hi, I've been trying to work out some of this. From the baptism of Caroline Elise we can see that he is the father and I guess the figures in the final column may be a birth year for Ole, but I cannot see any evidence of where he is from. There is an occupation I think for him, but I cannot make it out. Entry no.174
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=5777&idx_id=5777&uid=ny&idx_side=-181 (http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=5777&idx_id=5777&uid=ny&idx_side=-181)
I think the address is where the family is living, Ole is not necessarily living there at the time. In the 1875 census Karen is living with both her children in Maridalsveien 86
http://gda.arkivverket.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=9&filnamn=f70301&gardpostnr=1885&personpostnr=54155&merk=54155#ovre (http://gda.arkivverket.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&sidenr=9&filnamn=f70301&gardpostnr=1885&personpostnr=54155&merk=54155#ovre)
From Caroline Elise's marriage record we learn that she was confirmed in Fet.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=5818&idx_id=5818&uid=ny&idx_side=-89 (http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=5818&idx_id=5818&uid=ny&idx_side=-89) and that her father is Ole Nilsen. Before his name I think it is written Uegt which is unwed or it could be Ungk short for Ungkarl which means bachelor
The confirmation record is here
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=6243&idx_id=6243&uid=ny&idx_side=-113 (http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=6243&idx_id=6243&uid=ny&idx_side=-113)
Here it states that the mother was married woman and the father a bachelor.
We cannot infer that he is present at the time of the baptism, wedding or confirmation.
To find Ole Nilsen in the 1875 census I would first try and find out what his occupation was to be able to find him. I would recommend contacting the Norwegian Transcription Forum on the Norwegian Digital Archives.
http://arkivverket.no/eng/content/view/full/629 (http://arkivverket.no/eng/content/view/full/629)
If you send the link above and ask them to translate the entry it might help before trawling the unmarried men by the name of Ole Nilsen in the Olso area in 1875 with a birthdate of around 1847.
With regards Karen Nildatter's parentage what makes you think that her father is Nils Hanson?
She was actually married in Olso and not Eidsvold and she gives her father's name as Nils Nilsen.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=662&idx_id=662&uid=ny&idx_side=-467 (http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=662&idx_id=662&uid=ny&idx_side=-467)
You might have to go back to the Swedish records to see if there is a Karen born to a Nils Nilsen in the same time frame. I'm sure there are hundreds of parishes that you might have to search through though!
Good luck
kaysii
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Re: Caroline Elise Olsdatter/ Nilsen/ Amundsen and her mother karen (Kajsa/ Caisa ) Nilsdatter
Birth/baptism record Name: Kajsa Nilsdotter Female Baptism Date:3 Jul 1836 Baptism Place:HUGGENAS, VARMLAND Birth Date: 03 Jul 1836 Father: Nils Hansson Mother Lisa Olofdttr
19 Nov 1855: Moved to Hurum from Varmland- She had a "flyttningsattest" (migration permit) No. 81 from Huggenäs parish..Karen father Nils and some of her brothers also move to Hurum Norway. Brothers were Nils , Olof and Anders- Nilsen- some of them immigrated to the USA or Canada via Norway and some went direct from Sweden.
Nils was a Soldier an worked on the famous canal in Varmland before moving to Norway. I just found out that he died in Hurum in 1861- So perhaps Karen listed her brother Nils on the marriage record?? Otherwise I have no explanation for you..Nils also went by his soldier name Ringsfelt or Uggelquist.
"Nils died by drowning in Hurum Norway.. Link to Death record: http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/kb/gr/person/pg00000000978044 fs website death record: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NWK2-XYM "
Karen was listed as divorced on the 1875 Census- but yet when she was dying - Johan Amundsen asked for permission to re-marry ? This is what an Internet helper told me.. Yet she was listed as a widow on her death record? weird?
"She died March 15, 1905 and was burried from Sagene Church. No 31 bottom half: Permanent sidelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=8089&i... Permanent bildelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20061123340682.... From Dødsfallprotokollen, no 486: Permanent sidelenke: http://arkivverket.no/URN:sk_read/27302/217/ Permanent bildelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-sk20090515340570... ======================================================================== If a woman was married it was common to mention her husband. I guess it was unusual to be divorced so they also mentioned her ex-husband. I'm not able to read everything in Dødsfallprotokollen, but here is what I read: Widow Karen Amundsen 69 years old died today [March 15, 1905] in Østgaardsgt. 6. Leaves behind two grown children. ???? Reported by her daughter Karoline Elise Pettersen Østgaardsgt 2 who informs that the deceased owned nothing. Buried at the Poor-care's expense. I'm not able to read what is written about her ex-husband. Looks like he got a permission to remarry in 1907 --- but Karen was a widow??? Maybe someone else are able to read it?" Maybe you can read it again and see what you see?
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Re: Carolines father Ole Nielsen : Not exactly sure where the information came from - helper told me he was born 1847- hedmarken and he was a stonemason.. I thought it was from her birth record?
Caroline was my G-grandmother
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Hmmm kaysii, you have got me thinking. Some interesting points. I can add though that Caisa Nilsdotter born 3 July 1836 daughter of Nils Hansson Uggelqvist did leave Huggenäs Värmland in 1855 to Hurum according to the minister.
Here is Karen Amundsen in 1865 Census:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01038027040521
Ole's occupation is a hard one. It looks like "Stens..." (something). I am sure that the first 2 letters are "St"
On page 171 nr 122 in the same book as Ole Nilsen the word appears again.
Ian
ps. How do you get the links to the scanned pages to work kaysii. Whenever I do it the page is unavailable.
Cheers.
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Hi
I guess my query with regards Karen's parents is related to how you can be sure that the Karen Nilsdatter who migrated from Sweden to Hurum is the same Karen who married Johan Amundsen in Oslo?
There are several Karen/Kaisa Nielsdatter or variants born in Sweden in Norway in the 1865 census none in Hurum.
With regards to posting links that don't disappear, when you open up the parish register page, there is a box bildeinformasjon with "ingen" set as a default, you can get permanent hyperlinks to appear either at the top or bottom by clicking on the relevant choice. The permanent links then appear and you should use these for posting.
Best wishes
kaysii
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Hi Jila
I must ask the question how did you find your Cajsa in Huggenäs.
As kaysii stated and is shown on her marriage record her father was Nils Nilsson and her name was Cajsa and on the other two records her name was Karen.
Ian
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This is the information I have on Karen ( Kajsa/Caisa). I am told Caisa/Kajsa is a Swedish familiar form of "Karen"..I the beginning I only knew her name was Karen Nilsen Amundsen.
Karen/Kajsa and family :
"Pension från Strömsholms kanalbolag 12 riksdaler. Husförhör AI:15 Huggenäs p. 82, Östra Uggelsäter:
Arbetsattest till Norge 1853 April 25.
Husförhör AI:16, 1856-1860 Huggenäs p. 89, Östra Uggelsäter:
Inhyses f.d. soldaten Nils Uggelquist. Har pension av Strömsholms bolag, försvann i Norge.
Husförhör AI:17, 1861-1865 Huggenäs p. 101, Östra Uggelsäter:
Död 1861 November 1
Children:
Kajsa Nilsdotter. Born 3 JUL 1836 in Kyrketorp, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:15 1851-1855 p. 92, Östra Uggelsäter). See table 7, p .
Olov Nilsson. Born 22 JUL 1840 in Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:12 1836-1840 p. 98, Östra Uggelsäter). Husförhör AI:16, 1856-1860 Huggenäs p. 89, Östra Uggelsäter:
Flyttar till Norge 1860.
Nils Nilsson. Born 12 NOV 1843 in Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:15 1851-1855 p. 92, Östra Uggelsäter).
Anders Nilsson. Born 21 DEC 1850 in Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:15 1851-1855 p. 92, Östra Uggelsäter).
Husförhör AI:18, 1866-1870 Södra Ny p. 102, Kvarntorp:
Flyttar till Huggenäs 1866, p.15.
Husförhör AI:18, 1866-1870 Södra Ny p. 15 Bredene:
Anders Nilsson Uggelqvist, dräng. Flyttat från Ny p. 102 år 1866.
Arbetsattest till Norge 1868 Oct. 29.
Johannes Nilsson. Born 12 APR 1853 in Ö. Uggelsäter, Huggenäs (S) (Huggenäs A:15 1851-1855 p. 92, Östra Uggelsäter).
Husförhör AI:17, 1861-1865 Huggenäs p. 101, Östra Uggelsäter:
Ofärdig i vänstra foten.
Husförhör AI:18, 1866-1870 Södra Ny p. 102, Kvarntorp:
Vanför, dräng 1868.
Husförhör AI:19, 1871-1875 Södra Ny p. 101, Kvarntorp:
Vistas i By socken hos skomakare Törnvall (?).
===========================================
1900 Norwegian census:
Karl Ludvig Nilsen hf g Murerarbeider 1861.03.16 Eidsvold Anna Marie Nilsen hm g 1865.06.28 Kristiania Johan Sverre Nilsen s ug* 1888.01.11 Kristiania Signe Katrine Nilsen d ug* 1891.03.22 Kristiania Asta Marie Nilsen d ug* 1893.02.11 Kristiania Arthur Ludvig Nilsen s ug* 1895.06.17 Kristiania Rakel Nilsen d ug* 1900.05.30 Kristiania Karen Amundsen el kone Vaskekone 1836.06.21 Vermlandsnæs
1875 census-Karen with two daughters. She is divorced. Karen Nielsen hm f Hjula 1836 Næs Sverige Værmeland Anna Marie Johansen d ug 1865 Kristiania Karoline Elise Johansen d 1875 Kristiania
http://digitalarkivet.no/cgi-win/WebCens.exe?slag=visbase&am.
1865: Here is Karen Amundsen in 1865 Census:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01038027040521
=======================================================
Carolines baptism record: This link clearly shows Ole Nielsen as a Graastenmurer and single - address adn the year 1847- not sure what the words are after 1847
This is from an internet helper- Vivi- she is very nice and has helped me alot :)
Caroline Elise is born out of wedlock. Her mother Karen is married, but not her father Ole Nielsen who is a bachelor.
No 174:
Permanent sidelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?idx_kildeid=5781&i...
Permanent bildelenke: http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:NBN:no-a1450-kb20060920070058....
Her surname should have been either Olsdatter or Nielsen.
Vivi
===============================================
More threads with Vivi on Ancestry: and Caroline's Half sister Anna's baptism:
http://boards.ancestry.com/localities.scan-balt.norway.counties.oslo/1644.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1.1/mb.ashx
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If either of you have found other Karen's born 3 July 1836 in Nes Varmland in Oslo perhaps you could post them for me ?
Thanks
Jila
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Hi Jila
I am not saying she isn't your Karen but I don't think Cajsa and Karen are the same. I could be wrong. Also is the actual birthdate of Karen 6 July 1836.
Ian
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Hi Jila
Well, having read the research on Ancestry I have to conclude that all seems correct. Even though her name change is strange. After looking at all the records I must admit that I did start to query it all.
I hope that's OK.
Sorry about that.
Ian
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It is possible that the brothers could have come to Canada too & perhaps filed for a homeland.
To be honest I don't think you'll ever be sure what happened to the 3 brothers. The passenger records from that time were not detailed enough.
Ian
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Hi ian,
No problem about Karen..But I am positive I was told that Caisa is just a nickname or farm name that is Swedish for Karen.. It was so-o long ago I have forgotten who told me (lol)
FYI- Nils Hansson Uggelquist father's = Hans Eriksson Ringsfelt- he had two wifes - both name Caisa..Nils mother was Caisa Nilsdotter and the other Caisa surname was Jansdotter..I think Hans had about 15 children between the two wifes. I was in contact with a Jörgen Fryxell some time ago and he helped me with this tree.. he is related through the marriage of Hans to Caisa #2 ( If I remember right )
I am sorry I have no idea why Karen would put Nils Nilsen as her father on her marriage record- unless it was because Nils Hansson died in 1861 in Hurum as per that record you found?
Are you in Sweden Ian ? Did you see an actual copy of Kajsa birth record in the Swedish websites? Do you have access to the Swedish Genealogy data bases?
There are great records in Canada and the USA- if we could get a small hint as to where the brothers went it is a big help in the searching..
If they came to Saskatchewan & homesteaded a farm it would only cost $10.00 for 160 acres of land- It was hard work as the land was mostly bush but rewarding if they stuck it out. Caroline and her husband Peter came to Saskatchewan (via Minnesota) then about 1926-28 then moved once again to the Peace River area in Alberta.
Lots of Swedish men came to work in the Mines in Ontario and British Columbia too..So that is another possibility.
Bye for now
J
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Hi
I live in Sweden but am not Swedish. I have access to the Swedish books so if you want any records just ask.
Ian
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Did you find a record for Casia/Kajsa/Karen ?
http://www.nordicnames.de/wiki/Kajsa
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Yes I have that record plus every other record to do with this family.
Ian
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Could you post the link for me to see? I was thinking the witnesses to some of the birth, marriages etc must be relatives too? I haven researched them all though as all I know is the names- however might be a clue to the brothers?
Thanks
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I'll get that sorted for you shortly. But I have looked for links to do with the 3 brothers without success.
Ian
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The name Cajsa is a nickname for Karin:
http://svenskanamn.alltforforaldrar.se/visa/Kajsa
Unfortunately it is in Swedish. Google translate should work ok.
I have learnt something new today.
Ian
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Okay no problem :)
I also noticed this birth record :
Name: Ole Nilsen
Gender: Male
Spouse: Kajsa Nilsen
Marie Oline Nilsen Olsen
Birth 13 Dec 1869 in DOMKIRKEN Oslo Kristiania Norway
Baptism 18 April 1870 in Oslo Kristiania Norway
FS: Name: Marie Oline Olsen
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 13 Dec 1869
Christening Date: 18 Apr 1870
Christening Place: DOMKIRKEN, OSLO, AKERSHUS, NORWAY
Father's Name: Olaf Nilsen
Mother's Name: Kajsa Nilsdr
System Origin: Norway-EASy , GS Film Number: 255751 , Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C42466-3
==========================
I wonder if it was another child for Ole & Kajsa ??
J
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Could be.
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This was the possible Ole that Vivi & I found but no guarantee it is the right one ?
Ole Nils. Lillemoen m f !! hf g Graastensmurer 1847 Hedemarken n s 173276 Adlela Nils. Lillemoen k b hm g Arbejder, hvad som helst 1848 Sverige n s E: Tilføyd med blå blyant i Erhverv: Løsarbeiderske
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Ooops..The Karin link I sent was in English-not sure how that happened :(
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This was the possible Ole that Vivi & I found but no guarantee it is the right one ?
Ole Nils. Lillemoen m f !! hf g Graastensmurer 1847 Hedemarken n s 173276 Adlela Nils. Lillemoen k b hm g Arbejder, hvad som helst 1848 Sverige n s E: Tilføyd med blå blyant i Erhverv: Løsarbeiderske
Same family here as I found earlier:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01036528008621
Ian
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Adele Lillemoen in Oslo in 1923 as a widow:
http://digitalarkivet.arkivverket.no/en-gb/ft/person/pf01063298015897
Ian
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I have found an Adile born in Bohuslän on 1 July 1848. But of course we don't know if this is your Ole for sure.
Ian
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Did yu find their marriage?
Also looking for info on Carl Brynildsen-22 March 1824 in Soliden u Önna Krokstad, Göteborg och Bohus, Sweden died 30 April 1872 Aas Norway..Married record:Name: Carl Brynildsen
Age: 24 years
Gender: Male
Birth Date: Ca.1824
Marriage Date: 8 okt 1848 (8 Oct 1848)
Marriage Place: Idd, Ostfold, Norway
Spouse: Boel Marie Johannesdr
Spouse's Age: 24 years
Spouse's Gender: Female
Spouse's Birth Date: Ca.1824
Father: Brynild Andersen
Spouse's Father: Johannes Olsen
==================================
Father was Brynild Andersen & I think his mother was Stina ?? but not sure ? Can you find his birth record?
Carl married Boel (born 1824) in 1848 after my GG grandma Johanne Petronelle Jensen was born in 1846. Petronella 's father was Jens Olsen-Jens/ Jenz Olsen, was a cooper’s apprentice in Fredrikshald at the time of her birth. But that is all I know about Jens.
http://www.arkivverket.no/URN:kb_read?urnread_imagesize=full&info=ingen&hode=nei&show=135&uid=22650&js=j
Petronella was deaf and went to deaf school in Oslo.
If you can find out anything about Carls parents or Jens that would be great !!
J
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Father was Brynild Andersen & I think his mother was Stina ?? but not sure ? Can you find his birth record?
I have found his birth record.
He was born 22 March 1824 and baptized 24 March.
His mother's name was Stina Arvidsdotter.
Ian
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Thanks alot for all your help :) That is what I had but wanted to double check :)
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Here the names on the birth records of Nils and Lisa's children you wanted to know:
Cajsa Uggelqvist:
No godparents
Olof Uggelqvist:
Jonas Nilsson and wife Lisa Svensdotter
Nils Uggelqvist:
Olof Mal Persson and Stina Simonsdotter
Anders Uggelqvist:
Olof Mal Persson and Stina Simonsdotter
Ian
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Thanks very much for all your time and hard work :)
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You're welcome.
Ian
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Is this the family:
1880
Lundberg, Karl Gustaf b. 1850 - Father
Svensdotter, Britta Maria b.1845 - Mother
Ingrid Lisa b.1873 in Södra Ljunga (Kronobergs län, Småland)
Tilda Maria b.1875
Nanny Emma Rebecka b.1879
Ian
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Yes, But Karl & Britta did not marry until 1874-
Marriage Bann to Karl Gustaf Lundberg
1874 24 Oct Age: 29
Kånna sn, Kronobergs län, (G)
Ingrid Lisa Olofsdatter was a daughter from Previous relationship & her father was Olof ____?
These are the notes I have on her :
" Ingrid Lisa Lundberg moved from Kånna parish 1888 to Södra Ljunga parish to a farm there called Läsaryd Norrgård (North farm). She is noted out from Kånna (Dec 1) as Lundberg, but in to Södra Ljunga (Dec 17) as Olofsdotter. Oct 29, 1890 she is registered as moving out from Boarp Björsagård in Södra Ljunga to Ljungby parish, so apparently she had moved inside Södra Ljunga parish during the two years she lived there. I haven't checked it in the HFL. Normally servant people were obliged to stay until there contract was fulfilled. They were by law employed for one year at a time, 1 Nov - 24 Oct and had in pratice no chance to change their position at another date. In Ljungby parish she went to Hångers Lillegård (I wrote Hånger before as I thought the s was a genitive, but it's not. So the placename is Hångers). She didn't stay for long. Nov 26, 1891 she left Hångers and Ljungby parish and went to Tutaryd parish. There she is recorded (Dec 2) as a maid at Gnustorp Södregård (South farm). And at Gnustorp she died June 3, 1892. No cause of death is noted. She was 19 years 4 months and 1 day. June 8 she was buried in Södra Ljunga. "
The rest of the family immigrated in 1881 to Boston Mass
Britta's father was :
Sven Jakobssen Rask
Birth abt 17 Nov 1812 in Ryssby, Kronoberg, Sweden
Death abt 2 July 1902 in Wexio, Kronoberg, Sweden
Mother:
Maja Maria Lisa Nilsdotter
Birth abt 21 Sept 1806 in Ryssby Tutaryd sn, Kronobergs län, Sweden
Death abt 29 April 1881 in Kronobergs län, Sweden
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Ingrid Lisa was born 27 Jan 1873 and baptized 2 Feb. She was an illegitimate child and her father was not recorded.
The witnesses were Patric Rosendahl and wife Ingrid Jonasdotter. David Johannesson and wife Thilda Jonasdotter.
Britta Maria and Ingrid Lisa were living with her parents at Boarp Björsagården until 1874. There is a side note which has been crossed out saying that Britta Maria was in Germany for 2 years.
Ian
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You said that she changed her name to Olofsdotter. Well, from what I have found the name was actually Carlsdotter.
Ian
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Hi ..Have had the flu for the past week so not online much :( ..My Lundberg cousin in Sweden gave me the info about Lisa-but kinda weird & sad that the whole family packed up & left her when they left for the USA.