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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: Grace01 on Wednesday 18 March 15 22:09 GMT (UK)
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Hi
Looking for a birth for Francis Alexander born 1897 in Ballymoney Northern Ireland
Parents Margaret and Thomas Alexander
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Hi
Have you tried Family Search
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1408347
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Are you sure of the name and date (and parents)?
I cannot see a Franc* Alexander in the 1901 or 1911 Irish census that fits your request. There also doesn't seem to be a birth registration that matches- searched births of Franc* Alexander 1896-1899 and there are only 2 females but neither in Ballymoney district.
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This might be him in 1901:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Stranocum/Topp_Lower/943114/
and in 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Stranocum/Topp__Lower/126888/
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I saw those records but the name of both parents do not fit the original post- and I couldn't see a birth registration for that child although there are possible reasons for that.
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Aghadowey, you are quite right about the names of the parents not matching. The ages are also a bit suspect, which I suppose is not unusual. A 3 and 4 -year old child of a 55 year old mother in 1901 who is 76 in 1911.
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I did find a marriage for a Thomas Alexander to a Margaret Alexander 23 Apr.1896 Ballymoney district but there is no son Francis listed for this couple c1897. There is a Francis Alexander born 10 Apr.1904 Belfast district where the mother's name is listed as Alexander but there are more that one man named Alexander marrying a woman whose maiden name was Alexander and this birth is 7 years later than the original post (and in the wrong area).
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Looking at this census entry again:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=post;topic=716030.0;last_msg=5597027
If you search for the birth of that Sarah Alexander, you find one with mother's maiden name Alexander born on 8 October 1896 registered in Ballymoney. The parents could be the Thomas and Margaret who married in April 1896. A bit hypothetical but if that Sarah is the one who appears in the above census link, then the Francis in that link could be the correct one with neither he nor Sarah living with their birth parents.
Even if that scenario is correct, it does not explain the apparent absence of Francis from registered birth records. Perhaps he was not born Alexander.
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Saw that record for Sarah also although since there are quite a few other births with both parents named Alexander in the Ballymoney area it's probably impossible to know without downloading the birth certificates from GRONI (which Grace will be able to do if she wants to persue those leads). There was a Robert Alexander born 10 Apr.1897 in Coleraine district (which adjoins Ballymoney district).
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Hi all thanks for replying.
they are on the 1901/11 census with grandparents glensman.
just curious as i can't find any actual birth record for Francis.
have sarah birth and marriage records from the groni site.
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This is a long shot, but family search has the birth of "Hugh Frances Alexander" in the quarter July-Sept 1897 registered in Ballycastle. Frances is presumably a mis-spelling for Francis. When you look on GRONI for this you see the birth of Hugh Alexander on 2 July 1897. Unfortunately the mother's maiden name is not given. The GRONI site only ever has one given name. Ballycastle is close to Stranocum.
Failing all else this may be worthy of further investigation.
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBNV-JYD
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I know of FRANCES as a surname in Scotland.
It is a Scottish tradition to name individuals with the maternal surname as second given name.
It is quite common for individuals to be "known by" their second given name.
So, maybe not such a long shot?!
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Very interesting TheWhuttle. I had been thinking of it solely as a first name with Frances the female version and Francis for a male.
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Frances as a surname isn't one likely to be found in Ballymoney area according to census and vital records.
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Many thanks i will look into it
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The maps and Scottish census records for 1841 on Ancestry show the highest concentration of the FRANCES surname in Lanarkshire (which includes the conurbation of Glasgow), with many listed as having been born in Ireland.
http://www.ancestry.co.uk/name-origin?surname=frances
Folks would cross the water during the summer looking for seasonal work, and maybe to sell their craft wares (especially shoes) made during the winter months. This might occur for a number of years, before the family finally emigrated to Scotland - though sometimes coming back after a few generations.
Addendum: Why look at the 1840s? Second names sometimes derive from (particularly paternal) grandmothers' maiden surnames, so you need to be looking back 40-60 years from a child's birth for evidence of their births.
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Francis Alexander is the son of Thomas Alexander and his cousin Margaret alexander. I had a Groni search for his Birth certificate but they couldn't find one. Perhaps it just didn't get registered. His father Thomas died in 1897 aged 22 from scarlet fever and his son would have been born after his death. Francis had a sister Sara married to Robert Kennedy. Sara and Francis were brought up by their maternal grandparents Robert and Nancy.They are listed in the census as children of Robert and Nancy when it should say grand children. In view of the trauma of Thomas's death it would be understandable if registration got forgotten.
My grandfather David Alexander was the elder brother of thomas