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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: helenmcd on Wednesday 28 January 15 23:35 GMT (UK)
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I have been given the attached photo recently and I know it's a family related one but I'm unsure of which family member it relates to. Quite a few family members served in WWI and it could be related to any of them. Four of those who served have War Graves. The likeliest candidates are:
William John Evans 1896-1917 16th Battalion, Welsh Regiment
Philip Clifford 1879 - 1914 South Wales Borderers
Thomas Charles Clifford 1875 -1926 Army Service Corps
David Clifford 1877 - 1920 South Wales Borderers then Northumberland Fusiliers
Robert Frank Banks 1893 - 1916 Royal Sussex Regiment
Charles Albert Banks 1888 - 1950 Royal Artillery
Any help will be very gratefully received
Thank you
Helen
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I'd say it's the Welsh Regiment.
Adrian
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I would say there are two cap badges throughout the pic, fusiliers badges and POW feathers.
certainly the corporal at the front has a fusilier badge and the soldier in shirt at the stair rail as well.
James
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Hi, definitely two fusilier badges within the group.
Frank.
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The badges with the Welsh feathers are for the 7th Battalion the Cyclists.
http://www.royalwelsh.org.uk/downloads/E03-05-WelshR-WW1-7thBattalionTF.pdf
They were unique in wearing the blackened badges and buttons. The webbing pouches are not the usual 1908 webbing but leather tones worn by the Territorials.
the tunics appear be to the 1915 economy ones.
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A fine body of Men
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Thank you all for your replies and the information. I was wondering if evidence was pointing towards my Grandfather after all, David Clifford, who was in the Northumberland Fusiliers in WWII and served in Mespots for most of that service. I've still got to decipher and interpret his military records which I found last year. However, I after reading about the Welsh Cyclists, I'm pretty certain the photo includes my Great Uncle, William (Billy) John Evans. I know his active service was in the Welsh Regiment, until his death:
Ypres, Belgium
'Buried in War Grave: EVANS, WILLIAM JOHN Rank: Private Service No: 56536 Date of Death: 27/08/1917 Age: 21 Regiment/Service: Welsh Regiment 16th Bn. Grave Reference XXXIV. B. 15. Cemetery POELCAPELLE BRITISH CEMETERY' [CWGC Accessed online ]]
On the 15th January, so very recently, I had the following information from LLaneshen Local History Society, to whom I am indebted for their help regarding Uncle Billy's early service:
'W.J.Evans is listed in the Parish Magazine among the men from the Parish who were in the Armed Forces in 1915 and 1916 as a Private in the 7th Welsh Cyclists Corp.'
I had been trying to find out if Uncle Billy was missing from the Llaneshen War Memorial but the family moved to a different district at some point, as his parents address, at the time of his death, is 52 Cathays Terrace in 1917 which is not too far away but they told me that is in Cathays Parish, part of Llandaff Diocese. So I now need to try and find out if there is a War Memorial for that area.
I'm going to post another, smaller group, photo including Gt Uncle Billy, as I would really welcome any suggestions as to which of the soldiers in the group photo could be him. I have an idea but would appreciate objective opinions. Gt Uncle Billy is far right, 2nd row. I only acquired this photo recently and it is what made me question which regiment was in the larger group photo.
Thank you all again and I will respond individually too. I ought to confess that I had though, for some years, that it was a photo of my father's regiment, the South Wales Borderers, which he served in from the late 20's for 7 years, and then again in WWII, before transferring to the Royal Engineers. My father served throughout WWII and was never the same after it, like many who served in both World Wars and far too many other conflicts, before and since. I am very aware of what they all did for us. At least, as aware as a civilian, born in the 1950s, can be.
Thank you
Helen
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I'd say it's the Welsh Regiment.
Adrian
Thank you Adrian and it does look like there may be more than one regiment featured. Thank you for looking.
Helen
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I would say there are two cap badges throughout the pic, fusiliers badges and POW feathers.
certainly the corporal at the front has a fusilier badge and the soldier in shirt at the stair rail as well.
James
Thank you James. I hadn't realized there might be more than one regiment represented. I wonder where the photo was taken? I'm thinking probably in Wales, after being told of the Welsh Cyclists.
I appreciate your taking the time to scan through the photo and give your thoughts.
Helen
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Hi, definitely two fusilier badges within the group.
Frank.
Thank you for confirming the fusilier badges Frank. I am grateful for your time and input.
Helen
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The badges with the Welsh feathers are for the 7th Battalion the Cyclists.
http://www.royalwelsh.org.uk/downloads/E03-05-WelshR-WW1-7thBattalionTF.pdf
They were unique in wearing the blackened badges and buttons. The webbing pouches are not the usual 1908 webbing but leather tones worn by the Territorials.
the tunics appear be to the 1915 economy ones.
Thank you so, so much for the information about the Welsh Cyclists. I you read my main reply, you will see how that fits with other information I received very recently, about my Great Uncle William (Billy) John Evans service. I've got his service records and need to go through them again to tie up dates if I can, which might narrow down which group of the 7th he was in.
I can't tell you how much I appreciate and am grateful for groups like this. You are all wonderful.
Helen
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A fine body of Men
Thank you for the clean up, it looks much better. Yes they are a fine body of men and it's a fascinating and touching photo. Now I can see it so much more clearly too.
Helen
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The badges with the Welsh feathers are for the 7th Battalion the Cyclists.
http://www.royalwelsh.org.uk/downloads/E03-05-WelshR-WW1-7thBattalionTF.pdf
They were unique in wearing the blackened badges and buttons. The webbing pouches are not the usual 1908 webbing but leather tones worn by the Territorials.
the tunics appear be to the 1915 economy ones.
Actually it is the 1914 Leather Emergency webbing . It was more often than not found upon Kitchener Volunteers rather than the TF. They are though quite patently wearing the Imperial Service badge of those numbered amongst the TF who from around 1910 volunteered for any overseas service that may require the nominally British bound TF to outside these shores :)
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Thank you Scrimnet. There is so much to learn and I always end up with more questions. I am very grateful to all of you who share your knowledge and give your time to help those of us searching for answers to the questions.
Helen