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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Devon => Topic started by: LeighR on Tuesday 27 January 15 23:23 GMT (UK)
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As above, this is what i know or think i know -
Sarah Ann Blackmore possibly b 23 May 1830 Broadclyst was the daughter of William Blackmore and Elizabeth Page, Sarah had 3 brothers Thomas b c1833, William b c1838 and Francis Kenwood b c1841
Sarah emigrated to Australia, possibly paying 14 pounds passage or so I'm told on the Mary Ann from Bristol via Plymouth on 25 Dec 1848 arriving in South Australia 3 April 1849 she married Henry Wells a convict on 22 June 1849.
Her mother Elizabeth and two Brothers William and Francis also emigrated on the Ship Sibella in December 1851 arriving in South Australia in March 1852.
I found Elizabeth in the UK census of 1851 she was a Charwoman (whatever that was) living at 54 Coombe St, Exeter with her two sons Francis and William, i have no record of Thomas and Elizabeth is a Widow this was just previous to their emigration, my only possible link to her former husband William Blackmore is a newspaper report on the death of a Chimney Sweep of the same name in Exeter in 1841.
There are question marks over the paternity of Elizabeth Page, i believe her parents to be James Page and Elizabeth Ellicott.
As always it's difficult to follow ones ancestry if you don't have absolute proof or at least 2 or more confirming sources in historical records, so i could use some help with this line if anyone is willing or able to follow it up.
Kind Regards
Leigh
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Hi Leigh, this possibly is the family in 1841, Sarah Ann being shown as Ann:-
Elizabeth Blackmore 35
Ann 11
Thomas 9
Wm 3
Residing at Commercial Place, St Mary Steps, Exeter, Devon
Census Ref HO107/267/ 7/18 / 32
Keyboard86
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That could be right, it's the right general area, and in 1841 Francis was born and it was possibly also the year that William Blackmore died, so if the census was held before the birth of Francis and after Williams Death and before the birth of Francis, it would fit nicely.
I have Francis Born in November and the possible death of William in early May of 1841,
Even so there is a discrepancy in age for Elizabeth who is listed as 35 in 1841 and 48 in 1851, however that's not uncommon for an error.
Thankyou for your contribution.
Leigh
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Hi again Leigh, if you read up about the 1841 census you will find that ages were "rounded down" , that is why on certain census returns you will see the family are all possibly in multiples of 5 and what appears to be twins eg 2 aged 15, children less that 15 would remain as is, hope this makes sense!
Keyboard86
PS I should point out that not all enumerators carried out this process.
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Yes i understand that, so i am not being picky, i think that this is the right family, there should be a newspaper report on the death of William Blackmore that i haven't been able to find i just have a reference from another editorial to a previous notification, it was listed in the Exeter & Plymouth Gazette of May 1841 that may contain further information
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I found another news report from the Exeter Flying Post, 6th May 1841, Coroners Inquest report which states William Blackmore was 42 years of age and a native of Broadclist, his wife had 3 children and she was pregnant, it's all coming together now and i think that's about as good as i will get.
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Hi Leigh, this possibly is the family in 1841, Sarah Ann being shown as Ann:-
Elizabeth Blackmore 35
Ann 11
Thomas 9
Wm 3
Residing at Commercial Place, St Mary Steps, Exeter, Devon
Census Ref HO107/267/ 7/18 / 32
Keyboard86
Hi for my own peace of mind can anyone fathom out the occupation of Elizabeth on this return?
Keyboard86
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This is the clipping from the Coroners Inquest reported in the Flying Post on May 6 1841
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Could Elizabeth's occupation in 1841 be Charwoman?
At first I thought Dairywoman - but second thoughts and checking on FindMyPast it seems like Char
Suz
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She was a Charwoman in the 1851 Census, so that would be the most likely answer.
UK Census 1851-
First name(s) Elizabeth
Last name Blackmore
Relationship Head
Marital status W
Gender Female
Age 48
Birth year 1803
Occupation Charwoman
Birth place England
Birth town Exeter
Birth town as transcribed Exeter
Birth county Devon
Birth county as transcribed Devonshire
Street 54 Coombe Street
Town -
Parish St Mary Major
City Exeter
County Devon
Hamlet -
Parliamentary borough Exeter
Municipal ward St Mary Major
Registration district Exeter
Archive reference HO107
Piece number 1868
Folio 391
Page 11
Record set 1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census
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Hi again Leigh, to explain a Charwoman's role, it was someone who usually worked for hourly wages on a part time basis, often for several employers doing general duties such as cleaning.
Keyboard86
PS the Kenwood middle name for Francis have you found out why, and also why the? as to the paternity of Elizabeth?
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I found Elizabeth in the UK census of 1851 she was a Charwoman (whatever that was) living at 54 Coombe St, Exeter with her two sons Francis and William, i have no record of Thomas
There are question marks over the paternity of Elizabeth Page, i believe her parents to be James Page and Elizabeth Ellicott.
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Kind Regards
Leigh
Is this Thomas?
Marriage
19 July 1855
Holy Trinity Hull Yks
Thomas Blackmore age 23
Father William Blackmore
Mary Grace Bootyman
1861
3 Henry's Place Hull Yks
Thomas Blackmore Head M Fisherman Exeter devon
Mary G wife 27 Brixham Devon
Mary J daughter 5 Hull Yks
William Bootyman Brother in law 5 Fisherman Brixham
RG9 3596 27 18
1871
Vessel Fearless Hull Yks
Thomas Blackmore Married 39 Captain Exeter devon
Amrose Pockly 19 Mate scarborough yks
george Cooper 18 Fisherman Scarborough
William Taylor 15 boy Dumbarton Scotland
RG10 4797 11 4
there are later census if required
Why is there uncertainty over parentage of Elizabeth?
Do you have her baptism?
and marriage?
Suz
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That may be my Thomas, i will see if i can find anything to confirm, however there are a few William and Thomas Blackmores floating around Devon.
Elizabeth Blackmore nee Page has been an issue for many, most trees have Elizabeth Hooper or Page Hooper whereas i looked for the best fit to the daughter Sarah Ann Blackmore and i believe William Blackmore and Elizabeth Page to best fit, all we know from death certificates over here of their sons and daughter Sarah Ann who all name parents as William Blackmore and Elizabeth Page, that's good enough for me, but not for others, anyway next find a wedding, i haven't so far, but there is a wedding for William Blackmore and Elizabeth Hooper that fits datewise which is why i think some researchers have decided she must be a hooper regardless of the facts under their nose, although once again i don't believe many actually have copies of the death or marriage certificates of the children, i did find a baptism for Elizabeth Page which i believe to be the right one but except it might not be.
Elizabeth Page Christened on 24.Aug.1803 St Davids, Exeter Devon, father James Page, Mother Elizabeth Ellicott.
James Page and Elizabeth Ellicott were married on 10 June 1803 @ St Thomas the Apostle, Exeter ,Devon.
There you go, that works for me, but happy to be shot down in flames if anyone has a better idea.
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Francis Kenwood Blackmore, yes an interesting name not sure but believe Kenwood to have a significant meaning, Elizabeth was pregnant at the time of her husbands death, what happened to her then being a charwoman is hard to say but she does have an association with the St Thomas the Apostle Church in Exeter to which i have noted the surname of Kenwood to be associated including a Sister Elizabeth Kenwood who perhaps was a friend, there are Kenwoods all around Exeter and in Broadclyst where i believe William and Possibly Elizabeth originated from, so who knows but whatever the reason for the middle name i think it would have been significant.
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That may be my Thomas, i will see if i can find anything to confirm, however there are a few William and Thomas Blackmores floating around Devon.
I agree there are a few Williams and Thomas in Devon -but this is the only Thomas I could find who consistently gives p.o.b. as EXETER Devon
So maybe??????
Suz
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Hi again Leigh, I cannot at present locate a birth registration for Francis Kenwood Blackmore in 1841/2 but note his baptism was 23rd April 1848 (born November 1841) St Mary Major, Exeter Father William Mother Elizabeth, abode Preston Street, no mention of middle name Kenwood, where was this information obtained from?
Keyboard86
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Hi keyboard86, there is only one source for the middle name, but here is all i have found on Francis -
UK Census 1851-
First name(s) Francis
Last name Blackmore
Relationship Son
Marital status -
Gender Male
Age 9
Birth year 1842
Occupation Scholar
Birth place England
Birth town Exeter
Birth town as transcribed Exeter
Birth county Devon
Birth county as transcribed Devonshire
Street 54 Coombe Street
Town -
Parish St Mary Major
City Exeter
County Devon
Hamlet -
Parliamentary borough Exeter
Municipal ward St Mary Major
Registration district Exeter
Archive reference HO107
Piece number 1868
Folio 391
Page 11
Record set 1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census
Category Census, Land & Surveys
Record collection Census
Collections from United Kingdom
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UK Bdms-
First name(s) Francis
Last name Blackmore
Birth year 1841
Birth date ? Nov 1841
Baptism year 1848
Baptism date 23 Apr 1848
Baptism place Exeter, St Mary Major
Father's first name William
Mother's first name Elizabeth
County Devon
Archive reference 2945A/PR/1/9
Record set Devon Baptisms
Category Life Events (BDMs)
Record collection Births & baptisms
Collections from United Kingdom
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QLD Bdms - Death
Name: Francis Kenwood Blackmore
Death Date: 28 May 1885
Death Place: Queensland
Father's Name: William Blackmore
Mother's Name: Elizabeth Page
Registration Year: 1885
Registration Place: Queensland
Registration number: 000827
Page Number: 1193
SA Passenger Lists,1847-1886
Ship Sibella, 721 tons, Captain E.R. Coleman, from London 4th December / Plymouth 12th December 1851, arrived at Port Adelaide, South Australia 16th March 1852
South Australian Register Wednesday 17 March 1852
Tuesday March 16:-The ship Sibella, 721 tons, Coleman Master, from London and Plymouth 4th December 1851, with 257 Government emigrants.—6th ship from England to S.A. with government passengers for 1852 ; two births and three deaths on the passage, Edward Kearney, surgeon-superintendent.
Single Women
Blackmore Elizabeth Age 49
Single Men & boys
Blackmore William Age 16
Blackmore Francis Age 10
QLD Bdms - Marriage.
1881 C1276 Francis Kenwood Blackmore Elizabeth Whitford
1885 C312 Francis Kenwood Blackmore Marion Hammond
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Hi, bit late to this thread (haven't been on Rootschat for a while) but picked up this thread after searching for a few of the names in our tree.
My wife has Thomas Blackmore who married Mary Grace Bootyman (Mary a sister of my wife's relative) in her tree, from their marriage Thomas's father was listed as a Gardener, Deceased.
We suspect he could possibly be the Thomas baptised in Broadclyst in 1833, as most census list him as being Born Exeter, except for the 1881 census which has him listed as Broadcliff, Devon - Broadclyst/broadcliff not being to dissimilar, with Broadclyst being close to Exeter.
Thomas Blackmore baptised Broadclyst in 1833 - has his father William listed as a Labourer. Sarah Ann Blackmore's father is the same William Blackmore, also listed as a labourer with abode Cutters (not sure where that is).
William Bootyman living with Thomas & Mary Grace in 1861 is Mary Graces brother, when he marries he names one of his children Thomas Blackmore Bootyman.
We have not made much progress with Thomas's early life before his marriage, but will have to have another look now, to see if there is anything new since the last time we researched this line.
Hopefully some of the info helps you with your search, if only to rule out possibilities.
Regards
Kev.
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Hi again,
Posted to add that I have just found a merchant seamans apprentice record for Thomas Blackmore, born Feb 1833 Broadclyst (Broadclist on record) which judging by his occupation on later census's in Hull would seem to fit quite well. The record is from 1848 when he was 15.
Could well be why he is proving elusive to find on an 1851 census, possibly being out at sea.
Cheers
Kev.
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Thanks Kev, i will follow that up, it would be good for both of us if it's the same person
Kind Regards
Leigh
Just another thought Kev has your wife had DNA testing as Elizabeth Page is a direct maternal ancestor of my mother the maternal haplogroup is K1c1b that may or may not help to confirm the link, my DNA testing was done at FTDNA Kit number 262906
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No my wife has not had DNA testing (nor have I), She's not a descendant of Elizabeth, only related via Thomas Blackmore marrying Mary Grace Bootyman, Mary Grace being her relatives sister. Think we looked down this line because one of Mary Grace's brothers had a son called Thomas Blackmore Bootyman and we were researching more out of curiosity.
Regards
Kev.
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Hi Kev,
I now believe that we have 2 different families, although they are quite possibly related as records tie both families to the areas of Broadclyst and Exeter in Devon, the census from 1861 in Hull shows your Thomas age 28 a Fisherman with wife Mary age 27 and daughter Mary age 5 and Brother William age 25 a Fisherman, my William brother of Thomas had immigrated to Adelaide, Australia with his mother Elizabeth nee Page and brother Francis on the ship Sibella in 1852, at this time the father William Blackmore had passed on, he died on 1st May 1841 after a recently built chimney collapsed and broke his back on a building site at Fore-Street Hill, Exeter premises of a Mr Nicholas Tucket.
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Hi,
The William living with Thomas is his brother in law. William Bootyman marries shortly after the census and calls one of his sons Thomas Blackmore Bootyman.
Kev.
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I guess i have more work to do then Kev, i think were back to a 90% chance he is my Thomas as everything seems to fit, i do wish i had a DNA match on this one, is there a male line of descendants from Thomas.
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Hi again,
From memory think he only had one daughter.
Kev.