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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: HarrisonHart on Monday 17 November 14 14:30 GMT (UK)
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Has anyone got any info about this pub? I have not contacted the Garston Historical Society yet.
My mothers grandparents (Surname Miller) apparently ran this pub at some point. I'd say c1900
(https://harrisonmccrystal.files.wordpress.com/2014/11/10343500_10152455860436845_8308018787497390094_n.jpg)
Image is from Garston historical society book.
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I believe the pub was where the post box is, and the wrought iron over the window.
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Kelly's 1938 Directory has the following:-
Church Road Garston
(block extract)
8 Williams RW undertaker
14 Sidler Mrs
16 Ingham Mrs Bessie boot repr
18 Scanlan Mrs
20 Monger Miss Mary ladies' hairdrssr
24 Walsh Thos dock labourer
26 Peters Albt Regnld painter
The Sir Alfred Jones Memorial Hospital Miss Janet Harper matron
Gore's 1900 Directory has the following:-
Church Road Garston
(block extract)
8 Groves Ann
10 Wood William
12 Harrison Roger fireman
16 Scanlan Catharine beerseller
16 Scanlan Thomas donkeyman
18 Syer Mary Ann
20 Siddall John tobacconist
22 & 24 Laidlaw Joseph
26 Mason John blacksmith
28 & 30 Walker Tabitha cocoa rooms
Blue
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Gore's Directory 1911
Church Road Garston
16 Gibbons John beer seller
Blue
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OK so it was an alehouse in 1900 but thats not when my family were there. Thank you!
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Number 16 Church Road Garston
1871 Hobbis “Dock Vaults” / Coe “Ship & Plough”
1881 “16 is beerhouse”
1891 Collins “Beer Seller”
Garstonite might have some knowledge about the Ring o Bells he will probably post on here at some point.
Blue
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City of Liverpool Licensing Report Book, 1909, has:
16 Church Road, Garston, licensee John Gibbons, tenant (tied), owners P. Walker & Son Ltd., 440 sq ft drinking space, 8 rooms for domestic purposes, 2 licensees since 1 Jan 1900.
The entry has been amended by pen to show that the licence was surrendered in 1921 in return for compensation [to the owner, I think].
I do not have any other records to consult.
D
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Thanks both!
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I am actually thinking it was my mums, mums, mums, parents (not 100% sure of surname) who ran the pub. Rather than my mums, mums, dads, parents (Miller). My mum passed away 18 months ago, she told me SO many times who it was, I just can't recall for sure. We are not 100% sure on their surname as yet but it may be Reynolds or Rowlans. I will have to make efforts to find that surname.
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If you follow your families through the censuses you will most likely come across the one you are seeking, possibly even at the Ring O Bells. I'd try the 1901 census if I were you. :)
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The first thing to point out is that the photo was taken FROM Church rd - not IN Church Rd ...the pub is in Woolton Road -if you look on the wall at the road sign you will see it is Woolton Rd ...The Gibbons family came from Westport on the west coast of Ireland and still have family here ...I am pretty sure the family name you are looking for is Rylands ??... ,that family still live here ...I will check that The Ring of Bells was in Woolton Road - I am pretty sure it wasn`t Church Road - that pub - no 16 was the Cock and Trumpet ..
can someone check Woolton Rd for a pub in the census - and maybe you will find the Miller family there ..that family are also still in Garston -
hope this helps
:)
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The weird thing is the correct cobblers are in church rd in some of the records here-in, and it was a pub before that. Is that not kettle nook between the buildings and the hospital? my dad is very vision impared but he used to attend st francis so he traversed those streets from king st on the daily. I showed him the picture and described it and he said it sounds like the pic is taken from near the mona? Im not familiar enough and dads too blind to be sure. but yes I see the street sign.
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Cock & Trumpet (P.H.) appears on the attached map c1900s but in a different location. The sign in the photo appears to me to say Church Road. Looking on Google the building is still there.
Blue
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This is the property that appears to be on the old photo:-
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/commercial-property-to-let/property-25949877.html
Blue
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The recent photo found by Blue shows it was Church Road.
The 1901 census shows Catherine Scanlon as Innkeeper at 14 & 16 Church Road, the number on the on the schedule is 40. This is most likely the Cock & Trumpet, as already pointed out, and not the pub in your photo.
The Hospital (in your photo) number on schedule is 60 so too far away for sched no. 40 to be the pub in the photo.
The entry before the hospital is the Station House, then house number 53, however no sign of a pub/inn near the hospital ??? There is a pub at 31 Church Road (sched no 47) run by Thomas Lamb. Also another pub at 33 Church Road, John Buyers.
RG13 Piece 3507 Fol 94 page 9, but these too seem too far from the hospital.
Sorry, not much help really :-\
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Definitely not Cock & Trumpet see my map for the location of that pub.
Blue
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Hi Blue, yes I agree the pub in the photo is not the Cock & Trumpet, I was probably not very clear in my previous post. I was trying to say that we can definitely rule out no. 16 (Cock & Trumpet) as it is too far away, as your map and the 1901 census shows. Also that the nearest pubs to the hospital shown in 1901 were at nos. 31 and 33.
Sorry to confuse :)
ps. I have modified my previous post to clarify.
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The map on this link has the surviving properties on the corner of Church Road and Speke Road as numbers 8 and 10. If the map is right then the property thought to be the Ring O Bells in the old photo is not it. Number 16 the former beer sellers later cobblers would be further up:-
http://media.rightmove.co.uk/106k/105362/48115799/105362_Speke_Road_L19_2JX_IMG_02_0000_max_620x414.jpg
Blue
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I think number 16 was on the block to the left of the property with post box outside.
Blue
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The building that garstonite put a pic up, thats the one that was supposed to be the cobblers and ring o bells. yet its map numbers dont match up with the various documents. Is that where we are at? I might email the garston historical assn and just ask if they have any more info.
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We don't know which property the society is referring to but if the numbered recent map is right then that block with the Ring O Bells AKA Inghams AKA beer sellers AKA 16 Church Road is the one on the cropped pic and is no longer there.
Blue
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Sorry Blue for some reason I thought garstonite had put up the link to the corner building that is still there.(the one that, on the map, shows 8-10 church rd). that, I believe, is the building that was meant to be the ring o bells. (According to my mum who is now deceased).
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You could send a message to the society asking them to clarify the exact location of Ring O Bells and ask whether their source of information is local knowledge or based on documents they have. They think it was where Inghams was located at number 16 Church Road. It may well have been called Ring O Bells at some point while it was a beer sellers names were often changed:-
http://www.garstonhistoricalsociety.org.uk/contact_us.html
Blue
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OK got a reply from someone at the historical society - the ex ring o bells pub - which in the photo was a cobblers, is indeed the larger building further down the road on the right. Not the closer building with the wrought iron. Thats all they could tell me without further research. but at least it confirms what you were thinking Blue.
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I'll keep an eye out for any mentions of Ring O Bells and post if I find anything.
Blue
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The map that shows the Cock and Trumpet - that pub is on the corner of Church rd and King St - so it will be number 40 like Blue has stated ...and not Number 16 ...
yes the photo has been taken outside The Mona - tell your dad and it is Kettle Nook - your dad will probably remember the scrapyard that was there ...
The Mona was knocked down about 25 years ago..
being in Garston all my life I am confused as to why Garston Historical Society would show a picture of Woolton Road and say it is a pub in Church Road ?...it clearly states Woolton Road on the photo ..? baffles me ....but then again it is about 100 yrs old - I will walk down the village later out of curiosity .
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1901 directory has 16 church rd ring o bells beerhouse Walter Hughes. 1881 census has 18 church road bricklayers arms Elizabeth Reilly lodging house keeper. It is the building next to Elliott s drapers on the same side as the hospital. Can't see where anyone is saying it's in woolton road.
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Garstonite I think the pic is taken from the intersection of woolton, speke and church rd, looking down church rd from the corner of woolton rd. is that right? if so its just a bit ambiguous in their description, rather than wrong. it should read 'looking down church rd from woolton rd', perhaps. or is that not correct?
Thanks BeccaVBlack thats great!
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No it was taken at the St Mary's Road/Speke Road end of Church Road looking up towards the hospital. In this Google Street View you can see a similar view:-
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.3534262,-2.8968778,3a,30y,20h,88.91t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sDU5bOpi6ktvS8nqzPciwAA!2e0
Blue
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Yea I just got told the same by my cousin lol, my bad xox
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Quoting from the same Licensing book as before, the only other pub in Church Road, Garston in 1909 was the Farmers' Arms at no. 33, also closed in 1921.
Thre is one listed for Woolton Road, Garston: The Liverpool Arms, at no. 49. This closed in 1920.
King Street had the Blackburn[e] Arms at no.2, Victoria Hotel at no. 84 and an unnamed beerhouse at no. 76.
I think the Cock & Trumpet was another name used for 2 King Street at different times.
A