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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Nottinghamshire => Topic started by: dianacl on Monday 13 October 14 21:58 BST (UK)
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Thomas, my 2x g gfather was born in Eastwood in December 1805. I presume he and Ann were married sometime in the 1820's, but have spent a couple of years searching, to no avail, and therefore have not identified Ann's maiden name.
Their Children's baptisms were recorded in the parish records of Eastwood, (Found on LDS films) but no marriage recorded. (Thomas, John, William, Ann, George, Mary and Henry.) In 1841, Charlotte and Martha Johnson also lived with them, but I believe these were relatives other than their children.
The most likely candidate is Ann Carrott, who was married to a Thomas Johnson in 1827 in Langford. The stumbling block is the groom's abode, Barrowby, Lincs. Thomas was born in Wellow, and worked in Eastwood (Blacksmith), so what was he doing in Barrowby?
Any advice on the next place to look to confirm Ann's name would be appreciated. Thanks. (I live in Canada)
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So what happened with regards to the childrens' birth certificates? Are the names too common to narrow down? If you have the christenings, you could use the date to give an approximate birth range and approach the local registry office or the GRO for a more advanced lookup, giving parents names (Thomas and Ann) so they can locate the relevant certificate. If you've tried this and it hasn't worked for whatever reason... hmm...
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If they married in 1827 birth certificates were only introduced from 1.7.1837 so if all their children were born before then - you will not find her maiden name that way.
Any children born from 1.7.1837 whose birth was registered will give you Ann's maiden name.
To help in narrowing a birth search on freebmd - Eastwood came under the Basford Registration District
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Carole, I looked at the census, there are something like 5 children born after 1837. This is why I mentioned it. I assumed, given that Diana has got this far back, that she must know about birth certs by now and there must therefore be some reason why these were not useful.
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From freebmd www.freebmd.org.uk
Births September qtr 1848
Henry Johnson Basford 15 439
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Thank you for your thoughts Carole and Ayashi. I think that Thomas and Ann didn't civil register any of their children, even though I (and probably they) know they should have. Henry, my g.Grandfather was baptised in Eastwood on Dec 3, 1848. (LDS parish record microfilm) I sort of dismissed the "Basford Henry" you suggested Carole, as the wong time and place, but perhaps I should send for the record and see if his parents names match my Henry's, and Ann's maiden name is revealed.
So that's my next move. Will let you know what happens. Thanks again. Diana
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Eastwood is in the Basford registration district, which is what the "Basford" on the index means, so it is the correct place as far as the index goes. Most babies weren't christened immediately after birth- he could have been several months old at the time (unless your christenings give a birth date). One of my ancestors wasn't christened until he was 9 years old!
Good luck :)
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Eastwood St Mary baptisms, from the FHS CD, all with parents Thomas and Ann/Anne Johnson, and Thomas's occupation as a blacksmith throughout:
1832 11 04 Thomas Hawkley JOHNSON
1835 07 05 John JOHNSON (abode Brinsley -- all others have Eastwood as abode)
1838 01 07 William Oxley JOHNSON
1840 07 05 Ann JOHNSON
1843 08 06 George JOHNSON
1846 04 05 Mary JOHNSON
1848 12 03 Henry JOHNSON
Note middle names of Hawkley and Oxley - could they be relevant to Ann's maiden name?
There is also this one; did Ann die and Thomas remarry?
1854 07 02 George; father Thomas JOHNSON mother Amy father's occ Blacksmith abode Eastwood EASTWOOD St Mary
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Here's a marriage for Thomas and Amy
1853 11 13 Thomas JOHNSON Amy KNIGHTON RADFORD St Peter
but maybe he was Thomas Hawkley - there are no deaths for Ann at Eastwood before this time.
William died as a baby:
1846 04 08 William JOHNSON Inf
Was this Thomas's wife?
1866 10 02 Ann JOHNSON 60
and this:
1875 10 24 Thomas JOHNSON 71
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Just to muddy the waters, there are 2 baptisms to a Thomas Johnson and Marianne in Newark in 1821 and 1823, and one to Thos and Ann in 1826 (again Newark) and this Thomas was also a blacksmith; .
Neither the name nor the occupation is unusual so it may well be a totally different person - but could he have been married before? This appears to be the marriage
1820 06 25 Thomas JOHNSON Maryann CORBY NEWARK St Mary Magdalene
Scrap that - I've found other Johnson baptisms to Thomas and Ann in Newark up to 1835 and that would clash with the Eastwood baptisms so presumably a different couple.
I've looked at all parishes and the first baptism I can see to the OPs Thomas and Ann was the 1832 one of Thomas Hawkley Johnson. So I'd think it likely that they got together around 1830-31. The alternative if they were together before then is that they were living outside Nottinghamshire or in one of the few parishes not covered by the CD for this time period.
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Hello Annie,
I have Ann's death certificate, and as you guessed, she died at Eastwood in 1866 age 60, and Thomas was present. I suppose it is feasible that Thomas was married earlier on, as on the 1841 census there were a Charlotte (age 15) and Martha (12). Thomas would have been around 20 when Charlotte was born. ("my" Ann would have been around 15) I didn't find the two girls in parish records, but all the others were, so I considered they were just "taken in" by T and A. After this census it is difficult to track them.
T and A's sons Thomas, John and George all became blacksmiths. Their son William was an errand boy in 1851.(age 12) (Must be a different William you found.)
I spent some time exploring the Oakleys and Oxleys, and there are some vagues hints they are connected. Thomas himself died in 1874 age 69, at his son's (George) in Lichfield.
If Ann's maiden name WAS Carrott, can you think of a reason Thomas as a blacksmith, would have been living in Barrowby when they were married at Langford in 1827? (eg. Are there old mines around there?) Thank you very much for helping. Diana
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Although there are baptisms for Charlotte and Martha Johnsons on the FHS CD, none of them have a father called Thomas.
If Thomas and Ann m in 1827 I'd expect them to have had children - they were obviously a fertile couple and their Eastwood-born children all survived childhood, and yet there are no older children with them in 1841. This as much as anything leads me to suspect that the marriage (if they were married!) wasn't as early as this.
I found a probable marriage for Martha to John Rowland in Eastwood in 1852 but following them in the censuses all I could see was that Martha was b Nottingham.
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I think you are onto something when you notice they were married for 7 years before they had Thomas Jnr. Of course, one or more may have died, but as you say, the later children seem to have made it.
Another small argument for a second marriage is that in 1851, Ann was born in Ratcliff, and in 1861, in Coddington. (Perhaps she just didn't really know.)
I looked for Thomas in apprenticeship records in Lincolnshire without luck.
I have sent for what may be Henry, their last child's, civil Birth Cert.
With thanks, Diana
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Please let us know what the cert says!
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For sure! You will hear 10 minutes after I do! (They usually take about 3 weeks to get to Canada.) Diana
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To Annie65115 and CaroleW and other helpers. I have received the birth C. of Henry B1848, (Basford 15-439) Unfortunately, not my Henry:( These parents were Joseph Johnson, a collier, and Hannah Johnson, nee Shaw. Residence Marpool. As I understand the authorities didn't really enforce birth registrations until the 1860's, I think perhaps Thomas and Ann didn't comply. I will keep checking lateral lines though, and see where they lead. Do you think Ann is likely to be commemorated in Eastwood Churchyard?