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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: PinkFairy7 on Sunday 12 October 14 12:22 BST (UK)
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Hi.
Im trying to find out where William Rawlings or Rowlings and Harriet Walton were born. I dont have a great deal of information. they have a daughter Naomi Rawlings born 25.04.1862 in QLD died 08.09.1929. i found out their names from QLD BDM search.
Under BDM QLD i found Williams death:
Year 1911
Reg# C3179
First name(s) William
Last name Rawlings
Father
Mother - - ** born England aged 76 years
even though this note "** born England aged 76 years" is under the mothers name is it to be assumed that they mean William was born in England?
I tried looking for a marriage for William and Harriett in QLD as this is where Naomi was born found nothing and looked under NSW and nothing, either they werent married in Australia like im lead to believe or i have spelling wrong or something?
thanks so much for your time :)
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Year 1911
Reg# C3179
First name(s) William
Last name Rawlings
Father
Mother - - ** born England aged 76 years
even though this note "** born England aged 76 years" is under the mothers name is it to be assumed that they mean William was born in England?
Yes it means he was born in England and was 76 years old.
QLD death index
Harriet Rowlings
1915 C2501 Father Francis Walton Mother Mary Clarke
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There seem to be quite a few other births
1858 C375 Harriet Rowland; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
1859 C496 Annie Rose Rawlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
1859 C480 Rose Rowling; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
1862 C189 Naomi Rowlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriett Walton
1865 C383 Francis Rowlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
1868 C1598 William Rowling; Father-William; Mother-Harriett Walton
1872 C1610 Helen Eliza Rowlings; ; Father-William; Mother-Harriett Walton
1874 C1901 Edward Rowlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriett Walton
1881 C1390 Mary Rowlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
1883 C1945 George Thomas Rowlings; Father-William; Mother-Harriet Walton
Found this death but have not found a birth
1971 C5468 Alice Ann Rayment; Father-William Rawlings; Mother-Harriet Walton
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Marriage
28 Nov 1859
C326
Harriet WALTON
William ROWLING
Debra :)
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This may be your Harriet Walton (will need to confirm)
Born in Syston, Leicestershire, England on 1841 to Francis Walton and Mary Clarke.
http://records.ancestry.com.au/harriet_walton_records.ashx?pid=44130277
Francis Walton http://records.ancestry.com/francis_walton_records.ashx?pid=44125997
Born in Syston, Leicestershire, England on 1819 to William Walton and Jane Baile. Francis married Mary Clarke.
Looks like Mary (Clarke) Walton dies in 1850 and Francis remarries in 1851?
Immigration shows Francis age 35 with wife Hannah age 25, she is too young to be the mother of his older children, Mary 16, Harriet 11, Eliza 9 and Hannah 4.
This looks like their immigration
http://srwww.records.nsw.gov.au/ebook/list.asp?Page=NRS5316/4_4790/Parsee_11%20Jan%201853/4_479000396.jpg&No=18
NSW Death 6059/1875 WALTON, FRANCIS; Father- ; Mother-MARY; FORBES
Mother shown as Mary? information on death may not be reliable as only this is provided by informant
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Could this be William's Immigration?
1852 on the ship 'Meridian'; arriving Morton Bay;
William Rowling, age 18, Cambridgeshire
http://srwww.records.nsw.gov.au/ebook/list.asp?Page=NRS5316/4_4790/Meridian_10%20Aug%201852/4_479000239.jpg&No=14
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A long shot...
Could this be William's family? (some of the family names match his childrens names)
http://records.ancestry.com/abraham_rowling_records.ashx?pid=38636293
"William Rowling: Born in Bassingbourn, England on 30 Dec 1835 to Abraham Rowling and Charlotte Rosendale. He passed away on 10 Sep 1918 in Inglewood, Qsd, Aus."
(Not sure the above date of death is correct as I can't find a William Rowling/Rawling(s) with date of death 10/09/1918 on Qld BDM)
Adding: Thanks Judith, for that death 1918 William Rowlings, (date 9/9/1918, ** born England aged age 87 years )
A better age fit is the William RAWLINGS death 3/4/1911 Reg# C3179 ** born England aged 76 years
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QLD BMD has this death
1918, C5078
William Rowlings
** born England aged 87 years
Thus b abt 1831, so dates slightly out, however.............
Judith
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Wow thanks so much for your time and effort thats incredible what you guys have found. i wish i knew what you know to find this information. it makes me super excited to keep researching and find more!! you have given me great leads.
just wanting to understand the different spelling for Williams surname either rawlings and rowlings doesnt really mean they are different people but on records the name spelling could have been a misunderstanding?
and cupoflife you mentioned " information on death may not be reliable as only this is provided by informant" does that mean that when im looking on BDM for which ever state and record type to take what names they have provided with a pinch of salt as there could be a slight chance its wrong? im just trying to understand the accuracy of the BDM records searches you can do? is this the same with the dates of birth and death or is this mostly accurate for the older type records.
thanks again so much for everyones help i hope you all get some lovely karma come your way :)
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When someone dies, the people there usually know what day they died ( unless they find the body just lying around ). A doctor is generally required to state what the cause of death was. This information is current information at the time the person died, and is going to be as reliable as the technology of the time will allow.
The quality of other information varies a lot, depending on who is providing it. A spouse ? A child ? A sibling ? A neighbour ?
Particularly if someone was an immigrant, who came without their family, even a spouse may have very little knowledge of parents-in-law they may have never met, or who may have been dead long before they even met their spouse.
Even if a knowledgeable person exists, they are not necessarily the person who gets asked to provide the details on the form.
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Thanks for explaining that so nicely and clearly that makes perfect sense to me!! I have a thats clicked moment :-)
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thetowers has given you a good explanation.
Marriage certificates are likely to be the best sources of information as the bride and groom give the information themselves and they usually know the facts. Of course, there is no guarantee that the 'facts' they give are correct!
It is also worth remembering that the need to produce identification is fairly new. Before Medicare you fronted up to the hospital, doctor and told them your name, no need to prove who you were, so you could be using another name very easily, both in giving birth and in dying. No need to prove your ID for marriage records either. And, even recently, when I gave my aunt's details to the undertaker to be forwarded to the registry no-one asked for my ID, nor for any proof that I was giving the right information. Of course they knew my aunt's name but her parentage details were just on my say-so.
WW1 and WW2 enlistment required no ID either.
As for different spellings of names it's very common. Nowadays you fill in forms yourself but in the past the registrar asked for details and s/he wrote it on the form. So it was easy for a name to be mispelled, especially in early days where illiteracy was not uncommon. Handwriting was used in most cases with some letters looking the same eg your Rowling/Rawling. Then the original form was transcribed into the index allowing for more possible errors. It's not unusual either for names to be mixed up - for example, the registrar might ask for name of mother and the informant is unsure which mother is meant - the baby's mother, the informant's mother etc. It's a wonder any of us can find anything! ::)
The other thing to remember is that an index has very limited information so certificates are often needed for better information. Usually an index gives the place in which the registration was made - it is not the actual place where the BMD occurred.
Cheers, Judith
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Hi Judith. thats great advise i didnt know that ID wasnt asked for back then but i guess it makes sense. i like the advise on the marriage cert thats very handy to know that they may be a bit more reliable source of information. would that be the same as birth? as you would assume its the parents registering a birth of a child?
thanks for your advise/tips makes looking at records a bit easier knowing what you guys have taught me. thanks again!!! :)
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Marriage certs have the most reliable info. Only one person (usually parent) needed to register a birth so there may be wrong information given, especially re the other parent. Also the marriage information on a birth certificate may be incorrect especially if the couple has not formally married or when illegitimacy is being covered up. Having a baby out of wedlock was often seen as 'sinful'. People give a date/place of marriage which is wrong.
Ages are often incorrect for various reasons, some deliberately to mislead. I have a great-aunt who only got 8 years older every ten years in the UK censuses! Ages on shipping/immigration records may be false to fit with costs of the fares or to qualify for assisted passages. Shipping records are often not very carefully compiled.
Oh PinkFairy, I can see you are getting hooked on this genealogy lark!
Judith
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another brilliant tip i never thought to think that ages could be changed for certain reasons. explains a lot now thinking back on some records iv looked at.
this family tree stuff is very addictive the more you find the more you want to and NEED to know!! but these tips are really invaluable i will have to go back on some stuff and look again as i ruled out certain records as the birth date and ages ect were sometimes widely different from one record to another so i assumed they must be the right names but belong to someone else as the ages just didnt match at all. so i have plenty food for thought now!! thanks again these tips are great!!
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Hi PinkFairy7,
Looks like you have caught the family history bug. I'm afraid there is no cure for this life long condition and although at times it can be frustrating, I can assure you that it is a very rewarding condition to have ;D ;D ;D You will no doubt hit some brick walls along the way, so don't be afraid to keep the questions coming, as it helps to have feedback from fresh viewpoints. The great benefit is that we all learn something new everyday too and most importantly we enjoy helping each other.
cheers :)
cupoflife
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Oh yes, very definitely addictive, and it is the best of addictions to have, there's so many friendly fh buffs around, and the journey is full of surprises, and hiccups and grand discoveries too.
Congratulations on becoming an addict.
Cheers, JM
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Hi, I have just joined Rootschat and wondered if your problem had been solved. I have done some initial research on the Rowlings family from Inglewood, Qld where Naomi was born.
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Hi, I have just joined Rootschat and wondered if your problem had been solved. I have done some initial research on the Rowlings family from Inglewood, Qld where Naomi was born.
Hi there, I'm a descendant of this family - Hilda Elizabeth Charles, granddaughter of Naomi Rowlings/Rawlings was my great-grandmother.
I have the following dates:
Hilda Elizabeth Farrell (nee Charles) b. 27 Jan 1907
Elizabeth Charles b. 1 March 1887
Naomi Charles (nee Rowlings) b. 25 April 1862
If this is correct, Elizabeth fell pregnant out of wedlock with Hilda at age 19 - but more interesting is that Naomi gave birth at 14! I feel I must have the wrong person here.
Hilda married Robert Francis Farrell, who was a 1/4-caste indigenous man who served in the Boer War. He fought and held his own against a future boxing world champion on the boat to South Africa. Robert (who my mother called Pop) was the son of Francis (Frank) Farrell, and his father in turn was Francis (Frank) John O'Farrell. Frank O'Farrell was the illegitimate son of Patrick O'Farrell, who I'm told was the Architect of Dublin at the time.
Frank O'Farrell took a 14yo indigenous girl named Mary or Maggie Green as his wife. I can find no record of their marriage. His children dropped the "O" in the surname. They lived in northern NSW. Frank O'Farrell died at age 42 of TB in 1902. There's no mention of Mary or Maggie in the brief death notice.
Frank Farrell, son of Frank O'Farrell, married Celina Pollard and they had 4 children, one of whom was Robert, who married Hilda. To this day there are a lot of Farrells in the Warwick area and I'll have to take note of the other family surnames in the region next time I am there.
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Correction - Elizabeth Charles was 24 when she had Hilda. I was on a research bender late at night and arithmetic abandoned me!
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Hi Mellowfellow, Hilda Farrell is also my Great-Grandmother. Her daughter Marjorie is my Grandma, and Rodney is my father. My Aunty Lyn made a family tree for Ken and Marge Burley for Ken's 90th, but it was very basic and I had never read any of the information you posted about Robert Farrell serving in the Boer War and fighting a future boxing champion on the boat to South Africa - until I came across this thread today. My Dad is going to love hearing about this. Could you please send me some more information this, or point me in the right direction as to where I could find it?
Kind regards, Lacey