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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: chrisscales on Wednesday 18 June 14 23:09 BST (UK)
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Is anybody able to identify roughly the location of this photo or come up with suggestions where it might be? It is my grandmother as a baby in 1921 with her family. They lived in Nunhead / Peckham area of London at this time.
We think the ground looks more like sand/gravel than grass. The wooden supports behind I'm not sure about. Could it be somewhere like the docks in East London, or somewhere on the Thames, down on the beach at low tide etc.
All thoughts welcome...
Chris
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Certainly looks like a beach as the little boy has a bucket for building sandcastles. If it is the Thames I found this:
"The beach (foreshore) is in front of the Royal Festival Hall Access by stairs either side of the Festival Pier. ...and yes, there is sand along with the pebbles."
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I am no expert but it looks to me as though they have the sun in their eyes - unlikely on the south bank of the Thames? Though the river winds a merry course so the "south" bank does not always face north, by any means.
My other thought - does the little boy's Union Flag suggest it is a special/patriotic occasion? Or perhaps he brought it to place on top of a sandcastle. Dad looks smart for a beach trip - Sunday best? Even the lad in the background is in suit & tie.
In my experience prams on sand do not make for a happy journey so I hope they did not come too far!
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Thanks both.
Is the baby in a pram? It does look like it might have some kind if handle but doesn't look like any antique pram I've ever seen... More like a strange chair.
Being smart on the beach was very common then, the next generation down (my grandfather) always went to the beach in a full suit even in the 1950s.
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I don't know re pram or chair - not clear I agree. Still I hope they did not have to lug it far with or without baby in situ.
I was going to say it must be summer until I saw this about the extended heat/drought of 1921:
www.theguardian.com/news/2011/oct/13/weatherwatch-drought-margate-eliot-waste-land
When was the baby born and how old do you think she is in the photo?
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Chris has already said that the baby was born in 1921....she looks to be about a year old.
Carol
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I read Chris' first post as saying she was photographed in 1921. Birth reg is Mar qtr 1921 if I have the right person but I agree she looks older than one would expect if taken in her first summer.
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She was born 29 December 1920, so I guess the photo could conceivably be 1922, but more likely 1921. Her brother was born 20 April 1918, so he would be 3 if it's 1921, or 4 if 1922.
Thanks
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Or perhaps somebody can suggest a good museum that might know about the Thames in this period...
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Also groom - where is that description from? "The beach (foreshore) is in front of the Royal Festival Hall Access by stairs either side of the Festival Pier. ...and yes, there is sand along with the pebbles."
I think it looks a lot like stairs down to a Thames beach, and I don't see why it can't be the sun shining from the west if they are facing north, which would make it afternoon-ish.
Thanks
Chris
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I can't remember exactly where the quote came from, I just googled for London beaches.
This may help as it gives access points, although of course they may have changed since the time of the photo.
http://www.london-footprints.co.uk/wkforeshoreroute.htm
You could try The Museum of London. http://www.museumoflondon.org.uk/london-wall/
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Thanks - I have just been reading about Watermen's stairs and realising I have been to the Wapping one.... could be one of these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watermen's_Stairs
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Do you know if the family (or extended family) had access to a motor vehicle. Could they have gone out for a Sunday drive? It might have taken all day to get there though. Just a guess.
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when I was a kid in the 1950s we often used to play on the sandy shore by the Tower of London, a bus ride away from where we lived in East Ham. My perception is that the "beach" outside the Festival Hall is more recent; but that's probably just my memory playing tricks.
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I highly doubt they would have had a motor car at this point (in fact I don't think they had one even in later life) - they lived in Peckham in 1921 and her dad worked at Peek Freans factory in Bermondsey and would cycle there everyday. If they went to the beach for the day (to Margate / Ramsgate / Southend) I think they'd take a coach or the train. Their cousins owned a delivery van in the 1930s as they had a greengrocers but even that wouldn't have been suitable for family outings I don't think...
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Tony yes I think you're right, I'm pretty sure Tower Beach was created in the 50s , though I've no idea about the festival hall one - lots of great photos of Tower beach at I think the English Heritage Collections or Museum of London website (forget which)
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I must confess it hadn't occurred to me that Tower beach might be that recent -- it was always just there <g> and easier to get to than Southend
The other thing I wondered was that the steps in the background to the picture are reminiscent of those in family photos I have of Southend, Sheppey and Canvey Island. I know nothing about easy journey from SE London in the 1920s but would it have been easier to get to Woolwich, Gravesend or even Sheppey or the Kent coast rather than north of the river?
After that I'm only guessing I'm afraid
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Sorry not 50s, 30s - Tower Beach opened in 1934
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And thanks for the suggestions about the steps. I think Southend is a possible. We have photos of the same family on beach day outings around 1935-1937 from Ramsgate, Margate and Southend. So I think it's likely if they went to the beach in 1921 they would have gone to similar places. I spoke to an expert on the watermen's stairs of the Thames a while ago and he couldn't place it, so I think it's more likely to be at a beach/coastal place like Southend. Would be interested to see your photos if you have similar ones...