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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Lancashire => England => Lancashire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Treelover on Monday 16 June 14 00:08 BST (UK)
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Hello,
If a marriage is shown as Ashton under Lyne Civil Marriage on the UKBMD site, does that mean its Registry Office and the only way I can view it is to order it, or is there somewhere I can find the details?
Joan
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Hi
Civil Marriage could mean a Register Office marriage or it was a Registrar Attended marriage in a non-conformist Church. What year are you looking at?
Andy
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Hi Andy,
Agnes Scally married John Frain (e) in 1908 Ashton under Lyne 2nd quarter 8d 973. Struggling to find John's correct parents as there are 3 couples that fit the bill. It's a tree I am doing free for a friend.
Joan
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Check out Andrew Frain who married Margaret Hora/Horer(Sp) in a civil marriage in Stoke on Trent in 1868.
Son John born 1881 Shelton, Stoke.
See: http://www.staffordshirebmd.org.uk/index.php
1881 Census:
RG 11
2723
Folio: 73
Page Number: 27
18 Princess Street, Shelton, Staffordshire, England
Andrew Frain 36 Born Ireland
Margret Frain 36 Born Ireland
Mary Frain 10
Martin Frain 8
Maggie Frain 5
Anthony Frain 4
Annie Frain 2
John Frain two months
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Hi
Are these their children?
Mary Agnes 1908
May 1910
Bernard 1915
Kathleen 1922
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Hi Heather,
Yes they are the children.
Hi Huckleberry,
Don't think it's that one. He was born end 1877/ely 1878, got his WW1 pension record and worked out his correct age from that??
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Hello,
I can't see Agnes or John in 1911 indexes, but there is a Martin Frain in Ashton under Lyne
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XW1L-L28
He would fit with the family Huckleberry found.
Is this John in 1911? https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XWHQ-1V6
There is an Agnes in same area.
Heywood
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We can discount the John Thomas Frain born in 1877 as he died in 1891
The only others are
John born 1881 Shelton as mentioned above and
John born 1875 mother's maiden name was Beard
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John Frain married Bridget Beard in 1873 Wolstanton, staffs
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I think I'd go for Andrew and Margaret :)
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Hi Huckleberry,
Don't think it's that one. He was born end 1877/ely 1878, got his WW1 pension record and worked out his correct age from that??
He looks to be 32 yrs in 1915 so would be born abt 1882/3 ???
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2 more children
Frances Frain birth registered 1912 Easington Durham mmn Scally
John Frain birth registered 1913 Easington mmn Scally
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Check out Andrew Frain who married Margaret Hora/Horer(Sp) in a civil marriage in Stoke on Trent in 1868.
Son John born 1881 Shelton, Stoke.
See: http://www.staffordshirebmd.org.uk/index.php
1881 Census:
RG 11
2723
Folio: 73
Page Number: 27
18 Princess Street, Shelton, Staffordshire, England
Andrew Frain 36 Born Ireland
Margret Frain 36 Born Ireland
Mary Frain 10
Martin Frain 8
Maggie Frain 5
Anthony Frain 4
Annie Frain 2
John Frain two months
From http://www.staffordshirebmd.org.uk/index.php
FRAIN Annie Mothers maiden name HORA 1879 Stoke-On-Trent Staffordshire
Mo
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Hi Huckleberry,
Don't think it's that one. He was born end 1877/ely 1878, got his WW1 pension record and worked out his correct age from that??
He looks to be 32 yrs in 1915 so would be born abt 1882/3 ???
Oh I thought it said 36 years ???
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Hello,
I can't see Agnes or John in 1911 indexes, but there is a Martin Frain in Ashton under Lyne
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XW1L-L28
He would fit with the family Huckleberry found.
Is this John in 1911? https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XWHQ-1V6
There is an Agnes in same area.
Heywood
Yes Heywood, it's the right ones
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It does look then that Andrew and Margaret are very likely the right parents but as ever - certificates would be best. ;)
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Joan,
Does your friend know if the family might have been Catholics?
If they were, I could try to check the marriage registers at the library in Ashton.
Heather
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I have checked the 2 main RC churches in Ashton and they weren't married there.
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Thanks everyone for your help and ideas. Looks like I'll have to leave the line for now and see if the family want to spend money on a certificate.
Joan
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It's only £9.25 if you order from GRO? ;D
Seems a small price to pay to get the information you need/want?
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It's only £9.25 if you order from GRO? ;D
Seems a small price to pay to get the information you need/want?
I agree - but not my tree ::)
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Is this Agnes and her family in 1901?
3 Elm Street
Hanley
Sarah Scally 40 widow Cup maker
Mary Scally 20
Thomas Scally 15
Agnes Scally 11
Bernard Scally 9
May Scally 4
2599/78/17/104
Agnes and John named their children
Mary Agnes after Mother and Agnes
May after sister?
Bernard after brother
Kathleen
Frances
John after John
Where do the names Frances and Kathleen come from?
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There are two trees on Ancestry - Agnes' parents are known. John is said to be born 14 Feb 1880 but I doubt that is right. All indications point to him being born 1881 and passing away 1950 aged 69.
Both his parents passed away before the 1891 census.
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There are two trees on Ancestry - Agnes' parents are known. John is said to be born 14 Feb 1880 but I doubt that is right. All indications point to him being born 1881 and passing away 1950 aged 69.
Both his parents passed away before the 1891 census.
Yes, that's correct. It's not me with the 14 Feb 1880 (and that tree does not have his parents anyway)
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Joan,
I did not think it was you, His birthday was probably 14 Feb 1881 which ties in with him being 2 months old at the time of the 1881 census.
Son Bernard (5-3-1981)and his wife Isabella (17-7-1998) are both on Tamesides Burial register but since they started to "update" it - it is a shambles - so John and Agnes may well be there but not showing.
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In Ashton Cemetery Grave I67 are
Are they your family?
May Frain aged 19 buried 3 July 1930
John Frain aged 69 buried 19th April 1950
May Lyon aged 1 buried 8 May 1933
Agnes Frain aged 47 buried 15 May 1937
Mary Agnes Lyon aged 92 died 22 June 2001 Cremated ashes in Grave
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Thank you HeatherJulie
Yep that looks like them.
I agree about the TMBC burials website, used to be so useful now its a complete shambles ::)
Joan