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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: Jessies Mum on Monday 21 April 14 10:42 BST (UK)
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Searching for my friend - looking for information on her great-grandfather James Joseph Craven born c1903 in Dublin, died 3 October 1960. Married Margaret (Maggie) McCormick, born 31 October 1901, died 9 February 1976. Looking for any involvement with the Irish Republican Army? Can anyone point me in the right direction please?
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Try the Military Bureau Site - Re IRA Membership (1918-22) you cannot search by surname - have to browse individual battalion records.
Link
http://www.militaryarchives.ie/collections/online-collections/military-service-pensions-collection/search-the-collection
annclare
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Have you census addresses for his family 1901 and 1911
or any info from his marriage cert, parents address etc
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Thank you for the link dathai - I am in Australia, so I have no idea where to commence searching. I know that he moved to Dolphin's Barn at some point - no idea when. I also know that he had brothers Patrick, Daniel and Michael and three sisters Alice, Molly and unknown. This information is being given to me by James' soon to be 80 year old son, so my apologies for not having more solid information.
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possible lmarriage
Dublin South 1933
Jan Mar vol 2 page 398 James Craven match Margaret McCormack
I only found 5 Craven births mothers maiden McCormack from 1934 to 1942 will P M them to you just in case still living.
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Hi
I would start by looking for the marriage between James and Margaret which Dathai has given
Marriages Dublin South Jan/Mar 1933
James Craven/Margaret McCormack
Volume 2 Page 398
Other posts on this site will give you information on ordering Irish civil certs.The marriage cert will give James and Margarets fathers name and their occupations and their addresses.This will help to try find them on the 1901 and 1911 census which are online.
Only seeing one James Craven on the census in Dublin but this may not be the correct family
.http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Usher_s_Quay/James_s_St_/61396/
On the 1939 Electoral register for Dublin available online there is a James and Margaret Craven living in Great Longford Street and a James Craven living in James Street (which is why I have doubts with that census return).
http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=dublin%20heritage&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CCQQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dublinheritage.ie%2Felectoral%2F&ei=R0O2TorNGInJhAeo24mKBA&usg=AFQjCNEvIZ2N_wof_MUEQn2BLPCk_ei8ZQ&cad=rja
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Found one hit on the Irish Prison Register available on Family Search.org
James Craven born 1903 est in Meath St at age 21 in 1924 in Mountjoy Prison no offence given.
No one of this age 7 or 8 on 1911 Census.
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Only one James Craven born Dublin South between 1901 and 1911
James Craven
Oct Dec 1902
Dublin South
Vol 2 page 610.
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Thank you everyone - will follow up with the link annclare about the IRA membership - possibly that may link in to why dathai has found a jail link in 1924? Great information jnoone re marriage and census information. Appreciate all you are doing in trying to find out for me.
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Just looked at the prision registers - the 1924 record for James Craven is just an index listing of prisoners no further information.
Just to muddy the waters -- there are two entries for a James Craven in the prison registers one in 1915 and one 24 Jan 1917 but this is an older James Craven b. c.1896 age 21 5ft 6 and half inches Fair hair brown eyes fresh complexion. Born Meath St present residence James St Father Joseph same address Soldier 4 RDF (Royal Dublin Fusiliers?) Service no 8698 Offence Absence fro H.M. Army - he was handed over to a military escort.
The 1915 entry is for the same person same offence.
Possibly not related.
annclare
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Hi Annclare
The prison entries for 1915 and1917 for James Craven would correspond with the census return I looked at which I feel is not correct.
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Before i proceed any further you will have to note that some parts of census are missing as they cant be found,well at least i cant find them any where on the census.
The following can all be found on Irish Genealogy and Family Search
Daniel Craven of 9 Church lane son of James and Margaret Craven married Mary Anne York of 3 Corbally Lane dtr of James and Julia on 15 Jan 1865 in St Nicholas church.
Some of their children born before 1881.
James 14 Jan 1866
Mary Anne 24th July 1867 married John Ryan in Harrington St church 4th April 1887.
Catherine 2nd Jan 1870
Margaret 21 Feb 1872
Julia Maria 20 Aug 1874
Patrick Joseph 2 Sep 1876 married Mary Anne McLoughlin 1896 born 27th Feb 1879.
Bridget Mary 7 Sep 1878
John Joseph 3 Sep 1880.
Patrick Craven 8 Dowkers Lane son of Daniel Craven and Mary Anne York married Mary Anne McLoughlin also Dowkers Lane dtr of Michael McLoughlin and Bridget Finn (should be Feehan)in Harrington St Church on 2 Aug 1896
Children
Daniel 1st Feb 1897 1 Dowkers Lane
Bridget Agnes 23 Oct 1899 21 Lr Clanbrassil St married John Joseph Brady Dublin South 1926.
Michael 27 Sep 1900 27 Lr Clanbrassil St
Mary Anne Craven age 54 a dealer in 1901 at 3 Dowkers Lane (most likely because of her age Mary Anne York widow of Daniel)
Norah 18 dtr
John 20 son
Malachy 16
Denis Ryan 10 nephew
Joseph age 5 son now this lad troubles me as the only Death in Dublin for Daniel Craven age 48 buried Glasnevin 1890 5yrs before his birth.
1901 census 2 Dawkers Lane MICHAL(AS SPELT)Mc Laughlin age 45 painter most likely Patrick Cravens father in law.
wife Bridget 39
Dtr Bridget age 22
Margaret 24
William 27 ages for these a bit off when compared to their baptisms on Irish Genealogy.
as i was in the G R O this morning i took the liberty of getting 2 certs to help you out.
James Craven 27 Lr Clanbrassil St born 5th Nov 1902 son of Patrick Craven( occ car driver)and Mary Anne McLoughlin
Marriage in St Nicholas 4th Dec 1932 registered 6th March 1933.
James Craven (bread van driver) of 27 William Place son of Patrick ( car driver) to
Margaret McCormack 4 Whitefriar St dtr of Patrick McCormack (labourer)
witnesses Gerard Collins and Annie McCormack.
possible census return for Margaret McCormack age 10 in 1911
1911 census 32.6 Cuffe St
Patrick McCormack age 41 factory lbr
Bridget age 39
Margaret age 10
Laurence age 8
Kathleen age 6
Elizabeth age 2
Cheers Dathai
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Maria Anna York baptised in St Nicholas 1st Oct 1843 dtr of James York and Julia Curran.
James York married Judith? Curran 16th n/r 1840 St Nicholas
1901 census 10.2 Graves Cottages
James York age 80 grandfather born wicklow ,retired bussiness,widower
Death 1902 in Dublin North James York age 65?
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Dathai, thank you - that is a huge amount of information! Thank you sincerely. I need to just stop and go through each line you have written and piece this altogether - what a huge lot you have found! ;D
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Also note Clanbrassil St is on the census returns maybe they just did'nt bother to fill one out.
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possible marriage for his brother Daniel
Marriage Dublin South 1918
July Sep vol 2 page 662
Daniel Craven match Charlotte Cullen.
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Hi
If the census return for Margaret Mc Cormack(aged 10) living in Cuffe Street 1911 is correct then the following two records night be worth looking at
Marriages Dublin South Oct/Dec 1899
Patrick M'Cormack-Bridget Finegan
Vol. 2
Page 672
Births Dublin South Apr/Jun 1901
Margaret M'Cormack
Vol 2
Page 646
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Griffiths Valuation of 1854 shows a Patrick York at Ferns Court,Cross Kevin St in 1854 now he could be the father or brother of James York
The prison register for Daniel Craven whiteboy offence 1867 gives his address as Ferns Court, Kevin St.
The Freemans Journal of 6th March 1867 title ''Fenian Rising'' shows an arrest of a Daniel Craven, i dont have access to this as its a paying site.
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Through finding the marriages of some of Daniel Cravens sisters i was able to get his mothers full name which is Margaret Healy,which led to his baptism
Daniel Craven baptised St Nicholas 21 June 1842 to James Craven and Margaret Healy some of his siblings were baptised from the Bride St area no's 65 and 16.
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Hi,note you are trying to track James Joseph Craven born 1902 Dublin and married for third timeto MaggieMcCormick. James was married to my aunt jane Kelly in 1925, she died in 1931. I have details of his parents etc, if you would like furtherdetails. Father Patrick Craven born 1876 and mother Mary Ann McLoughlin born 1879. James brother Patrick Craven was also married to Janes sister Dora. If you need any further inforbe happy to help.
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Just looked at the prision registers - the 1924 record for James Craven is just an index listing of prisoners no further information.
Just to muddy the waters -- there are two entries for a James Craven in the prison registers one in 1915 and one 24 Jan 1917 but this is an older James Craven b. c.1896 age 21 5ft 6 and half inches Fair hair brown eyes fresh complexion. Born Meath St present residence James St Father Joseph same address Soldier 4 RDF (Royal Dublin Fusiliers?) Service no 8698 Offence Absence fro H.M. Army - he was handed over to a military escort.
The 1915 entry is for the same person same offence.
Possibly not related.
annclare
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Re James Joseph Craven, 1902-1960;
1st Wife - Eileen Byrne born 1902
2nd wife. Jane Kelly 1900 -1931 (my Aunt) one child John Charles Craven (raised by Kellys)
3rd wife Maggie McCormick 1901-1976 - 4 Sons.
His father - Patrick Craven 1876-1928 - Mother Mary Anne McLoughlin 1879 -
Grandfather - Daniel Craven 1842-1891 = Grandmother Mary Ann York 1843 -
GreatGrandfather- James York 1811 - Greatgrandmother Julia Curran 1820
Great Great Grandfather - Patrick York 1790 -Great Great Grandfather Mary Caffrey 1790.
This is a brief outline. His brother was also married to my aunt Dora Kelly.
I have photos etc, but would like to know who is researching and their connection to James.
Looking forward to hearing from you.
Posted on behalf of Olive :)
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Hi sarah/olive,
I am researching on behalf of one of James Joseph Craven's great grandchildren and son. I have forwarded your message as they have not been aware of there being three marriages. Stay tuned.
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Glad to be able to help. Are you a professional geneologist. I have been researching my family for 5 years now as a hobby. I assume James son is not living in Ireland.
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Forget to mention I will be visiting James Craven's niece Angela tomorrow for her 86th birthday, she is the daughter of his brother and my first cousin.
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You are correct Olive, James son lives in Australia. Do you have a marriage certificate of James and Jane? Please let me know - I have advised the family of your line :)
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Yes have full details, are the family unaware of this marriage and the child born to them, John Charles Craven now deceased. As I really do not know who requires this information, I am a little reluctant to release any personal details, other than what is obtainable on line. I need to know who I am more thank you.
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Hi all, I am just doing the Yorke side of my family tree and came across this information. Thank you all for filling in some gaps for me. I am related to Daniel Craven by Mary Ann Yorke- 3rd Great Aunt. Her father James Yorke is my 3rd Great Grandfather whom married Judith Curran 3rd great grandmother.
I live in Australia so hard to get information off family. Will be heading to Ireland in 4 weeks so will be doing some digging.
cheers and stay safe
Sharon Miller nee Kavanagh
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Have you got Catherine York born Feb 26th 1851
https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=st.nicholas_mf_1838-1853_ba_0197
married James Burnett ,Sep 1871
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1871/11353/8167875.pdf
or 432 here
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633734#page/37/mode/1up
died 1895
159 here
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1892/06037/4719523.pdf
as did her 9 yr old son James
130 here
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05916/4679619.pdf
family 1901
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Wood_Quay/Lr__Kevin_Street/1347644/
James appears to have died 1903 though wrong image showing on civil register
however Glasnevin index when entering Kevin Street into address box for same year says its him
https://www.glasnevintrust.ie/genealogy/results/index.xml
strangely Glasnevin is showing burials for both James and his son James but not Catherine in 1895
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Mary Anne married Dermot Magrath in 1904 and said her father was deceased
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1904/10200/5711862.pdf
1911
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Wood_Quay__part_of_/Kevin_Street__Upper/81672/
Catherine married John Byrne 1909
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1909/10036/5650583.pdf
not sure of this as cant see a birth for daughter Mary Carmel
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Wood_Quay__part_of_/Bride_Street__New__Iveagh_Trust_Buildings_/77703/
Ellen married John Bates 1910
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09992/5633817.pdf
1911
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Wood_Quay__part_of_/Kevin_Street__Upper/81120/
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Sharon
Have you got the parents of James York 1811 who married Julia or Judith Curran 1820, these were Patrick York b.1790 married Mary Caffrey b.1789.
Mary Ann York 1843, siblings were Patrick 1841-1847, Patrick J. 1848-1877, Catherine 1851-1892 and Julia Marie 1854.
Glasnevin Cemetery resident genealogist is Lynn Brady and she is very helpful.
Olive.
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Ah i see i mistook the 1892 as 1895 for Catherine
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1892/06037/4719523.pdf
indeed she is buried in Glasnevin