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Research in Other Countries => Europe => Topic started by: chris47 on Monday 31 March 14 13:52 BST (UK)
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Hello.
A friend is trying to trace Information on Trifonio Pacella born 1871 italy.( parents etc )
Trifonio had a Daughter Josephine Francis born 1912 Shoreditch.
Her mother Alice Farrell born 1870..1875 at sea.
Pat (friend ) told me they may not have married.
Best Regards.
Chris.
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You need to look at the 1911 census for Trifoni Pacella and family!
He is there with 4 daughters and an Alice Farrer?!
(Mods: taken from a free index!)
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Thank you for your advice..KGarrad....chris
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1901 census: Class: RG13; Piece: 1575; Folio: 53; Page: 35
193 Grange Road, West Ham, Essex
Pacella, Trefonis (Transcribed on Ancestry as Cufonis!) Head M 31 Shopkeeper Refreshments b Italy
Pacella, Francesca S Wife F 22 b Italy
Pacella, Maris F Daughter F 3 months b Canning Town
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Difficult without knowing where in Italy he's from (no national indexes). Perhaps Francesca left/went back to Italy? In addition to the four children visible on the 1911 index, there's a pair of twins in 1906 (no trace), and a daughter Teresa b. late 1908 and died early 1909 that can be seen at freebmd.
Josephine's birth is almost certainly the one indexed as Paella/Paclla on freebmd.rootsweb.com , mother's maiden name Cloake. Your friend should get this certificate as there does seem to be some confusion over Alice's name.
I cannot see any obvious death for him, or for Alice, or a marriage of Josephine - although some of the daughters seem to have stayed in the UK and married. Did Alice perhaps marry someone else and Josephine was raised under that name? Or he and Alice stay together and they all changed their name to something more English-sounding?
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Births, March qtr 1901
West Ham district vol 4a, page 150
Pacella, Maria Filomena
March qtr 1902
West Ham district vol 4a, page 84
Pacella, Carmela
September qtr 1903
West Ham district vol 4a, page 122
Pacella, Annina
June qtr 1905
West Ham district vol 4a, page 73
Pacella, Trofimenn
December qtr 1906
West Ham district vol 4a, page 124
Pacella, Joseph
Pacella, Venturella
September qtr 1908
Shoreditch district vol 1c, page 12
Pacella, Teresa
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Just thinking here:
Trfonis was a widower in 1911 but, as Francesca was Italian would her death have been reported to GRO? Or to the Italian Embassy?
There is a death for Teresa in 1909.
March qtr 1909
Shoreditch vol 1c, page 31
Pacella, Teresa age 0
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Josephine's birth is almost certainly the one indexed as Paella/Paclla on freebmd.rootsweb.com , mother's maiden name Cloake. Your friend should get this certificate as there does seem to be some confusion over Alice's name.
According to a tree on Ancestry, Alice Cloake married John Farrell.
John left the family home leaving Alice with 3 young boys, who were placed in Shoreditch Workhouse.
Alice then worked for Trefonis Pacella.
Hence the confusion?!
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If she died in England or Wales, a death certificate would need be issued before any burial took place, whether she was a British subject or not.
It is possible that she is down under another name (mistranscribed, confusion over the spelling, etc), or that she travelled back to Italy and died there.
Not seeing any sign of a marriage for Alice to John.
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Alice married John in Ireland, I think?
First born Gilbert Farrell was born there (1900).
The other sons of the marriage were born in London - John (1904) and Charles (1906)
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Hello.
Thank you KGarrad and jrose for your information i will pass this on to Pat.
I will have to ask her for all the info she knows.
Chris.
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for Italy you need really a placename.
Pacella is a very usual name to find everywhere in Italy. ;)
http://www.gens.info/italia/it/turismo-viaggi-e-tradizioni-italia?cognome=Pacella&x=40&y=16#.Uzw5mlc0lZd
maybe you ask also at this forum for Italy:
http://www.italiangenealogy.com/forum
http://www.italiangenealogy.com
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Good Morning carinthiangirl.
Thanks for your help,i have just joined the forum,i will let you know.
chris
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Venturella Pacella is my grandmother and Trifonio Pacella is her father. I was brought up by my grandmother and know her history well.
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Trifonio Pacella was my great grandfather and Venturella Pacella was my grandmother whom I lived with all my life so I know her history very well. If this information is for Pat she already contacted me but never followed things through. I knew all the sisters of Venturella apart from Nan (Annina) who died age 28 and my grandmothers twin brother (Joseph) who they called Tommy and he died when he was 18 months old. Trifonio's wife Francesca (my grans mother) died very young after the death of her only son and on her Italian death certificate it said she died of a broken heart.
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Good Morning charkt.
Many thanks for your message.yes it is Pat.
I will pass on your message to her.
chris