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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cumberland => Topic started by: ayemas on Thursday 27 March 14 09:16 GMT (UK)
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Hi,
Roots Chatters, can anyone tell me if the Shipp Inn in Egremont, Cumberland.On the 1861 Census is still there, and where exactly it was or is
Thanks
Ayemas
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Hi,
The Ship Launch Inn in Egremont Cumbria was closed in May of last year. It was situated on 68 North Road Egremont. The old railway station opened 1855 closed in 1964 used to be next door. Think I may have a photograph somewhere, will have a look.
Sandra
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In the middle of the 19th century - The Ship, changed its name in the advent of rail travel to "Railway Hotel" - in 1880 Mary Smith was the Landlady. In 1900 it was The Ship Launch with John Smith as the Landlord.
Sandra
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Thank you for doing that for me Sandra
It was very kind of you
Shirley
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So was Main Street Egremont, changed to North Road. I ask this as the Information I have for the Pub in 1861 says it is in Main Street Egremont
Shirley
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No - Main Street Egremont has always been Main Street. There were a dozen or more pubs.
Sandra
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The Smith family on the 1901 census had a son Alfred Henry Smith - he is buried at Egremont Cemetery -
Alfred Henry Smith buried 23/5/1978 - B Uncon 34 - aged 87 years (occupation had been haulage driver of 1 Oddfellows Street. Egremont)
Sandra
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No not my pub Sandra, but thanks anyway :(
I was actually after the Watson family that lived next door in 1861 Census
Shirley
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Have you got any Watson names you want checked ?
Sandra
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Thanks for your help Sandra
My great grandfather Isaac Watson 1854 - 1927 I have no death place for him.
My great Grandmother his wife Elizabeth Bowness 1856 - 1913 No death place for her.
Great Grandad had sisters Margaret T Watson 1851 -- Mary Ann Watson 1858--
Half Siblings John Tidyman 1841 -- James Tidyman 1843--- William Tidyman 1845 - 1895
I have them all in or around Egremont I have no Death or Burials for most of them
Thanks Shirley
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Hi,
Unfortunately have to go out for a while but I'll be back later with some more info but did find Isaac and Elizabeth Watson were both buried at Egremont - although the year of death for Elizabeth was different to what you indicated - 22/1/1936 aged 80 years. Isaac buried 25/11/1927. Both buried L Con 336.
Catch you later.
Sandra
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Hi,
John Tidyman buried 16/7/1917 - E Uncon 83 - Aged 76 years. Married - died at Carlton. Bought by Frances Tidyman (wife)
Frances Tidyman buried 7/12/1921 - E Uncon 83 - Widow - deceased address Carlton
Son - John Tidyman buried 10/10/1919 - E Uncon 84 - Aged 49 years. Married - died at 11 Rosewell Cottages.
Elizabeth Jane Tidyman was buried 11/5/1943 - E Uncon 84 - Aged 73 years - widow - died at Meadow View, Whitehaven - deceased address was 11 Bookwell Egremont.
Sandra
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Isaac Watson and Elizabeth Bowness Watson had a son George Bowness Watson born 1882 who was buried at Egremont. L Con 486 - aged 67 years - died at Whitehaven Hospital - deceased address - 19 Briscoe Mount. Egremont.
Annie Watson was buried at Egremont 11/12/1974 - aged 83 years. Also buried L Con 486 - deceased address Castle Mount, Egremont (that is a care home)
Sandra
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William Tidyman - buried at Egremont 10/3/1895 - aged 49 years - E Con 20A - Coroners Orders - died at Bains No 11 Woodwend Mines - Purchaser was Eleanor Tidyman from Egremont.
Eleanor Tidyman - buried at Egremont 24/3/1932 - aged 76 years - widow - Oddfellows Terrace buried E Con 20A
http://www.cumberlandarchives.co.uk/content/view/157/30/
Daughter Tamar Tidyman - buried 31/10/1951 - aged 59 years - Spinster - E Con 50 - 4 Oddfellows Terrace. Purchaser was Eleanor Tidyman of 5 Oddfellows Terrace Egremont.
Sandra
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Mary Ann Watson married Joseph Lucas Q3 July/Aug/Sept 1881 - 10b 765 Whitehaven.
Mary Ann Lucas was buried 21/4/1950 - A Con 481 - aged 93 years.
Joseph Lucas was buried 12/12/1938 - aged 86 years - A Con 481. Deceased address 20 Main Street Egremont.
Joseph Lucas the son of Mary and Joseph was buried at Egremont 5/1/1960 aged 76 years - D Con 35 - 63 John Street Moor Row. Egremont. Cumberland.
Harriet (wife of Joseph) buried 14/2/1972 - aged 83 years - D Con 35 - died West Cumb Hospital - Lived at Moor Row.
John Lucas born 1882 son of Mary and Joseph buried 1/1/1929 - aged 47 years - L Con 324 - 2alford Terrace Egremont.
Isabel (wife of John) buried 2/11/1960 - aged 77 years - L Con 324 - - Lived at 2 Salford terrace. Egremont.
Sandra
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WOW//////////////
Sandra, Couldn't believe my eyes when I read this this Morning,
Thank you so very very much for all that information, it must have taken you ages, but I really really
do appreciate it.
I will enjoy putting all the Info into my tree, do you live in or near Egremont?
I live in Australia, but hope to make a visit to UK in the summer.
Once again Thank You
Shirley
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You're very welcome, Hope it helped fill in some blanks. Just took another look to see if there was anything to expand on.
John Tidyman (1870 - son of John & Frances) and wife Elizabeth (Mattinson) Tidyman had a son Thomas (Tom) Mitchinson Tidyman born 1894.
Tom married May Williamson December 1929 at Whitehave - 10b 1248
Tom Mitchinson Tidyman (pumpman) was buried at Egremont 13/9/1972 - A Con 457 - aged 79 years -
There is also a May Tidyman buried 23/1/1960 - A Con 457 - aged 53 years.
And Warwick Tidyman (birth registered June 1938) buried 25/4/1960 - A Con 457 - aged 21 years.
All 3 lived at 11 Bookwell Egremont.
Sandra
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Maud Elizabeth I Tidyman - born 1901 married Joseph Caine in 1921 at Whitehaven (10b 1293)
They show on the 1930 census East Lansing, Ingham, Michigan.
Joseph C Caine 40 Born England. Immigrated 1923. Married at age 31 years. Plumber helper. College.
Maude E Caine 28 Born England. Immigrated 1925. Married at age 20 years
Mary E Caine 7 Born England.
604 Oak Street East Lansing, Ingham, Michigan 1940 - Lived in same house 1935.
Joseph Caine 50 Repair Plummer. College.
Maude Caine 38
Mary Caine 17
Lansing, Michigan, City Directory, 1945/1946/1948/1949 lists Joseph C Caine (Maude E I) - Maintainance Man - 604 Oak (EL)
Kalamazoo, Michigan, City Directory, 1960 - 513 Walnut CT apt 1 - Jos C Caine and Maude E Caine I
Sandra
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Maude Elizabeth Irene (Tidyman) Caine - 9 Apr 1901 - 3 Dec 1991 - Last Residence 49002 Portage, Kalamazoo, Michigan.
Sandra
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Joseph (born 1866 son of John and Frances (Irving) Tidyman married Jane Kirkbride. They had a son John Mitchinson Tidyman 1897.
John Mitchinson Tidyman married Fanny Irvving March 1928 - 10b 893 - Whitehaven.
John buried at Egremont 27/8/1957 - Aged 60 years - Grave Ref - IA 35 - Accidentally killed at Windscale No 1 Pit. Fanny Tidyman purchased. Deceased address - The Cottage. Yottenfews, Calderbridge.
Fanny Irving buried 14/9/1964 - buried IA 35 - Deceased address 151 Ennerdale Road. Cleator Moor.
Sandra
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William Tidyman (who died 1895) and Eleanor (Pearson) Tidyman had a son William Tidyman born 1876 and a son Thomas born 1887 -----
William was buried 15/3/1920 - C Con 252 - Aged 44 years - married - deceased address School Lodge Main Street - Purchaser - Eleanor Tidyman of School Lodge Main Street, Egremont.
Thomas Henry Tidyman - buried 17/5/1923 - E Con 50 - aged 37 years - Bachelor - 5 Oddfellows Terrace . Purchaser Eleanor Tidyman.
Sandra
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William and Eleanor also had a daughter Jane Pearson who married Harry Dawson - Dec 1918 - Whitehaven - 10 b 1265
Jane Pearson Dawson was buried 17/7/1967 - IA 152 - aged 73 years - deceased address 4 Oddfellow Terrace.
Husband Harry Dawson - buried 26/3/1975 - IA 152 - aged 83 years - deceased address 4 Oddfellows Terrace.
Sandra
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William and Eleanor has a daughter Annie born 1890 who died in 1908 - aged 18 years - 10b 482 Whitehaven
Annie Tidyman - buried 23/1/1908 - aged 18 years - C Con 252 (same as brother William) single - died at Schol Lodge. Purchaser Eleanor Tidyman.
Sandra
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There is a Eleanor Telford buried at Egremont who would have the same birth year as Eleanor daughter of William and Eleanor but can't quite find enough to connect her at the moment. ::)
Henry Telford buried at Egremont 14/2/1951 - A Uncon 121 - aged 68 years - deceased address - 20 Nelson Sq., Castle Croft Egremont.
Eleanor Telford buried 10/4/1973 - A Uncon 121 - aged 89 years - died The Infirmary Workington - deceased address - 20 Nelson Square, Castle Croft. Egremont.
Sandra
Added Can see a marriage that would fit - March 1910 - Hartlepool - 10a 175
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Looking at the births - Telford - Tidyman had a son Ponsonby Telford - Birth registered Dec 1911 at Whitehaven - 10b 1262
Ponsonby was buried at Egremont 20/4/1925 - aged 13 years - F Uncon 326 - deceased address 20 nelson Square. Castle Croft. Egremont.
Sandra
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Another Tidyman - Telford birth - Annie T (could stand for Tidyman) Telford - Registered Dec 1915 - 10b 1197 - Prob married Holyland but neither are buried at Egremont.
Harry Telford birth redg September 1913 died Aprril 1993 - not buried at Egremont.
Should also be a Grace Telford - Dec 1920 and a Margaret Dec 1918 but haven't traced those 2 yet.
Eva Telford birth redg September 1922 - 10b 1272 - Whitehaven
Eva Telford married Sydney Nicholson - Dec 1942 - Whitehaven - 10b 1421
Eva was buried 9/11/1948 - A Uncon 153 - died at Blencathra Sanatorium - Married - Grave purchased by Sydney Nicholson (fitter) - 10 Springfield Road. Bigrigg.
Sandra
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Looking at the births - Telford - Tidyman had a son Ponsonby Telford - Birth registered Dec 1911 at Whitehaven - 10b 1262
Ponsonby was buried at Egremont 20/4/1925 - aged 13 years - F Uncon 326 - deceased address 20 nelson Square. Castle Croft. Egremont.
Sandra
Do you know what Ponsonby Telford died of? He was my mums brother and didn`t really talk about him. Thankyou
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Hi to Ayemas and Sandra, My Great, Great Grandfather was a Thomas Davidson who was the Landlord of the Ship Launch Inn after retiring from the Army until his death in 1897. He was married to a Margaret McLaughlin and one of their sons, a Charles Davidson was my Great Grandfather. He married a Margaret Maude Tidyman. They ended up in Southern Rhodesia where my Grandfather John Davidson and his siblings were born. I see that in your postings, the name Tidyman was mentioned several times. I hope that this information may be of interest to you and I would appreciate any information that you may have on my ancestors.
Regards,
Graham D.
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Hi,
Roots Chatters, can anyone tell me if the Shipp Inn in Egremont, Cumberland.On the 1861 Census is still there, and where exactly it was or is
Thanks
Ayemas
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The Post Office Directory of 1858 lists a Mrs A Waddell as the publican of the Ship on Main Street Egremont at that time.
The Post Office Directory of 1873 lists a Grainger Noble as the publican of the Ship Launch on Main Street at that time.
But the Ship Launch was on North Road at Number 68
The old Captains House at Bigrigg used to be called the Ship. But that's on Springfield Road.
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Welcome to RootsChat Fred Long.
Ann Waddell was the Innkeeper of the Ship Inn (listed on Main Street) in 1861
(No on schedule was 78)
Ann Waddell 45 Head. Inn keeper.
Christopher Moor 17 Son. Draper.
Gillpin Waddell 9 Son
Annie Waddell 5 Daughter
Margaret Shettleton 19 Servant
Anthony Cooper 40 Lodger.
Next door was Isaac Watson and his family.= in 1861.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7PD-PLH
Mary Watson 39 Head
John Tidyman 20 Son
Margaret Watson 10 Daughter
Isaac Watson 7 Son
Mary Ann Watson 4 Daughter
Family Search just listed as Innkeeper. Obviously no image on Family Search.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M7PD-P21
1871 census shows Grainger Noble Snr (Ag Labourer) at the Ship Inn with his family.
Station Lodge address was above on census
Granger Noble 51 Head
Eleanon Noble 30 Wife
Granger Noble 10 Son.
Mary J Noble 8 Daughter
John Noble 6 Son
Margaret Noble 4 Daughter
James Noble 1 Son
Margaret Murphy 18 Servant
1881 census Ship Inn - next door to Railway Station.
Eleanor Noble 42 Head. Innkeeper.
Grainger Noble 20 Son. Spirit Merchant.
Mary J. Noble 18 Daughter
John Noble 16 Son. Iron Miner.
Margaret Noble 14 Daughter. Gen Dom Serv.
Darcy B. Noble 9 Son
Jane Noble 5 Daughter
John Servals 24 Boarder
James Roan 26 Boarder
Lawrence Inness 45 Boarder
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2WM-2TNK
According to the local history by E A Read, The Ship was known as the Railway Hotel in the middle of the century ??
Fred you referred to The Old Captains House Public House at Bigrigg. (photo)
https://www.useyourlocal.com/pubs/old-captains-house-egremont-86902/
There was an inquest held into the death of a miner William Simpson in 1905 that was held at the Ship in Bigrigg.
http://www.dmm.org.uk/news19/9050316.htm
Lease of the 'Ship Inn' and land at Bigrigg 1887
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/1327e5e4-bb92-4f95-95cf-af2e023a3b51
Sandra
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Hi to Ayemas and Sandra, My Great, Great Grandfather was a Thomas Davidson who was the Landlord of the Ship Launch Inn after retiring from the Army until his death in 1897. He was married to a Margaret McLaughlin and one of their sons, a Charles Davidson was my Great Grandfather. He married a Margaret Maude Tidyman. They ended up in Southern Rhodesia where my Grandfather John Davidson and his siblings were born. I see that in your postings, the name Tidyman was mentioned several times. I hope that this information may be of interest to you and I would appreciate any information that you may have on my ancestors.
Regards,
Graham D.
Hi Graham.
Welcome to Rootschat.
Almost a year since you posted, sorry never noticed your post for some reason.
You may already have alot of information so it is difficult to know what exactly you are looking for.
Hopefully there may be something in these snippets below.
Margaret Maud TIDYMAN - mentioned on Geneanet
https://gw.geneanet.org/katben?n=tidyman&oc=&p=margaret+maud
Background info.
1891 census 68 North Road. - Ship Inn.
Thomas Davidson aged 67 years. Innkeeper.
Margaret Davidson aged 46 years.
Robert Davidson aged 26 years.
Laura Davidson aged 19 years. Dress Maker.
1881 Brewery Lane Egremont
Thomas Davidson 57 Head. Serjeant Irish Rifle Vols Chelsea Pensioner.
Margaret Davidson 37 Wife
Robert Davidson 16 Son
Oliver H. Davidson 14 Son (H is Horatio)
Mary H. Davidson 12 Daughter
Laura Davidson 10 Daughter
Charles D. Davidson 7 Son
1871 census Egremont Cumberland.
Thomas Davidson 47 Head
Margaret Davidson 28 Wife
Thomas Davidson 8 Son
Robert Davidson 6 Son
Olive H Davidson 4 Son
Mary H Davidson 2 Daughter
Sarah Rabb 15 Servant
UK, Royal Hospital Chelsea Pensioner Soldier Service Records, 1760-1920
Sergeant Thomas Davidson 1823 Belfast Antrim.
Enlistment Age 18 Discharge Age 39
Enlistment Year 1841 Discharge Year 1862
Regiment Forty Fifth Regt of Infantry
Regimental Number 2013
Sandra
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You have probably seen this entry.
FIND A GRAVE
Egremont Cemetery Egremont, Cumberland.
Thomas Davidson (aged 72 years) - Innkeeper - Died at North Road - Buried C Con 222 - cost of grave £523
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/232682060/thomas-davidson
also the daughter Mary Helen Scanlan died 16 March 1895 at the Ship Launch Inn - aged 26 years - plus her infant children.
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Son Robert Davidson passed away in Southern Zambia - 19 February 1947
spouse Sarah Ann Davidson. son John Falcon Davidson.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QPHF-8RW6
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CS3M-4QM4-6?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQPHF-8RW6&action=view
FIND A GRAVE
1864 - 1947
Livingstone Old Cemetery Livingstone, Southern, Zambia.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/217840416/robert-davidson
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Image of the (closed) Ship Launch Inn, North Road, Egremont here:
https://www.closedpubs.co.uk/cumberland/egremont_shiplaunch.html (https://www.closedpubs.co.uk/cumberland/egremont_shiplaunch.html)
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A side-by-side map view. The marked Inn is the Ship Launch Inn. On the satellite image it is the building with a white car parked outside, now a private house, no. 68 North Road as seen on Streetview, where the visual match to the image of the Ship Launch Inn is 100% (configuration of door and windows, extension at the left, low wall separating it from next house to the right).
https://tinyurl.com/3rjwkeyu (https://tinyurl.com/3rjwkeyu)
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The son Oliver Horatio Davidson - UK, Royal Hospital Chelsea Pensioner Soldier Service Records, 1760-1920
Oliver Davidson - 1866 Egremont Cumberland. (aged 18 years)
Regiment Border Regimental Number 698
Attestation Paper Yes
Christening Record for Thomas Davidson gives birth 27 November 1864
1881 census "Northumberland"
Thomas Davidson - Ord Seaman - Royal Navy -
UK, Royal Navy Registers of Seamen's Services, 1848-1939
Thomas Davidson - Birth Date 4 Aug 1862 Egremont, Cumberland
First Service Date 18 Jan 1878 - First Ship Served On Impregnable
Last Service Date 8 Aug 1883
Last Ship Served On Northumberland
Service Number 103669
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Looking at the births - Telford - Tidyman had a son Ponsonby Telford - Birth registered Dec 1911 at Whitehaven - 10b 1262
Ponsonby was buried at Egremont 20/4/1925 - aged 13 years - F Uncon 326 - deceased address 20 nelson Square. Castle Croft. Egremont.
Sandra
Do you know what Ponsonby Telford died of? He was my mums brother and didn`t really talk about him. Thankyou
Sorry didn't see your request. You would need the death certificate to confirm the cause of death.
Sandra
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Laura Davidson - daughter of Thomas and Margaret - George Pearson Watson.
Robert and Margaret Davidson were witnesses
marriage - 18 November 1898 - Cape Province. South Africa.
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/sources/GSGH-291
Laura Watson (Born) Davidson. 1874 - 22 April 1948 (aged 74 years) widow
Event Place Pinetown, Natal, South Africa.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:8GYK-Y3PZ
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C912-YRZZ?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A8GYK-Y3PZ&action=view
married to George Pearson Watson (1917 - killed in an accident at de beers Kimberley)
Two children listed :- Laura Marguerita Wakefield (Watson) and Robert George Watson.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CS7R-XQCY-1?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AQPHR-STFF&action=view
The record for George Pearson Watson gives death date as 12 April 1918 Beaconsfield. Kimberley.
Cape Province. South Africa.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:W6CM-VKT2
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q2HT-L25Z
Sandra
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Marriage of Oliver Horatio Davidson to Daisy Emily Baines - 3 August 1914 - Grahamstown, Albany. Cape Province. South Africa.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:6ZH5-ZMRB
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C9BR-C3KV-M?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6ZH5-ZMRB&action=view
passed away - 27 November 1917 Germiston, Transvaal, South Africa.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C91P-83WJ?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A7624-RWMM&action=view
FIND A GRAVE
Primrose Cemetery - Primrose, Ekurhuleni Metropolitan Municipality, Gauteng, South Africa.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/227359924/oliver-h-davidson
Sandra
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Hi Sandra, Thank you so very much for your reply and for all the info you have gathered in such a short time. I am amazed. I don't know how to thank you. I get so despondent when trying to find information and keep coming up with zero. My big stumbling blocks are Thomas's (b 1824 ) correct birth place, some searches show Scotland and some show Belfast, Ireland. His wife Margaret's death info is also difficult. I had 1921 but that was not her, so don't know what happened to her after Thomas's death in 1896. I eventually got their marriage certificate. 28th June 1859 in Preston. It gave his father as a Robert Davidson who was a butler by profession. It gave her father as a Laughlin Mc Laughlin who was a Broker by profession. But trying to find their parents is like trying to find a needle in a haystack. If you have any info on them, I would appreciate it if you would pass it on to me.
Once again, thank you so much,
Regards,
Graham.
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Thank you Graham.
Margaret McLoughlin Davidson went to South Africa and passed away 17 October 1920 Kimberley Cape Province South Africa. Entry said born Ireland ??
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:WXCB-372M
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-95FS-9KC?view=index&personArk=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3AWXCB-372M&action=view
Sandra
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Wow, you are fantastic. I think I need to come to you for lessons. It is starting to appear that the family all somehow went to or ended up in Kimberley, South Africa. My Great Grandfather, Charles definitely spent time in Kimberley before moving up to Southern Rhodesia ( Bush Tick Mine, south of Bulawayo ) where he and his wife, Margaret Maude Tidyman, had most of their children. He then went off prospecting and was never seen again. That's the next piece of my puzzle, as it is not known where he went off to.
Thanks again, you are a star.
Regards,
Graham Davidson.
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Tried Rhodesia but nothing came to light. Maybe he might turn up one day.
Noticed, your tree had Margaret Maude death as 1 Feb 1954 Bulawayo. S. Rhodesia. (aged 81 years)
Was Charles still alive then or had he disappeared long before that, he would have been similar age ?
Sandra
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Margaret Maude's death was on 24th March 1954 on her Death Certificate and it states she was a widow. Her late husband Charles died in about 1926.