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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: Rose on Tuesday 28 January 14 19:26 GMT (UK)

Title: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Tuesday 28 January 14 19:26 GMT (UK)
Hi, You have all given me invaluable advice on some of my other Dublin families and hope your eyes are better than mine on reading the church register for a birth for Dorothea/Dora Rooney on the irishgenealogy website.

Dorothea Rooney baptised 21st November 1870 at St Agatha. Parents Thomas Rooney and Mary Purcell. Record is the one right of the bottom of the church register. In the last column is something written I can't decipher except maybe the first word is 'parents'.

Many thanks.

Rose

Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism Dublin - another pair of eyes please
Post by: aghadowey on Tuesday 28 January 14 19:34 GMT (UK)
Here's the link to one of the church records- which says "The church register page containing this record has not yet been imaged."
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/1834800107266

This might be the other one that you found- unfortunately the image is very dark and I couldn't make it out either but since it's an R.C. register quite likely in Latin (as the child's name, Dorothea, is probably not the name her family called her by)
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/85a6e90107267
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/reels/st_lawrence_mf_1853-1880_ba_0654.pdf

Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism Dublin - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Tuesday 28 January 14 19:45 GMT (UK)
Hi There

There is a deciphering part to this site where I would post your query as I don't know what sort of magnifiers those people use but they've gotten to the end of some tricky stuff for me !

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism Dublin - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Tuesday 28 January 14 21:34 GMT (UK)
Many thanks. I have posted as advised.

Another brick wall as I can find no marriage for Thomas and Mary. I have Dora's birth certificate where her name is stated as Dora. Her marriage gives her father's name as Thomas Rooney. I haven't been able to get any further back or found any of those mentioned in the 1901 or 1911 census. I know Dora didn't die until 1915.

Any thoughts much appreciated.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Tuesday 28 January 14 21:41 GMT (UK)
Hi There

Are you saying that you can't find Dora on the 1901 or 1911 Irish Census ?

Whom did she marry, where and when ?

It might be possible that re the latin on the baptism Dora and her parents may have been from out of town - sure we'll see what the decipher'ers come up with !

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Tuesday 28 January 14 21:50 GMT (UK)
She married Patrick Oglesby - sometimes known as Peter on 13th February 1888 at St Andrews. They had 5 children that I know of between 1888 and 1899 living in Mecklenburgh Street, Lower Tyrone Street and Montgomery Street in 1899. She is featured in the prison records regularly up until 1914.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Tuesday 28 January 14 22:01 GMT (UK)
This one is interesting

a Patrick Oglesby with a daughter called Dorothy - coincidence ???

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Mountjoy/Summerhill/28978/

It says he is married a year and with one child - so that makes the William and Dorothy children of a first wife - are you sure Dora didn't die 'til 1915 ?

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Tuesday 28 January 14 22:11 GMT (UK)
Yes, I have her death record from Glasnevin. Peter Oglesby was the informant and she is listed as a labourer's wife. He didn't die until 1919. Interesting that he wasn't buried in the same grave but with other Oglesby family members when she was the first in the grave.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Tuesday 28 January 14 22:17 GMT (UK)
Those Oglesby's are certainly proving elusive alround !?

I'm trying to think might there have been other versions of the surname ?!

I'm just searching by OG* but nothing good coming up

I've even tried just D (for Dora) O for Oglesby as this is how people in hospitals and institutions show up but nothing great either ??

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:02 GMT (UK)
A result on the church register entry.

I had looked again and thought I could work out one of the bottom words as 'junctis mat... and wondered if this meant that her parents hadn't married and a kind person on the deciphering board agreed.They interpreted as 'ex Parentibus non Junctis in Matrimonio' meaning 'from parents not joined in marriage'.

I wonder how common it was. This is the first I have found.

No wonder I couldn't find a marriage for Thomas and Mary! My mother in law says that her father always said his mother (Dora Rooney) was a Delaney so I have searched for a marriage for Dora, but not found a link so I fear that is the end for Thomas and Mary.

Many thanks.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:06 GMT (UK)
Hi Rose

Well done to the deciphering board - they are fab !

As much as it's the end of the road for Thomas and Mary, at least it's a more conclusive end !

Isn't it amazing how that one little line of scribble at the edge of a document from over 100 years ago can mean so much !

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:08 GMT (UK)
I've just spotted that on this document she went by her mother's surname of Purcell !!

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/fe5c320135593

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:12 GMT (UK)
Hi There

Just a thought - the Christian name of Dora (and it's variations was not a majorly common one yet.

In unmarried couples I have usually seen the daughter being given the woman's mother's name (as opposed to the customary father's mother)

I think this Mary Purcell is worth looking into as her mother's name is Dora !

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/fc30f30183653

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:14 GMT (UK)
OOOOHHHH OK I'm jumping WAYYYYYYYYYY ahead of myself

BUT if my theory is correct then Mary Purcell went on to marry !

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/cc05e40068759

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:19 GMT (UK)
Again

All this to be double checked

But this is a good match for Mary Purcell McCabe

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Mountjoy/Walls_Cottages/1323795/

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:47 GMT (UK)
Tara, you have given me a lot to think about! I think it all fits.

David is my mother in law's father. I have his birth certificate and it gives his mother as Dora Oglesby nee ROONEY.

I hadn't seen the baptism record before.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 20:52 GMT (UK)
Yes

I think the baptism just proves Dora's queries as to her parentage.

Re everything else, yes, please go through with a fine toothcomb but all the names are certainly adding up, even to your David Oglesby most likely being named after Dora's grandfather !

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Wednesday 29 January 14 21:41 GMT (UK)
Many thanks Tara.

Once again you have been able to find what I couldn't, and I think it is all right, even the census. No sign yet in 1911.

I will ask my mother in law about the McCabe link. She is 94 and may have mixed the name with Delany.

Your help is much appreciated. I was ready to give up on that one.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 21:46 GMT (UK)
Well this is super interesting

In 1911 - look where David McCabe is living - Dunne Street

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Dublin/Mountjoy/Dunne_Street/17672/

Isn't that the address that Dora was born at ?!

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Wednesday 29 January 14 21:55 GMT (UK)
Yes it was, and number 2 too!

This will take some time to sort out.

Rose
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Wednesday 29 January 14 21:59 GMT (UK)
Gosh - this is exciting - tee hee !

Way too much of a coincidence if you ask me.

I'll leave you to see can you sort it all out ...

Good Luck !

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: dathai on Thursday 30 January 14 09:00 GMT (UK)
Very interesting
David Peter McCabe bapt Irish Genealogy June 1880
35 Coles Lane
Sponsor Mary Purcell (step mother) to who?
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 09:43 GMT (UK)
Hi There Dathai

Yup, that's an interesting one !

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/b468020198428

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: dathai on Thursday 30 January 14 10:09 GMT (UK)
Coincidence
Marriage 1881 St Marys Pro Cathedral Aug 1881
Thos Warren to Mary Anne Reilly both of Coles Lane(not saying related)
but the witness may be of interest
Mary Purcell 13 Rotunda Market off Coles Lane.
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 10:23 GMT (UK)
Just looking at dates:

5th April 1880 Patrick McCabe and Mary Purcell married

21 June 1880 David Peter McCabe born

OOPPS

We also spoke yesterday of the address '2 Dunnes Street' - where Dora (Purcell / Rooney) was born and David McCabe is living on the 1911 Irish Census

Just found another child of Patrick and Mary who was BORN at this address

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/b027250112123

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 10:28 GMT (UK)
Patrick McCabe and Dorothy Purcell both as witness' on this one

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/37d8350113738

HUM - I wonder is that Dorothy Doran Purcell OR Dorothy Purcell / Rooney

When did Dorothy Purcell Rooney marry Patrick Oglesby ?

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 10:32 GMT (UK)
Marriage of Patrick McCabe's parents

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/83bee40081184

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 10:38 GMT (UK)
Dora Rooney marriage with a Patrick Oglesby on the same page

Dora Rooney
Jan-Feb-Mar 1888
Dublin South
Vol 2 Page 699

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 10:42 GMT (UK)
So back to this one then

http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/37d8350113738

That makes Patrick McCabe and his step daughter Dora Purcell / Rooney as witness'

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 16:12 GMT (UK)
Hi There

The Glasnevin Site

Shows a 1 Day Old Patrick McCabe dying in 1907 with an address of 2 Dunne Street.

Tara
Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: Rose on Thursday 30 January 14 22:23 GMT (UK)
A big thank you for all your help. I was thinking i would have to give up on this one.

I have been overwhelmed by all the information you have uncovered on the Purcell/McCabe/Rooney triangle. I have put it all together and am convinced it all fits and is the same family.I looked at the step-mother entry.

I can't thank you enough.

My Oglesby's are certainly interesting.

Best wishes.

Rose

Title: Re: Dorathea/Dora ROONEY baptism St Agatha Dublin 1870 - another pair of eyes please
Post by: taramcdsmall on Thursday 30 January 14 22:31 GMT (UK)
Glad to be able to help Rose.

Good Luck

Tara