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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: M.K. Hawes on Friday 10 January 14 17:47 GMT (UK)
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Hello: I have just found this wonderful site and have been reading for a few days. I recently found that my ancestor, Thomas A. Dillon, had two middle names, making him Thomas Addis Emmet Dillon. I started a search on him, and before I'd finished typing, up popped Thomas Addis Emmet, an Irish patriot or rebel depending on your viewpoint?
The article on Emmet mentioned a place in Dublin, called the White Bull, owned by John Dillon. Emmet was eventually jailed and later emmigrated to New York. I have to believe there is a close connection between my Dillon ancestor, his namesake, Thomas Addis Emmet and John Dillon. I am in the middle of the US, wondering the best way to find records on Thomas Dillon, his possible father John Dillon and any other family. Thomas Dillon was born in Dublin about 1794 plus or minus a year or two.
Thanks- M.K.
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Hi There MK and welcome to rootschat !
An unusual variation of names . . . . .
I did come across this . . .
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/ecc65b0184978
Can you give us as much information as you have on Thomas Dillon first
ie - when did he leave Ireland ?
Do you have his parents names ?
Whom did he marry ?
Where in the US did he settle ?
What was his occupation ?
What paperwork do you have on him ?
Lots of questions but helps everyone when they are looking for records for you LOL !
Tara
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Hi There
This is another baptism to the Addis Emmet couple !
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/696a890184894
Tara
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Hi There
These people seem to have a LOT of info on the Addis Emmet family - I would try and contact them !
http://genforum.genealogy.com/emmett/messages/327
I was wondering MIGHT one of Thomas Addis Emmet's sisters have married a Dillon therefore making her children 'Addis Emmet Dillons' ?!
Tara
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Thanks for your replies, taramc. I didn't think info. on my ancestor's life over here would help much for searching over there, but here is what I have:
My 4xg.grandfather, Thomas A. Dillon had two middle names; Addis and Emmet/Emmett.
On November 24, 1821, he swore an affidavit, renouncing all allegiance and fidelity to.......particularly to the King of Great Britian and Ireland. November 7, 1821, he signs another document, re: his intent to become a citizen of the United States, was born in Dublin, is 27 years of age and an Irishman; that he migrated from the province of Upper Canada, in March, 1814. Both these documents (copies) are in my files, and both signed as, "Thomas A. Dillon."
He married Lucy Spike- date unknown- had several children and died in 1833, survived by his wife and children. He is listed in the 1830 US census for the town of Phelps, Ontario County, New york and he died there. According to the Phelps town historian, he was an inn keeper.
As I typed his name for an internet search, that's when Thomas Addis Emmet turned up; a member of the United Irishmen. A site I can't seem to locate again, mentioned that they would meet at the White Bull owned by John Dillon. There does seem to be a lot of Addis and Emmet combinations out there. I like your suggestion that perhaps an Emmet- female married a Dillon. Perhaps the John Dillon of the White Bull?
This is getting very interesting....M.K.
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From googling last night i found a reference that the White Bull was a public house in Thomas St ,Dublin.
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Hi There
The reason for so many questions is to see what information that you already have verified for this person after they emmigrated.
You need as much exact detail as possible before even starting to look for Irish records
It is super hard to get pre 1864 records in Ireland without knowing where exactly the person came from so that you can search to see if parish records even still exist.
I really think the link that I sent you re the other people researching the same family would be your best bet as they really do seem to have already done a lot of work and should be able to point you in the right direction.
Best Of Luck
Tara
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this may be of interest
http://humphrysfamilytree.com/Blennerhassett/emmet.html
also you might try to see a copy of this book - this is from the National Library Catalogue - but it possibly is available in other libraries.
http://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000132922
annclare
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Thanks to all who have replied and those who are reading. And thanks to Dathai for confirming the existence of the White Bull pub. Whatever website I found earlier for the pub seems to have disappeared. Now, when I search the White Bull, I get a website for a gentleman who claims to channel the spirit of a Native American Indian chief named White Bull??!!
I may have caused some confusion with my first post. I am searching DILLON, not Emmet. My Dillon ancestor, Thomas Addis Emmet DILLON (born 1793/94) was obviously named for a famous member of the United Irishmen, Thomas Addis Emmet. I found a reference that said the United Irismen including Mr. Emmett used to congregate in the 1790's at the White Bull owned by John Dillon. My theory is that John Dillon having known Mr. Emmet and naming his son after him, might be my known ancestor's father.
I have no idea if there would be property, tax or church records etc. from that time period. Also, I don't know when Thomas A.E. Dillon emigrated or if he was alone or with family when he did.
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From inside the book The United Irishmen Their Lives and Times by Richard Robert Madden circa 1916 available at New York Public Library or read full text on internet. had a quick browse found a letter from an informer stating that he was introduced to the United Irish Men by James Dillon Cousin of Patrick Dillon of The White Bull ,Thomas St.
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The trial of John McIntosh 1st October 1803 mentions one of the witnesses staying at the Widow Dillons at the White Bull Thomas St.
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Hi,
I was very interested in your post as I have in my possession a partial draft of an extract taken from the 'Rebellion Papers' held by the National Archives here in Dublin Ref No. 620/11/138/13 concerning the examination of John Fleming taken before a Magistrate on the 3rd September 1803.
It goes on to state that Mr Fleming was in the service of Mrs Mary Dillon, Inn Holder of Thomas Street Dublin in the capacity of ''hosteler' during the previous 12 months and he gave evidence against a number of people whom he claimed were involved in rebellious activities including Robert Emmet and two brothers named Commiskey from Lucan, one of whom I think might have been my G.G.G. Grandfather.
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Dathai: I was able to read on-line, the book you menioned. Colur: your information was interesting. I wonder if Mary Dillon was my Dillon ancestor's mother. The first reference I found (and haven't found since) had John Dillon as the owner of the White Bull. But no matter, the Dillon family was there. And the Emmett brothers spent time there and my ancestor was named for one of them.
Does anybody know what kind of records might be available from that time period, i.e. 1790's to 1820's? My ancestor was born in Dublin in 1793/1794 in Dublin. Is Dublin only the city or does it also refer to a larger division such as what we call a county over here?
Thanks, M.K.
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From a book review 2003 Robert Emmett ,A Life.
Where the United Irishmen met at the yard in Marshalsea Lane at the rear of the White Bull inn ,the proprietors were Patrick and Mary Dillon ,United Irish sympathisers who had lost relatives in the Kildare rebellion of 98.
So there is a possibility he was born in Kildare.
It just goes to show there is info to be found somewhere but how to source it is another kettle of fish.
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I wonder if perhaps the family lived in Kildare prior to moving to Dublin. I need to look at a map. At any rate, my ancestor signed a declaration of intent to become a U.S. citizen, in which he states he was born in Dublin and was 27 years and emigrated from the province of Upper Canada in 1814. The document is signed "Thomas A Dillon" and dated November 7th 1821.
So, Thomas or the family went first to Canada and then to Ontario County, New York.
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Hi
Tara put up a link to a website earlier and while searching for something else I came across a small bit of information regarding Thomas Addis Emmet
http://www.europeana.eu/portal/record/2023822/gv4_nbl_lh_nbl_show5_php_id_066005.html
Type his name in the search box and look at Burkes Landed Gentry of Ireland 1976
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Hi Jnoone any time i click on that link it brings up Thoms Directory.
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Hi Dathai
There is a search box directly above where it says Thoms Street Directory to the right of the Europeana think culture icon.
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jnoone thanks i have just returned having browsed the site and found that there are several things you can enter in the search box,i thought it was just for Thoms Directories.
thanks.
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Thanks to all who are reading and for the information about the Whit Bull Inn, owned by the DILLONS. I'm sure my Dillon ancestor must be related to them. I'm wondering if anybody out there knows what kind of B/M/D or baptism records might exist for Dublin, 1790's. Would there be civil records or church or tax/property records? Thanks...
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:) I cannot tell you how totally excited I am to find this information!!! My name is Colleen and I have been searching for information on Thomas Addis Emmett Dillon for a few years now in order to connect him to my ggg grandfather and Civil War Medal of Honor recipient Walter P. Johnston. Walter's mother was Harriett Dillon of Phelps New York and the only information I had on him was being born about 1800 in Ireland and married to Lucy Spike, who by the way, is a direct descendant of Mayflower pilgrim Edward Fuller. Needless to say, when I learned his name was not just Thomas A. Dillon, but Thomas Addis Emmett Dillon, I also became interested in the Thomas Addis Emmett connection in Ireland.
I am happy to share any information I may have that would be of interest to anyone and look forward to learning more myself. Unbelievable!!!
Colleen
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Whoa!! Colleen! We're cousins- of some sort. I found the whole name for Thomas mostly by accident. Are you on the U.S. Ancestry.com? I'm new here on Rootschat, so I need to figure out how to send you my email address. I have scans of a few documents from Thomas, back in Ontario county, New York. I'll bet we can put this together here for Dillons in the U.S., but what I really hope for is the next generation back in Ireland.
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Hey MK! Yes looks like we are cousins. I am in the Chicago area. But my ggg grandfather was a Walter P. Johnston, who received the Medal of Honor at 13 years of age. More on that later. That's an interesting story in itself. Anyway, Walter's mother was Harriet Dillon of Phelps, New York, born around 1820/21. I have that documented. However, when trying to look back further, I came across her name in another genealogy forum as being the daughter of a Thomas A. Dillon, born around 1800 from Ireland and buried in the Old Pioneer Cemetery there. I also have her father's birthplace listed as Ireland as well on a census and death certificate. Thomas was also married to Lucy Spike, who is descended from Edward Fuller of the Mayflower. (So that might mean, and probably does mean, you are a Mayflower descendant as well!) Also there was mention of him being the proprietor of the Vienna House in Phelps. Anyway, this information was on another genealogy forum similar to this (I can send you the link) but was so dated, that I have been unable to contact the person who posted it, nor is it cited with any sources, except one I believe, which is 200 Years of the Town of Phelps by John Parmalee. But not sure if the children's names are what was in the book, or just that Thomas Dillon was the proprietor of the Vienna House. Tonight I just sent off an email to the Phelps Historical Society so we'll see where that takes us.
So basically, I came across the double middle name thing in another book that mentioned him and Lucy having another daughter who married someone by the name of Dickerson. That's where I got my source from of the two middle names. But I, like you, have been on and off with this Thomas Addis Emmet connection ever since. I agree it is a great mystery and one I'd like to get to the bottom of as well as confirming beyond a reasonable doubt that Harriett was one of Thomas and Lucy's children, although I am 99% sure she was based on a few things. Just no hard proof which I need as she is my final connection to the Mayflower Fullers that I need to submit to the Mayflower Society for membership.
I am new here too and I am on ancestry, although my account is lapsed right now. But I do still use it, and you can inbox me through there if you like at cvm4370. Look forward to hearing from you!
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Hello Colleen: The Emmet connection is that the Emmett brothers were members of the United Irishmen who used to meet at the White Bull Inn, which was apparently owned by the Dillons as per earlier postings. I just don't know what kind of records are available such as church or legal records that might prove who Thomas' parents were.
The other genealogy book that showed a daughter of Thomas marrying in, is where I found his complete name. I will try to reach you through your Ancestry name, as I should go back there to see what I can find.
Are there any Dillons still in Dublin?
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I have a close friend who lives in Ireland and he told me that when his own father tried to do some family history research that there had been a fire in about 1922 at the place in Dublin, that houses the births marriages and deaths records with almost a total loss of all records. So this creates a problem. Wondering about church records though. Now, whether or not there is a way that the information are looking for can be obtained from another source, that I do not know. I'm sure there's still some Dillons in Dublin, but the question is if they're OUR Dillons!
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Hi Colleen: I will email you shortly. I need to pull up my records and see if the stuff is already scanned or not. I am still hopeful we can find definitive information in Dublin/Ireland to prove who Thomas' parents were.