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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) => Topic started by: LizzieL on Friday 03 January 14 14:38 GMT (UK)
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I’m trying to find out a bit more about my 3 x great grandparents William Carr and Sarah Freeman. William and Sarah were married on 25 Nov 1817 at Bilton Ainsty.
I have birth / baptism details for 7 children (Ann, John, Elizabeth, Jane, William, Thomas and Harriet) at Bilton Ainsty.
In 1841 William and Sarah were living at Bilton, Tockwith with the three youngest children. William is listed as 50 (1791) and Sarah as 40 (1801) - but would be rounded down.
In 1861, William and Sarah are living in Tockwith, William is 68 (1793) born Cattall and Sarah is 65 (1796) born Ripon. The ages don’t quite match with 1841 taking rounding into account, but I can’t see that they can be anyone other than my ancestors.
I have been unable to find them in 1851, so I can’t confirm age and POB. I can’t find them in 1871 either but they might have died by then, although I haven’t found either death on Freebmd. Plenty of William and Sarah Carrs but none with right age.
I have concentrated on Tadcaster reg district, but I did have a look at Leeds and Hunslet where two of their children moved to after marriage.
If I could confirm POB and approx year I would know where to concentrate on looking for baptisms.
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I have been unable to find them in 1851
Here's the 1851 reference - correctly indexed as William & Sarah Carr aged 58 and 55 respectively
HO107 Piece 2352 Folio 711 Page 13
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1871 for Sarah - correct spelling/age and birthyear. Looks like Tockwith then came under Wetherby not Tadcaster as I couldn't find a death for him either
RG10 Piece 4294 Folio 20 Page 4
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Deaths March qtr 1871
William Carr aged 77 Wetherby 9a 95
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Thank you very much. Did you find the 1851 census on FindMyPast? I'm having difficulty getting it to find the census by reference but 1871 opens OK. Pity William didn't quite make it to the census in @71. But it does confirm I have to look for Sarah in Ripon.
The nearest baptism I have found for William is Hunsingore in 13 Mar 1793, not far from Cattal
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I don't use FindMyPast - the 1851 is correctly indexed as Carr on Ancestry so perhaps just use surname Carr birthyear 1793 and birthplace Cattall to search if you are using a different website
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I may have another lead on Sarah Freeman.
In the 1851 census her son John Carr and his wife Elizabeth have lodging or visiting them a William Leeming (b Pateley bridge) described as his cousin. I have recently corresponded with someone who has an on line tree (on their own website) which contains a lot of Leemings from the same area. She confirms this William Leeming was the illegitimate son of Jane Leeming who was born in Ripon. Jane has several sisters including a Sarah bapt 19 Feb 1796 in Ripon. The tree owner has not researched any possible marriage for Sarah. So if my Sarah was Jane Leeming's sister it would make William Leeming and John Carr first cousins.
So either Sarah married a Freeman and was widowed and subsequently married William Carr. She was about 21 when married William so she would be quite young for a previous marriage.
Or she changed her name to Freeman.
Or the transcription is an error and should be Sarah Leeming.
I have found the marriage on both Familysearch and Ancestry, but only transcription, no link to scan of register. There is also a reference to the marriage on 23rd Nov 1817 (instead of 25th) I assume this is the 3rd reading of Banns as this date would be a Sunday.
Does anyone have access to Bilton Ainsty marriage records at this date to check the name and condition of Sarah, please. ?
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I've now found an image of the marriage record (BT) for William Carr and Sarah on 25 Nov 1817 at Bilton Ainsty.
It clearly gives her name as Sarah Freeman, but being the BT it still could be a bad copy from the original record. She is recorded as spinster, so no previous marriage to look for. The witnesses were George Adkins and Benjamin Thompkinson. They don't seem to be witnessing any other marriages on neighbouring pages so I guess they were friends of bride and / or groom rather than parish officials. Their surnames are not ones I have come across as connected to the family.
Can anyone please help find out how William Leeming (listed as cousin to Sarah and William's son John Carr) is actually related. I think this will be the key to the puzzle.
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The Carr Family Tockwith.
Carre, no first name given or wife mentioned, child Anne Carre. Father to Wylliam Carre born 1573
Wylliam Carre born 1573 Tockwith, Bilton Ainsty Yorkshire / England. Married Jenit Lambe.26/10/1593. Jayne Carre Daughter born 05/09/1590 ( Tockwith ). Robert Carr. ( married ) Ruth Wood.15/05/1718 ( Tockwith ). No children recorded. William Carr. ( Agricultural Labourer ) born Cattal married Sarah Freeman 25/11/1817 ( Tockwith ). Sarah Freeman born ( Ripon ) no birth date. Children, Anne Carr. ( christened ) 23/01/1820 ( Tockwith ). John Carr. ( christened )02/12/1821 ( Tockwith ) Elizabeth Carr ( christened ) 22/02/1824 ( Tockwith ). Jayne Carr ( christened )14/11/1826 ( Tockwith ) Amos William Carr ( christened ) 28/04/1829 ( Tockwith ). Thomas Carr ( christened ) 13/11/1831 ( Tockwith ). Harriet Carr ( christened ) 29/01/1835 ( Tockwith ). Amos William Carr. ( christened ) 28/04/1829. Married. Eliza Brown Burley. ( No marriage date ) Children. John Robert Carr. ( christened ) 28/09/1854 ( Alne ) York in the sub district of Easingwold. John Robert Carr. Married. Eliza Alice Pickup 16/04/1883 at Pokeno New Zealand. Children, James, John, William, Elizabeth, and Annie. After the death of John Robert Carr, Eliza remarried to James Bruce Lockhart. Children, Jean (Watt ) Margaret (Marshall ), Lillian ( Glenny ), Katherine Grace ( Patterson ). James killed 1st world war. Fred ( deceased ) Charles ( adopted ) Herbet ( illegitimate ) deceased. John Carr, son of John Robert Carr born 30/11/1885 at Mercer New Zealand. He is my grandfather. John Carr ( married ) Faith Blick in Wanganui New Zealand in 1915. They had two children, Verdun John Carr and Joan. Verdun John Carr ( married ) Doris Hargreaves in Wanganui New Zealand on the 18/03/1940. Children, John William Carr. born. 05/08/1940. Michelle Geraldine Carr born. 04/09/1941. (me). Robert Graeme Carr born. 21/08/1943. Philip Wayne Carr born. 21/06/1952 at Pahiatua. Other 3 children born in Wanganui. John William Carr ( married ) Robin Barry in Wanganui New Zealand in 1959. Children. John Stephen Carr born. 24/06/1960. Jillian Anne Carr born. 04/10/1961. Craig Warren Carr born. 09/01/1964. Mathew Dean Carr born.22/10/1970. Children to Jillian Anne Carr. Nadine Faith Carr born. 27/07/1984. Jaydon Tumi born. 19/01/1995. Children to Craig Warren Carr. ( twins ) Michael Carr born. 25/10/1983. Paul Carr born.25/10/1983. ( No second names recorded ). Michelle Geraldine Carr (me ) married. Christopher Michael Anthony Maher on the 06/11/1976 in Elwood Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. ( children. Nil ). Robert Graeme Carr. ( unmarried, children. Nil ). Philip Wayne Carr. married. Jan Tasker ( no marriage date recorded ) Children. Jason Carr, no birth date recorded. Ryan Carr adopted. ( no birth date recorded ). Philip Wayne Carr. remarried Yvonne Sammons ( no marriage date recorded, children Nil. Joan Carr, sister to Verdun John Carr, married. Alan Selwyn Webby, Wanganui New Zealand ( no marriage date recorded ) Children. Kaylene Webby, ( no birth date recorded ). Colin Webby. ( no birth date recorded ). Kaylene Webby married. Stephen Town ( no marriage recorded ). Children. Cameron, Samuel and Kate, ( no birth dates recorded ). Information compiled. 14/10/2006. for future generations of this family. By Michelle Geraldine Maher. ( nee Carr ).
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After the death of John Robert Carr, Eliza remarried to James Bruce Lockhart. Children, Jean (Watt ) Margaret (Marshall ), Lillian ( Glenny ), Katherine Grace ( Patterson ). James killed 1st world war. Fred ( deceased ) Charles ( adopted ) Herbet ( illegitimate ) deceased. John Carr, son of John Robert Carr born 30/11/1885 at Mercer New Zealand.
Hi Michelle ,
In which country were the offspring of Eliza and James Bruce Lockhart born ?
I have a Jane /Jean Lockhart born 19 Jan 1900 in Queensland ,Australia
Thanks ,
Ray
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The Carr Family Tockwith.
Carre, no first name given or wife mentioned, child Anne Carre. Father to Wylliam Carre born 1573
Wylliam Carre born 1573 Tockwith, Bilton Ainsty Yorkshire / England. Married Jenit Lambe.26/10/1593. Jayne Carre Daughter born 05/09/1590 ( Tockwith ). Robert Carr. ( married ) Ruth Wood.15/05/1718 ( Tockwith ). No children recorded. William Carr. ( Agricultural Labourer ) born Cattal married Sarah Freeman 25/11/1817 ( Tockwith ). Sarah Freeman born ( Ripon ) no birth date. Children, Anne Carr. ( christened ) 23/01/1820 ( Tockwith ). John Carr. ( christened )02/12/1821 ( Tockwith ) Elizabeth Carr ( christened ) 22/02/1824 ( Tockwith ). Jayne Carr ( christened )14/11/1826 ( Tockwith ) Amos William Carr ( christened ) 28/04/1829 ( Tockwith ). Thomas Carr ( christened ) 13/11/1831 ( Tockwith ). Harriet Carr ( christened ) 29/01/1835 ( Tockwith ). Amos William Carr. ( christened ) 28/04/1829. Married. Eliza Brown Burley. ( No marriage date ) Children. John Robert Carr. ( christened ) 28/09/1854 ( Alne ) York in the sub district of Easingwold. John Robert Carr. Married. Eliza Alice Pickup 16/04/1883 at Pokeno New Zealand. Children, James, John, William, Elizabeth, and Annie. After the death of John Robert Carr, Eliza remarried to James Bruce Lockhart. Children, Jean (Watt ) Margaret (Marshall ), Lillian ( Glenny ), Katherine Grace ( Patterson ). James killed 1st world war. Fred ( deceased ) Charles ( adopted ) Herbet ( illegitimate ) deceased. John Carr, son of John Robert Carr born 30/11/1885 at Mercer New Zealand. He is my grandfather. John Carr ( married ) Faith Blick in Wanganui New Zealand in 1915. They had two children, Verdun John Carr and Joan. Verdun John Carr ( married ) Doris Hargreaves in Wanganui New Zealand on the 18/03/1940. Children, John William Carr. born. 05/08/1940. Michelle Geraldine Carr born. 04/09/1941. (me). Robert Graeme Carr born. 21/08/1943. Philip Wayne Carr born. 21/06/1952 at Pahiatua. Other 3 children born in Wanganui. John William Carr ( married ) Robin Barry in Wanganui New Zealand in 1959. Children. John Stephen Carr born. 24/06/1960. Jillian Anne Carr born. 04/10/1961. Craig Warren Carr born. 09/01/1964. Mathew Dean Carr born.22/10/1970. Children to Jillian Anne Carr. Nadine Faith Carr born. 27/07/1984. Jaydon Tumi born. 19/01/1995. Children to Craig Warren Carr. ( twins ) Michael Carr born. 25/10/1983. Paul Carr born.25/10/1983. ( No second names recorded ). Michelle Geraldine Carr (me ) married. Christopher Michael Anthony Maher on the 06/11/1976 in Elwood Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. ( children. Nil ). Robert Graeme Carr. ( unmarried, children. Nil ). Philip Wayne Carr. married. Jan Tasker ( no marriage date recorded ) Children. Jason Carr, no birth date recorded. Ryan Carr adopted. ( no birth date recorded ). Philip Wayne Carr. remarried Yvonne Sammons ( no marriage date recorded, children Nil. Joan Carr, sister to Verdun John Carr, married. Alan Selwyn Webby, Wanganui New Zealand ( no marriage date recorded ) Children. Kaylene Webby, ( no birth date recorded ). Colin Webby. ( no birth date recorded ). Kaylene Webby married. Stephen Town ( no marriage recorded ). Children. Cameron, Samuel and Kate, ( no birth dates recorded ). Information compiled. 14/10/2006. for future generations of this family. By Michelle Geraldine Maher. ( nee Carr ).
Hi Ray, It is highly possible that Jean Watt ( Lockhart ) was born in 1900 in Queensland Australia as well as most of the others relating to the Lockhart side of the family. I distinctly remember my Grandfather John Carr Son of John Robert Carr and Eliza Alice Pickup telling me that the Carrs and the Lockharts spent some time in Queensland before returning to Wanganui in New Zealand. John Carr my Grandfather and his Brother my Uncle William and James Bruce Lockhart worked in the cane fields in Queensland to earning monies before they went back to New Zealand. They left New Zealand to go to Queensland because in that time period jobs were scarce in New Zealand. As far as I am aware all of the Lockhart family members made mention of in my writings are buried in the Aramoho cemetery in Wanganui. I sincerely hope that this information has been of some assistance to you. Kindest Regards Michelle Maher nee Carr.
After the death of John Robert Carr, Eliza remarried to James Bruce Lockhart. Children, Jean (Watt ) Margaret (Marshall ), Lillian ( Glenny ), Katherine Grace ( Patterson ). James killed 1st world war. Fred ( deceased ) Charles ( adopted ) Herbet ( illegitimate ) deceased. John Carr, son of John Robert Carr born 30/11/1885 at Mercer New Zealand.
Hi Michelle ,
In which country were the offspring of Eliza and James Bruce Lockhart born ?
I have a Jane /Jean Lockhart born 19 Jan 1900 in Queensland ,Australia
Thanks ,
Ray
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Many Thanks , Michelle
I started off by wanting to learn about Jane Latta Lockhart who married John Watt in New Zealand 1928.
It looks like Jane chose to adopt the middle name Latta off her own bat , maybe after her grandmother
Jane Ann Latta , born Ireland 1830 .
Jane Lattta Watt , maintained that full name for about 30 years , after which she dropped the middle name Latta , and became Jane Watt.
Eventually she became Jean Watt .
Thank you for the information re Queensland , Australia .
In Appreciation,
Ray
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Hi Ray, the Carrs and Lockharts previously mentioned lived for a time and worked in Gympie in Queensland Australia cutting sugar cane. Interesting about Jean Watt that makes a lot of sense. What is your specific interest in the Lockhart family am personally interested in knowing. Regards Michelle.
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Hello Michelle ,
My interest is the challenge of finding a particular person , not necessarily a relative .
In the case of Jane Latta Lockhart, she married a 'Jock' Watt who was in The New Zealand Police .
My late Father mentioned a few of his contemporaries during his NZ Police days , including 'Jock' Watt.
'Jock' Watt was born in Buckie , Banffshire , Scotland .
My Father was born in Mulben , Banffshire , Scotland.
When service in the police brought the above two together they compared notes and were delighted
to learn that they each came from the same neck of the woods within Scotland.
I had asummed ( wrongly ) that Jock's wife would have been born in Scotland .
She led me a merry chase over the internet , made more difficult by her 'unofficial' middle name
Latta .
Now , as for John 'Jock' Watt's background I do not hold out much hope of finding information.
Pinning down a particular Watt-surnamed person in Buckie is difficult , without knowing names of parents ........................
All The Best ,
Ray
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The Carr Family Tockwith.
Carre, no first name given or wife mentioned, child Anne Carre. Father to Wylliam Carre born 1573
Wylliam Carre born 1573 Tockwith, Bilton Ainsty Yorkshire / England. Married Jenit Lambe.26/10/1593. Jayne Carre Daughter born 05/09/1590 ( Tockwith ). Robert Carr. ( married ) Ruth Wood.15/05/1718 ( Tockwith ). No children recorded. William Carr. ( Agricultural Labourer ) born Cattal married Sarah Freeman 25/11/1817 ( Tockwith ). Sarah Freeman born ( Ripon ) no birth date. Children, Anne Carr. ( christened ) 23/01/1820 ( Tockwith ). John Carr. ( christened )02/12/1821 ( Tockwith ) Elizabeth Carr ( christened ) 22/02/1824 ( Tockwith ). Jayne Carr ( christened )14/11/1826 ( Tockwith ) Amos William Carr ( christened ) 28/04/1829 ( Tockwith ). Thomas Carr ( christened ) 13/11/1831 ( Tockwith ). Harriet Carr ( christened ) 29/01/1835 ( Tockwith ). Amos William Carr. ( christened ) 28/04/1829. Married. Eliza Brown Burley. ( No marriage date ) Children. John Robert Carr. ( christened ) 28/09/1854 ( Alne ) York in the sub district of Easingwold.
The baptism on 28 April 1829 was of a William Carr, not Amos William Carr. He married Mary May d/o Francis May at Moor Monkton on 28 Dec 1854.
Amos (William) Carr was the son of Thomas Carr and Sarah Randerson. Some trees have his baptism date as 3 Oct 1832. I have seen image of PR and it goes straight from 2 Oct to 10th Nov, so maybe a missing record which may turn up on another page out of sequence. It would appear he married Eliza Brown Burley then left her to go to Australia and possibly remarried.