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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 23 December 13 15:43 GMT (UK)
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This is Sgt John Rowlinson. Can anyone help me with details of the Regiment he was in please?
Thanks
STG
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That looks like a Royal Artillary Cap Badge to me which is a crown mounted on a sort of cannon but I cannot swear to it as I couldn't make out the badge in enough detail when I examined your photo.
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That looks like a Royal Artillary Cap Badge to me which is a crown mounted on a sort of cannon but I cannot swear to it as I couldn't make out the badge in enough detail when I examined your photo.
I've just googled RA cap badges and see what you mean. I only have a photocopy of the photo, not the original, so there's nothing much I can do to sharpen it up.
Is the RA the same as the Royal Field Artillary, or were they different? [total military ignoramus asks]
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It looks like the Royal Field Artillery was an element of the Royal Regiment of Artillery try googling the following link by pasting it into your browser. http://www.1914-1918.net/cra.htm
Do you know which war he was in? and anything else about his dates of birth etc. ?
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It looks like the Royal Field Artillery was an element of the Royal Regiment of Artillery try googling the following link by pasting it into your browser. http://www.1914-1918.net/cra.htm
Do you know which war he was in? and anything else about his dates of birth etc. ?
I'm helping a friend with her tree and he was an uncle (by marriage, I think) of hers. She did say he was gassed and she thought he was in a mounted regiment, and I see that the RHA was part of the RA, so that's looks like it could have some element of the truth in it. She says he died 1961/62ish in Derby, but if he did I can't find any record of it (even using variations of the spelling of his SN). I've asked her to have another think to see if we can get any closer.
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Well, if he was gassed then it looks like he served as a young man in the first war especially if he was in the mounted brigade.
If she is not too sure about his death you could try to search within a five or six year range around 1961-2 to see if that gets a result.
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Well, if he was gassed then it looks like he served as a young man in the first war especially if he was in the mounted brigade.
If she is not too sure about his death you could try to search within a five or six year range around 1961-2 to see if that gets a result.
I've tried 1958-1968, but no luck.
I think I have found the death of her aunt though and that looks like 1961, so maybe she's confused the death dates for the two of them. I'll have to go back to her and check.
Thanks for your help.
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How old was her aunt when she died? It could be that John was what he called himself but he may have been registered under another name. Was he native to Derby and did he live there all his life? You might find him in a census document for 1911.
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I immediately thought of Royal Artillery but shouldn't the gun on the cap badge have a barrel? It doesn't look as if it has. The collar flashes look like grenades which the Guards use, don't they?
AJ
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Also this is post WW1 as medals weren't issued until 1921.
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collar dogs are RA.
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Hi, I would say he was in the Royal Artillery as per the cap badge and collar dogs, with the photograph being taken later than 1924 when it is widely believed that the white lanyard was swapped from being worn over the left shoulder to being worn on the right shoulder.
Regards
Frank.
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Good evening,
Jim and Frank have it spot on, Royal Artillery, post 1924. The only way to tell which branch of artillery is by the shoulder titles which we can't see. Are there any other photo's of him?
John915
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I'm really going to have to go back to friend and see if I can get further info.
All I know is that he was married 1st time in Derby in 1918, married 2nd time in Derby in 1930. Newspaper cutting for 2nd marriage says he was a tailor and "son of John Rowlinson of Staffordshire". I have found a John Rowlinson b. 1895 in Foxt, Staffs (Staffs/Derbys border) a "tailor maker" in Derby in 1911, which might be him, but who knows.
I must say that when I first saw the photo, I thought it was WWII, but friend says it's WWI.
If he was that JR b. 1895, would he still have served in some capacity in WWII (he'd have been 45 when war broke out)? Friend says he was "in his 70s" when he died.
Tomorrow I'll see if the photo from his 2nd wedding (1930) will scan and if so, I'll try to post it.
I'll be back!
STG
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The uniform looks very 1920s, certainly post WW1 and by that time the Royal Artillery had shed the differences between Field and Garrison, leaving only the Royal Horse Artllery as a specialist branch of the Royal Regiment of Artillery.
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My apologies for the size of the web address. Far too long but have never mastered the art of making them smaller.
https://www.google.com/search?q=royal+field+artillery+badge&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=jq25UsCSNY3YyAHJkoC4Dg&ved=0CEAQsAQ&biw=1067&bih=507
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The collar badges l think represent exploding grenades and are usually worn by regiments of Fusiliers.
IE, Royal Irish,Royal Scots etc
the collar badges are also worn by the Royal Artillery,and the wheel has a gun barrel running through the centre of the wheel.
If You google this. "Images for royal artillery collar badges" you will see what I mean.
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here is the cap badge I think.
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Thanks bb.
Going to try to find his first marriage cert because, as it was 1918, he might still have been enlisted and it might hold a clue.
Will be back when I have more info.
Thanks one and all for your help so far.
STG
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a service no would help
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a service no would help
Well yes indeed it would, but there are umpteen John Rowlinson's and no particular indication of which one of 'em is the one I'm after.
Let's just wait a few days and see if I can locate his first marriage cert.
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i have found severial Rowlinson who served in the RA i would need a DOB
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i would need a DOB
I wish ! ;) ;) ;)
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Good evening,
If this is indeed post 1920 then his records will be with the MOD.
This means you can at least eliminate any one with that name who left the army before 1920.
John915
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Hi, in my humble opinion this is most definately post Great war, as John915 says if post 1920 (which I suspect it definately is) then records would be with the MOD.
Regards always,
Frank.
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Good evening,
If this is indeed post 1920 then his records will be with the MOD.
This means you can at least eliminate any one with that name who left the army before 1920.
John915
to get to Sargent he would of served at least 6 years that would have him serving in the grate war
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Until I can get out and about and try to find his first marriage, I've scanned the photo from his second marriage in 1930, just in case that helps with dating etc.. He's second from the left.
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As you can see he's much younger in this so the 1st. photo must be closer to WW2.
jim
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Hi STG, So, what we have up to now is:
John Rawlinson b Abt 1895,
d Abt 1965 (puts him in his 70's) as per your friend's info,
Gassed in 1914 - 1918, so served in the Great War, BUT pictured wearing a post 1924 uniform,
The photograph of the 1930's wedding has him looking to be in his 40's which again would tie in with age at death and death date of the 1960's.
As already said if he was in the Army post 1920 then his records would be with the MOD and about 60% of first world war records were destroyed during the blitz in the second war so you would be lucky to find them.
Sorry to ramble on a bit but I'm just trying to piece together what we have :-\
Frank.
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Although it's difficult to tell in a b & w photo he looks to have the British War Medal & Victory Medal.
So if it is it would mean he served overseas 1916-18.
jim
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Yes, Frank. That about sums it up.
Am off to the Local Studies Library tomorrow (yes, it is open on a Saturday morning) to see if I can glean any info from his marriage certs. I know which church the 1930 one was held at and am hoping that would give his age and father's name. Not exactly sure where in Derby his 1918 marriage was, but I know where the bride's parents were living in 1911 (and same address in 1901 for that matter) so I'll start from that parish and see where it leads me.
The 1911 census I found for a John Rowlinson (b. 1896 in Foxt, Staffs), living in Derby, a tailor maker, is him, I think - because he's listed as nephew to the adults in the house (Alfred Wood and wife Caroline Elizabeth) and I've found a Caroline Elizabeth Rowlinson (b. 1865 Ramshorn, Staffs) who married an Alfred Wood. I've found Caroline on a couple of census records, with her parents (Robert and Mary), but no mention of a brother John (supposedly father of the chap in the photo).
Edited to say: I've just added the 1911 census into to my tree and Ancestry has thrown up a death record for a John Rowlinson in Derby in 1970, which gives a dob of 10 May 1894. Someone up-thread said they needed a dob for elimination purposes, so am hoping that helps (assuming it is the right chap, of course).
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Back from Local Studies Library with good news and bad news.
First the bad news: It would appear that his first marriage in 1918 was at Derby Registry Office, so no image available without buying the certificate, which I don't think friend will do (because she's related to his second wife, not his first). I trawled through the marriage notices in the local paper for the relevant quarter, but no luck there either. :'(
Now the good news: Found a death notice for him, which confirms he is the one who died in Q1 1970 (from the details of address, late wife, children etc), and that's the one where the indexes throw up the birth date of 10 May 1894.
Found his second marriage in 1930 (16 Aug to be exact), which shows his age as 36 and that he was a crane driver (not a tailor, as friend said - arghhh, I should have known better!) and that his father was Robert (not John as the newspaper cutting reported). Still think he's the one I found on the 1911 census with Aunt Caroline, because she's the daughter of a Robert Rowlinson and has a brother Robert Rowlinson.
So, we're a bit further forward with who he was and am hoping that somehow it will lead us to some info on his military service.
Any more help anyone can provide with that, it would be very much appreciated. :D
STG
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As I said previously he appears to have the BWM & VM medal ribbons.
There are 2 John Rowlinson medal cards with just the 2 medals & both in the RFA but no service docs.
jim
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i have found severial Rowlinson who served in the RA i would need a DOB
Thanks jim. It was cobb113 who said he needed a DOB, so here's [still] hoping :)
STG