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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: poirot on Wednesday 27 November 13 21:12 GMT (UK)
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Looking for information on John Boustead Kelsall who emigrated to Australia.
He was born in Ashton under Mersey, Cheshire UK in 1840 and was last located on the 1861 census.
The only information I have found for him in Australia is from the Crown Land Sales in Queensland.
There is a suspicion that he may have married and then divorced. Can't find any records of these events in UK.
Poirot
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Hi there,
Have you tried all the various free to search live links provided on the various Resources Boards at RChat?
Here's the link to RChat's Australia Resources. You will find child boards for each of the then colonies.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?board=399.0
You should not anticipate finding Census Records akin to the UK system.
I will ask for your thread to be moved to the main Australian Board where it is likely to be noticed by many RChatters
Cheers, JM
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The Register Of Pastoral Leases 1861-1868 does not actually say where it is located ...
John Kelsall, manager, is listed with Martha Kelsall and Jeani Hastie Kelsall, on Kinglebilla Station [560km west-southwest of Brisbane] on both the 1903 and 1905 Australian Electoral Rolls .. John Kelsall [no parental detail] died 1922 in Queensland [no detail]
Both Qld and NSW BDM do not have marriages listed ..
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Hi,
1900 Qld State Electoral Roll
The Electoral District of Ballone
St George Division
Kelsall John, 45, Grazing farm 96, Manager.
Qualified by residence, 6th Feb 1899.
Gerry
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. John Kelsall [no parental detail] died 1922 in Queensland [no detail]
Both Qld and NSW BDM do not have marriages listed ..
Hi there,
The 1922 death indexed at Qld BDM online is for a John KELSALL who was among the Fallen from the Great War. The Queensland Government honoured the Fallen service personnel who enlisted in Queensland and who did not return. The Reference no. F4665 refers to this registration. (F for Fallen)
At the National Archives (of Australia)’s website there’s 62 pages digitised for a John KELSALL, who enlisted at Mitchell in Queensland. He was of the 2nd Light Horse. He was buried 4 November 1917 in Palestine. He enlisted 31 March 1915, at age 24 years and 2 months. He was not married. His next of kin were in New Zealand.
http://www.lighthorse.org.au/famous-battles/world-war-one/famous-battles-the-battle-at-beersheba
Lest We Forget.
JM
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1905 Qld State Electoral Roll
The Electoral District of Ballone
St George Division
Kelsall John, 45, Grazing farm 96, Manager.
Qualified by residence, 6th Feb 1899.
45 would have been his rough age when he qualified for that roll (1899)
Gerry
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Hi,
John B Kelsall came to Queensland as a Land Order immigrant and the details should be available on a microfilm (Z2516) at the Qld State Archives, this would more than likely give the vessel name that he arrived on and when, c1864.
Interesting is that a Joseph Kelsall also was a Land Order immigrant, C1863.
Here is some info on the Land Order Immigration records.
http://www.archives.qld.gov.au/Researchers/CollectionsDownloads/Documents/sp7_land_orders.pdf
Gerry
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October 1866, unclaimed letters being held at the Brisbane GPO.
On the list was a Jno Kelsall, Rockhampton.
February 1867 , unclaimed letters being held at the Brisbane GPO.
On the list was a John Kelsall, Brisbane.
If this was your John it may indicate that he was in these areas around that time.
Gerry
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This may be way off the mark but.
A Jeanie Hastie Kelsall (spinster) died in Victoria 21st April 1969.
There is a probate file held at the Public Records Office of Victoria but I don't think you can view it online.
http://prov.vic.gov.au/index_search?searchid=54
Birth in Victoria 1878
Jeanie Hastie Kelsall
F: John Kelsall
M: Martha Hastie
Reg: Victoria 1878 No 26339.
Gerry
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Looking for information on John Boustead Kelsall who emigrated to Australia.
He was born in Ashton under Mersey, Cheshire UK in 1840 and was last located on the 1861 census.
The only information I have found for him in Australia is from the Crown Land Sales in Queensland.
There is a suspicion that he may have married and then divorced. Can't find any records of these events in UK.
Poirot
Re the Electoral Roll sightings in Queensland noted by bme and by Gerry :) and Gerry's sighting re Jeanie Hastie KELSALL with Vic connections.
I have been tidying up my desk, and here's some notes I made and overlooked posting to follow up on Gerry's sighting.
I think that there’s some confusion about John Kelsall.
I think the three people on the Queensland Electoral Rolls are from Victoria. I think that John KELSALL and Martha HASTIE married in Victoria and are the couple on the Qld electoral roll 1900, 1903 and 1905 etc at Kinglebilla Station in Queensland.
I think that some Victoria BDM certificates would help to sort out the confusion.
From the sighting for Jeanie Hastie KELSALL that I can see the following at various online indexes:
In 1878, John KELSALL married Martha HASTIE. The Vic BDM ref #725. The details found on Vic BDMs include details about the birth place for both the bride and the groom, their respective parents (names, nee names, occupations, etc) and a great deal of additional family history details.
There is a death in 1935 at Malvern, Vic, at age 83 for a Martha KELSALL, dau of Thos Hastie and Jane Smith. The Ref no. 4453. I think you will find that that Martha KELSALL was a married woman, perhaps with real estate in NSW as well as in Vic. NSW SRO has Martha Kelsall’s death as 6 June 1935, with Probate Granted 3 Sept 1935.
http://investigator.records.nsw.gov.au/
Vic BDM online index for births with parents as John KELSALL and Martha, nee HASTIE. There may be others, I did not double check my skimmed look.
1878 Jeanie Hastie KELSALL # 26339
1880 John Murray HELSALL #25937
1883 Thomas Hastie KELSALL # 27262
1886, Mary KELSALL #7061
1888 Mary Shepherd KELSALL #34133
1891 Elsie Martha Emily HELSALL #18003
1893 Annie Kathleen KELSALL, #27317
1895 Martha King Fleming KELSALL #25329
There is also the PROV index :
Jeanie Hastie KELSALL, Spinster, of Malvern 21 April 1969
John Kelsall, Ex Grazier, of Malvern, 8 Jan 1936
Martha Kelsall, Married of Malvern, 6 June 1935 (So I suggest that the NSW Probate likely sealed and returned to Victoria, as death registered in Vic.
Martha King Fleming HART, Widow, of Kew, 5 Sept 1978
Re John KELSALL, ex Grazier who died 8 Jan 1936
Names of his immediate family including Martha Kelsall, his wife having predeceased him, Jeanie Hastie Kelsall, Martha King Fleming Hart, and Thomas Hastie Kelsall.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/11872641 The Argus 13 Jan 1936 Just like in the instance of Martha KELSALL, so too for this John KELSALL, there’s a NSW Probate Packet indexed at NSW SRO’s Archives Investigator (death 8 Jan 1936, Probate 24 April 1936)
Also at NSW SRO’s Archives Investigator there’s a Probate for Thomas Hastie Kelsall, date 13 Nov 1962, Probate 17 July 1963.
ADD
What's on Vic Certs :)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,373754.0.html
Cheers, JM
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John Bowstead Kelsal held deed No 10773 for 20 acres in the County of Murchison Parish of St Lawrence.
1865
Vol 14 Folio 27
Book 12/01/1900
Page 375
ID 45782.
This Parish is in Central Queensland north of Rockhampton.
Gerry
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Well found Gerry.
Cheers, JM
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Looking for information on John Boustead Kelsall who emigrated to Australia.
He was born in Ashton under Mersey, Cheshire UK in 1840 and was last located on the 1861 census.
This is not your John KELSALL.
Marriage
KELSALL John born Melbourne
HASTIE Martha born Bunninyong
1878 Reg#725
Death - this person born c1854
KELSALL John
Father John Mother Mary SHEPHERD
At Malvern 82 years 1936 Reg#314
John's birth is not registered in Victoria however there are eight children born to John KELSALL and Mary SHEPHERD at Bunninyong with the first registered in 1855. Civil registration commenced Jul 1856 and it doesn't appear that John's baptism [ie if he was baptised] was forwarded by the church to the Victorian Registry for inclusion in their records.
Cando
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If I can get to the Qld State Archives I'll have a look at the Immigration Land Order microfilm for John Kelsall. it will likely refere to the 20 acres at St Lawrence.
I searched the Qld Gazettes and Police Gazettes today and found nothing on J B Kelsall. If our J. B. Kelsall did head north (maybe from Rockhampton) to his 20 acres he more than likey found it too small to do anything with it and got rid of it then he may have headed to the mining areas.
I could not find him on any 1860, 1870 and 1880 Qld Electoral Rolls.
Gerry
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Thank you so much Gerry and anyone else who has contributed. A lot to take in.
John Boustead Kelsall was definitely born in Ashton under Mersey UK in 1840 as we have a copy of the certificate. He would only have been about 23 when he emigrated to Australia.
I have emailed the Archives to ask if they would look at that film for me but don't know if they do research outside of Australia so it would be great if you would be so kind as to look at the film for me.
John is the mystery man in the family as his emigration to Australia was only confirmed when I found him on the Crown Land Sales in Queensland.
Many thanks,
poirot :)
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Hi,
Had a look at the Selection of Land Order images today at the Qld State Archives and the following was revealed about John B Kelsall.
The images are fairly basic and all that was revealed is that John B Kelsall paid his own way and came to Queensland as a Land Order Immigrant on the 'Bayswater' in June 1864. A Land Order was issued to John B Kelsall on 20th June 1864 and delivered on 28th June 1864 and this was to the value of 18 pound.
So by July 1864 John B Kelsall had a Land Order voucher worth 18 pound to purchase a block of land some where in Queensland (I think within 2 years of issue).
The Qld State Archives did not hold microfilm for the voyage of the 'Bayswater' in 1864 there was some information indicating that John B Kelsall was 24 years old and the vessel arrived in Brisbane via Kepple Bay from Greenock. The Brisbane Courier Friday 17th June 1864 has a good write up on this voyage and the 'Bayswater' left Liverpool on 25th January 1864 arriving Greenock 30th then leaving Greenock on 5th February arriving at Keppel Bay on 23rd May 1864 then onto Brisbane.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/1259154?searchTerm=
On 2d February 1865 John John Bowstead Kelsall of Brisbane purchased 20 acres under Deed No 10,773 in the Parish of St Lawrence the County of Murchison. This was entered in the Register of Land Purchases 'A' at the Surveyor General's Office under book 13 Folio 375 on 24th March 1865. The cost for this purchase was 30 pound so he would have had his 18 pound voucher so he had to throw in another 12 quid to get the 20 acre block.
After that date I can't find anything else on John B Kelsall, I have photographed a copy of the original deed (2 pages) if you would like it send a PM with your email.
Gerry
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Hi Gerry,
It is so long since I sent a PM that I have forgotten how.
Help please.
Poirot
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Click on my name 'Aussie1947' and my profile should come up, select PM then go from there.
Gerry
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poirot,
I have emailed you 4 images.
2 x 1864 land order microfilm images (hard to read though) for the vessel "Bayswater" with 64-11 being John B Kelsall.
2 x 1865 images re the land purchase of 20 acres being lot 60, portion 8, Parish of St Lawrence, County of Murchison, Queensland.
Let me know if it all fails and I'll try again.
Gerry
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The November 1863 Immigration Regulation under which J B Kelsall received his land order to the valuue of 18 pound.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/3166900
Note that Cabin & Intermediate passengers received 30 pound.
The Immigration Regulations were in constant change.
Just for interest the population of Queensland in 1864 was around 60,000.
Gerry
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The John Kelsall who died at Beersheba in 1917 was born at Garstang Lancashire and was 26, so unlikely to be the son of the ones from Melbourne and also unlikely to be the son of your Kelsall from Cheshire, if he went to Australia before 1890.
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The John Kelsall who died at Beersheba in 1917 was born at Garstang Lancashire and was 26, so unlikely to be the son of the ones from Melbourne and also unlikely to be the son of your Kelsall from Cheshire, if he went to Australia before 1890.
Reply#12 eliminated the Victorian connection.
It is helpful to give sources and references when posting information on rootschat.
The John Kelsall who died at Beersheba in 1917 was born at Garstang Lancashire and was 26,
John KELSALL
http://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/scripts/Imagine.asp?B=7336950
Cando
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How does reply #12 eliminate a possible connection between John who died in Palestine in 1917, to the Victorian family ?
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How does reply #12 eliminate a possible connection between John who died in Palestine in 1917, to the Victorian family ?
Hi there,
I realise you are asking this question of Cando, but as I do have the answer at hand, I hope my response will suffice.
He was not born in Australia, and his parents names were not the same names as noted in that reply.
You see, the John Kelsall, the AIF chap who fell in Palestine in 1917 was the son of Edward and Elizabeth Kelsall, and from his enlistment papers he was from Hornby, Lancashire England.
Source : Commonwealth War Graves Commission. http://www.cwgc.org/
Cheers, JM
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John Boustead Kelsall was the illegitimate son of Sarah Kelsall when his birth was registered William Dean Kelsall and Elizabeth Boustead,were registered on the birth certificate William Dean Kelsall was Sarah's brother William Dean Kelsall was my gt/gt/gt Grandfather, Sarah John's mother never married
This often happened when a daughter got pregnant as it sometime bought shame to a family and looked better on a birth certificate if both parents were on there even though they weren't his