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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Derbyshire => Topic started by: chanel on Tuesday 12 November 13 11:35 GMT (UK)
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Hello,
May I ask a very direct question, please?
Is it possible to find out the full name of a fellow who was subject of a Breach of Promise action in Derbyshire in 1892? The incident took place in Mellor, Derbyshire, and the court case was conducted at Liverpool Assizes. The proceedings were published in several local newspapers late December 1892.
Would it be acceptable for me to name names in this Forum?
Your thoughts, please.
Chanel.
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Chanel,
As long as they are not living, then yes, and as this is over 100 years ago, you can assume so.
Trystan
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Thanks, Tristan - the participants certainly are long gone.
The case I'm referring to is:
Clara Potts (by next friend) V. Jowett (there was an associated case, AlfredPotts v. Jowett.)
It was held at the Liverpool Assizes on Wednesday, 14 December, 1892, and was reported in, amongst others, The Manchester Evening News on 15 December, 1892.
I wonder if anybody can tell me the full name of Mr Jowett.
Chanel
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1891 Census of Derbyshire on freecen gives a Jowett family at Hayfield, Lower Hall parish Mellor - only Jowetts in Derbyshire anywhere near there.
Father Jonathan wid aged 59 occupation Em'er (Employer)
Son william single aged 28 cotton Manufacturer (Em'er)
Son JAmes single aged 22
Son Ernest 16
plus various daughters
All born Mellor
Also at Hayfield, Moor End, Clara Potts aged 18 (only Clara Potts in Derbyshire), Packer at Wadding Mill (Mr Jowett's mill?), father Alfred, Grocer, mother Hannah + 10 children. All born Mellor
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Thank you for that, goldie61. I think we can be pretty certain that one of the Jowett boys in Hayfield was responsible, but which one?????? I need to know a Christian name, but I don't know how/where to find that information.
Chanel
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FindMyPast has a newspaper cutting. Buy the minimum number of credits to be able to view it?
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This is the cutting from The Manchester Courier - from The British Newspaper Archive - had a few credits.
Unfortunately it doesn't give the christian name of the Jowett boy!
Sounds like it was a bit of a juicy case thought - and a very big payout I think.
I know at some libraries you can access the newspaper archive for free.
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It's also in The Birmingham Daily Post of 16 December, The Belfast Newsletter of 17 December and The Blackburn Standard and Weekly Express of 17 December. Unfortunately none of them give a forename for Mr Jowett. :'(
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Hello again, goldies61.... and thanks. Thanks, too, to you, BumbleB. Once again you're trying to help me with a problem - I'm grateful.
Unfortunately, you've both given me information I have already been able to find and, of course, it's missing the vital bit -hence my reason for posting. It seems this one may be headed for the too hard basket and as often happens, I suppose, it will just leave a stopper on a branch of my family tree.
Someone, somewhere along the line must have written his full name down on a document, though. Hmmmm.....!
Thank you both again.
Chanel
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Might I suggest that you contact Liverpool Records Office and/or Liverpool Central Library to see if they have any idea of where the records for the Assizes are kept and/or available.
After all - "if you don't ask the question, then you won't get an answer!" ;)
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Thanks for a gentle reminder of the "bleedin' obvious", BumbleB. Most certainly, if you don't ask............!!I'll see what I can do.
Chanel
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Hi,
If this works I'll be amazed. His name is Alfred Potts .... the swine!
Cheers Jo
The Blackburn Standard and Weekly Express (Blackburn, England), Saturday, December 17, 1892; pg. 3; Issue 2965. 19th Century British Library Newspapers: Part II.
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Sorry colkitto but you've got it all wrong.I suggest you read the clip again, carefully and I'm sure you'll work out what it's saying.
Cheers,
Chanel
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You're right I've read it 6 times & I think I've got it now. Sorry Alfred.
There's a Walter Jowett who has form.... the swine!
I'll get me coat.
Cheers Jo
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Hi Jo,
It seems the Yorkshire Jowetts were as bad as the Derbyshire lot - the bounders!! At least with the one you've found the christian name of the villain has been given but no such luck with my bloke.
As chance would have it, I have a relative in your country who has a planned visit to The National Archives coming up shortly, and she has kindly volunteered to check out the Assizes:Northern Circuit: Civil Minute books for me. With a bit of luck she'll find the B of P case I'm interested in, and with even more luck, she might find Mr Jowett's christian name - here's hoping. If this fails, I've no idea where to turn to. But, let's wait and see.
Thanks for your interest. Now I'm off ... where's me 'at?
Chanel.
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I think in those days the only men to be addressed as "Mr" were property owners and businessmen - all others were addressed by surname only or had a full name.
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Hello Rena,
I wasn't really using the "Mr" in a serious..... British way - perhaps the..... Aussie way?????
But, whatever, tell me his christian name is and I'll love you for life!! Where CAN I find it!!??
Chanel
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Good news everyone - I have the name I was after. It was found for me in the National Archives - and I am SO pleased!!
Thank you all for your help along the way. I believe I can close this thread now.
Chanel
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Aaaaaaaaargh!!! And you're going to be good, and not tell us :-X :-X
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Result!!
No naming & shaming then...
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I see no reason why not - the whole business was public knowledge back in 1892. I'll bet the locals knew!!
His name was William Jowett.
In fact, you may be able to help me yet again. The 1891 Census has him single but by the 1901 Census he has a wife, Elsie. I can't find their marriage registration or where they were at 1911 Census time. William appears to have died in 1918(2) in Staffordshire, but I haven't found out anything about Elsie or children(?) yet.
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1911 - try looking under Jowell ;D And from that I think he maried Effie Jean Smith - March quarter 1900 in Bristol Registration District 6a, page 166. William Jowett and Effie Jean Smith appear on the same page.
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Thanks BumbleB- right on the ball as always! I've found the probate registration for each of them, so I did know his wife's christian name but not her maiden name. This still didn't let me find their marriage record though. I'll see what I can find with the information you've given me. Probate led me to the correct death record for William, too - I had the wrong William Jowett earlier.
Re 1911 Census - I should have tumbled to a transcription or spelling error- I've encountered enough of them with my own surname. Just didn't think of it.
He was quite a prominent person in the Mellor area - I've noticed numerous newspaper clips about him. Now I've identified him positively, I'll take a bit more care in my hunting.
Thanks again.
Chanel