RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: Graham47 on Tuesday 24 September 13 08:51 BST (UK)
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Most of us are aware I guess that the next batch of census returns for 1921 will not be available for a little while yet under the 100 year rule, but does this apply to other records held by various authorities I wonder.
I have learned from here that now my long estranged father is deceased, I can obtain his army records - albeit on production of his death certificate which is now being ordered, and on payment of £30 I think to the Army records office, but what about criminal records? A delicate question perhaps, but one that I need to ask as it would open and then close a few doors for me.
I have Googled this but it does not seem that clear, well not to this old duffer anyway!
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The rules on the census are derived from the Acts of Parliament which controlled each Census. So the 100 year rule there does not apply to other records.
Different archives apply different rules. For criminal (and other) records, there is another route, following newspapers as they are in the public domain.
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Most of us are aware I guess that the next batch of census returns for 1921 will not be available for a little while yet under the 100 year rule, but does this apply to other records held by various authorities I wonder.
First if you look at the legislation - the Census Act, 1920 (as amended) you will find it is illegal to reveal personal data from any census taken under that Act ever.
There is no 100 year rule, that was repealed by the Freedom of Information Act 2000. The current law which stands until repealed by a further Act of parliament is that there will be no further releases of personal data from any (later) census.
I have learned from here that now my long estranged father is deceased, I can obtain his army records - albeit on production of his death certificate which is now being ordered, and on payment of £30 I think to the Army records office, but what about criminal records? A delicate question perhaps, but one that I need to ask as it would open and then close a few doors for me.
I have Googled this but it does not seem that clear, well not to this old duffer anyway!
Most government held information is available already with no specific time limit. A few records have a 30 year time limit imposed on them.
many authorities take the lazy way out and claim that under the Data Protection Act various records are withheld until after the death of the subject or 100 years but the law does not uphold such a blanket ban.
Each and every record has to be individually examined and a decision made as to whether its release would transgress the DPA or not. If not it has to be released on request.
Cheers
Guy
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Quote from Guy Etchells Tues 24 September 2013 ...
"First if you look at the legislation - the Census Act, 1920 (as amended) you will find it is illegal to reveal personal data from any census taken under that Act ever.
There is no 100 year rule, that was repealed by the Freedom of Information Act 2000. The current law which stands until repealed by a further Act of parliament is that there will be no further releases of personal data from any (later) census."
Guy, am I to understand from what you say here that the 1921 Census will never be released "ever"? Indeed you seem to be saying that there will be no further Census releases (UK) unless a further Act of Parliament decrees otherwise ??? If that is so, how does that information square with the Freedom of Information Act 2000 ??? Forgive me but I'm finding what you've said a little confusing. Maybe I'm just being a bit thick (a distinct possibility!). Can you clarify please?
Cheers,
Janet
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http://www.1911census.org.uk/1921.htm
Accessing the 1921 Census .... when will the 1921 Census be released?
The ruling by the Information Commissioner that resulted in the 1911 census being opened early does not apply to the 1921 census because, unlike the 1911 census, the 1921 census was conducted under the 1920 Census Act, which is still in force and which contains a statutory prohibition on disclosure.
The stated government position from the ONS is "its intention to release the entirety of the 1921 census returns in 2022, in accordance with the non-statutory '100 year rule' which was adopted to reflect this undertaking of confidentiality".
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http://www.1911census.org.uk/1921.htm
snip
The stated government position from the ONS is "its intention to release the entirety of the 1921 census returns in 2022, in accordance with the non-statutory '100 year rule' which was adopted to reflect this undertaking of confidentiality".
The relevant part in the above quote is non-statutory, that means it does not have the authority of law (statute).
In other words the present 100 year rule is simply a nice comfortable rule unlike the previous 100 year rule that was introduced under a statutory power ( Statutory Instrument No. 12 of 1966 ).
The 1920 Census Act puts no time limit on the period of non-disclosure of personal information from the census.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0wkf/
The Census (Confidentiality) Act 1991, which amends the 1920 Census Act, makes it an offence for the Registrar General or any person under his/her control or who supplies services to them to disclose and personal census information.
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1991/6/introduction
Again no time limit is placed on the non-disclosure clause.
It has been recommended by the Advisory Council on Public Records and Archives that the closure period on census be 80 years.
I would be happy with that what I am not happy with is that the census be closed forever.
In my view it is up to the government to set a closure period on census.
If they decide that the closure period should be 100 years then that would be acceptable though as I have said I would prefer 80 years.
Cheers
Guy
P.S. There is a hope that the Statistics Board may release census information early. However there is doubt whether they actually have the power to do so as their mandate stems from powers in the 1920 Census Act given to the Registrar General.
Those powers were however taken away from the Registrar General by the Freedom of Information Act 2000.
The whole thing is a mess.
Guy
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Quote from Guy Etchells Tues 24 September 2013 ...
"First if you look at the legislation - the Census Act, 1920 (as amended) you will find it is illegal to reveal personal data from any census taken under that Act ever.
There is no 100 year rule, that was repealed by the Freedom of Information Act 2000. The current law which stands until repealed by a further Act of parliament is that there will be no further releases of personal data from any (later) census."
Guy, am I to understand from what you say here that the 1921 Census will never be released "ever"? Indeed you seem to be saying that there will be no further Census releases (UK) unless a further Act of Parliament decrees otherwise ??? If that is so, how does that information square with the Freedom of Information Act 2000 ??? Forgive me but I'm finding what you've said a little confusing. Maybe I'm just being a bit thick (a distinct possibility!). Can you clarify please?
Cheers,
Janet
Janet the FReedom of Information Act specifically prohibits the release of any data prohibited under an Act of Parliament.
The 1920 Census Act (as amended) prohibits the release of personal information from any census taken under it.
The wording of the Freedom of Information Act (2000) is-
44 Prohibitions on disclosure.
(1)Information is exempt information if its disclosure (otherwise than under this Act) by the public authority holding it—
(a)is prohibited by or under any enactment,
Cheers
Guy
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I have learned from here that now my long estranged father is deceased, I can obtain his army records - albeit on production of his death certificate which is now being ordered, and on payment of £30 I think to the Army records office, but what about criminal records?
Criminal Records as held by the Criminal Records Office (CRO) are normally deleted upon the death of the individual BUT records do exist from Courts & Prisons and from other publications (e.g. The Police Gazette). The National Archives have recently released large batches of these records through partnership with FindmyPast and others through Ancestry but the latest date I could see was 1934. Certainly through my own experience with these records the cut off date varies from one organisation to another with some adopting 50 years others 75 and a few 100.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/looking-for-person/criminal-trial-or-conviction.htm