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General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: snooziflooze on Friday 16 August 13 15:22 BST (UK)
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After watching WDYTYA the other night and how Lesley Sharp found 'common themes' of illegitimacy in her family tree...I'm just wondering if Rootchatters have found any similar common themes in theirs?
In mine, there is the theme of being the second wife (after the first one died) and having to look after not only the first wife's children, but then having some of her own to look after too and often in quite humble circumstances, with the husband only being an ordinary working man. And if that wasn't enough, the husband then dies early, leaving the second wife poverty stricken, even destitute, barely keeping themselves and the assorted children out of the workhouse.
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Yes lots of family scripts...... from repeating naming patterns, to what ages they married and had children, being pregnant before marriage, whole family line of using middle names as their first name, giving their first born mums maiden surname as a first name. ::)
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Illegitimacy is a common theme in all families ( hands up who hasn't got one ) & because of mortality rates being so high remarriage is also a common theme.
Not wanting to be sceptical but pre pension & National Assistance & with an 85 YO unable to work 10 bob a week would come in very handy...OK I'm being sceptical.
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Have to agree with both of the above as mine have been pretty much the same, from finding unknown war dead and those in service or farm labourers and the like. Even found some hidden travelers and hawkers which the family had kept schtum about.
Not found anybody 'famous' and the nearest I got to riches was a close connection to a family of brewers up north and wouldn't you know it, my connection was by way of an illegitimate offspring, albeit recognized. D'oh! ;D
So a common theme? Yep, no fame or fortune, just normal down to earth people.
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Bigamists seem to be ripe within my tree - and people having families with someone else whilst still married ... the former in my mothers side the later in my fathers!
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Many thanks for your interesting replies... :)
My father's side is noticeably awash with second marriages, the husband dying early, leaving the second wife destitute and struggling with various kids. This seems to necessitate splitting up of the whole family to find work/survive and no-one settling in the area in which they were born.
On my mother's side it seems to be a different story with most peeps being married only once, surviving together until old age and staying put in the area in which they were born, for several generations. Whether they are of hardier stock I don't know, but they are sure easier to track down!
My father's side, because they travelled so much, have been a lot more difficult to trace.
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I wonder if your fathers side came from the towns rather than the villages maybe and as such would have been drafted into the army where as you know, so many died leaving young families.
Perhaps village families were not recruited in the same way, being need to farm the land?
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Suicide/desertion/bigamy and untimely deaths seem to feature in my blood lines! :-(
I thought the Lesley Sharp episode of WDYTYA particularly poignant and moving: Lesley herself found a 'kindly home' through her adoption, and George Maybury also found a 'kindly home' with her Patient ancestors.
Two of my Great Uncles were despatched to Canada as 'British Home Children' by the NCH in the 1920's and so I was particularly interested in this strand to the story.
Romilly.
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Apart from the common theme of Ag Labs in my tree I have another common theme of spouses dying three or four years before the other. This has even carried on to my parents.
Spooky
Rishile
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Until well into the 20th century Ag.Labs, domestic servants and births out of wedlock feature strongly in my creaky tree. I'm beginning to wonder whether my ancestors didn't get the memo about safe sex (only kidding!) It makes for confusion and frustration for the 21st century family researcher, but must have made for much worse difficulties, at the time, for all those concerned. :-[
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Mine is an unusual one....My Father had his top teeth removed when he was very young but couldn't tell us why...when my Sister and I went to his home town of St. John's NFLD to meet relatives and do some family research...my cousin asked us if our Father had his own teeth as apparently his 3 Sisters had their top teeth removed when they were young and no-one had an explanation?
This rang bells with me as a Family researcher told me that it was a common Anthony trait to have a double row of top teeth...I would normally have taken this with a pinch of salt (or toothpaste) but my Son also had to have teeth removed in the front as he had an extra set of front teeth :o
However...I now have four Grandchildren with trouble free teeth ;D
Carol
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My family seems pretty boring compared to these.
I have only found 1 illegitimate child. I read a newspaper article. The father promised the mother he would marry her but he didn't.
I have noticed a few 2nd marriages due to the 1st spouse dying.
Lots and lots of kids but I think that was common.
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Like everyone else I have the usual illegitemates etc. However , I recently noticed something just on one family side. That being ,whichever month each individual was born was the same month they died . It goes through all the generations too. Anyone else noticed this in your own families?
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Heart disease runs through my paternal line. GGGgrandma died 1857 aged 43. GGgranddad died aged 42. Ggranddad died aged 32. Went down a different line there though. grandad's sister died 53 from heart disease. My dad's second cousin died 1992 aged 48. Should probably get mine looked at in case it's skipped two generations! Probably explains why I've got no cousins (or second or third) with the same surname.
Lots of non-conformism too. Not a very CofE family.
The only other 'theme' I'd suggest is they're all very labouring class and had a tendency to get up and go when the need arose. My ancestors really do come from the four corners of England. It makes them a bit inconvenient to follow compared to some people who seem to be able to trace their entire tree in the one town (or county).
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My lot mostly find their roots from the ag labs. There are a few instances of first cousins marrying each other, which I found surprising, and very often 2nd and 3rd cousins married each other. Likewise, many were non conformists. It was an eye opener to see how many died in the Great War. Although a few of mine did travel long distances for work, most seem to have been quite content to remain in the local area.
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Illegitimacy is a common theme in most trees, isn't it? That and the bride being pregnant on her wedding day.
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I have one who was eight months pregnant, just about to pop...wonder what the vicar thought? ::)
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Like you all I too have found, 1st wives dying young. Husbands remarrying quickly and my relative being the 2nd wife.
Some children were orphaned at a young age, living in Workhouses for short periods.
Mother's surnames being included as the middle name is also common - even with the girls.
My relatives seem to have trades as occupations, sometimes repeated from family to family member.
Have found a couple of curly variants with some family members.
One lady does not appear to have had her birth registered ...had various organisations for her region researching, with no success.
Was wondering how you access the birth, baptism details for a family member born in 1828 Farnsfield.... don't know her parents names.
Have found this forum to be very useful with many handy prompts for tricky questions.
Cheers
footprints 55
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Hello stevew101,
I've just noticed that you are interested in the name Warwick and the village of Little Hadham. This caught my eye as my husband's great grandparents William Prior and Elizabeth Parker were married in Little Hadham on 31 December 1859, and one of the witnesses was Samuel Warwick. Just wondered if he was a connection of yours?
Ann
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One thing I've found a lot of in my family which gave me pause for thought was double barreled names, where only one child was given the double barrel. Usually the mothers maiden name. It surprised me because I only found this out after I decided to double barrel my name after marriage.
Another thing I've noticed is slightly unusual first names. It makes me smile because a lot of the siblings have very normal names. It's almost as though they ran out of nice normal biblical type names and went "oh stuff it lets just call this one 'Leaf'"
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I have found two cases of that in my paternal line where the mothers maiden name has been used but not as a double-barrelled name as such, more as a middle name as/or presumably, they would have been "passed down the line" so to speak.
Is there a distinction between the two?
Other than that, I'm not a fan of them myself especially where a hyphenated forename name such as Sarah-Jane, is paired up with a double barrelled surname and moreover, one that has been constructed rather than adopted.
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Ah You have reminded me, yes me too. I have maiden names used as childrens middle names and then the next generation use it as a given name adding another maiden name, two of which are now 'family' given names but really that is just reverting to origin as many surnames were once given names before people took surnames and it is very useful in finding maternal ancestry.
Also a whole line going back who used their middle names in daily use instead of their first given name, I looked for a long time to find my grandfather and siblings who I knew as one name only to eventually find their baptisms all were using 'different' names and I should have known as their children also all use their middle names in daily use, it was only when I look at census and cross reference baptisms and for earlier ones their birth certs. Even my cousins when they married I remember listening to the service and thought they were called one name that I always knew them by only to find they too use their middle names and my grandmother only gave her two children one given name in an attempt to stop this continuing
Only the other day I saw a post from a new rootschat member asking about her great grandfather 'Benjamin' but didn't recognise the name used yesterday when I checked my database using a wild card, I found him he was baptised 'John Benjamin' and looking at census it seemed be used Benjamin ::)
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Taking the period 1800-1900, it's a very noticable theme that the branches of the family who lived in the areas of West Yorkshire where the textile industry developed did not need to move about to get work and also thrived and had very large, heathly families- though they were ordinary working folk, they had at least a chance of earning a living wage and the older children could work in the mills.
It is striking that those who lived higher up on the hills above the unhealthy valley bottoms were especially successful at rearing large famillies.
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The greatest theme in both my family's history and my husband's is definite working/labouring class. It was farming or farm labouring in my husband's family (Surrey and Norfolk), and cab driving and general dealers in my family, in London, either side of the Thames.
I also came across a double-barrelled name in my husband's tree, in that his maternal grandmother's maiden name was Mandall Hall. Knowing she came from a family of farm labourers, I couldn't understand why or how. Tracing back some way, I eventually found out that a male Mandall (very common surname in a particular area) married a female Hall, but HE was a farmer ie owned land and was eventually recorded as being of 'independent means', as was she after she was widowed. So, the double-barrelled name obviously had status indications. Sadly, their son is recorded as being a farm labourer after the parents had died. Still haven't found out where all the money/land went!
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Another common theme I have in my trees. Most of my families lived next to or in pubs :-\
Rishile
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Another common theme I have in my trees. Most of my families lived next to or in pubs :-\
Rishile
Sounds like a pretty good idea to me! ;D
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Another common theme I have in my trees. Most of my families lived next to or in pubs :-\
Rishile
Sounds like you have sensible ancestors Rishile ;D
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Our first house was opposite a pub, brilliant we thought..... until stop tap.
We soon got fed up with car doors slamming, shout's of "g'night" and of course the occasional 'watering' of our fence posts!
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When we started looking for houses here, there was a house we really liked, and seriously considered, but decided that being next door to a pub wasn't likely to be a good idea. As it was, it looks, despite the deeds saying other wise, that the pub is going to be replaced with housing, so it's just as well we didn't move in there. We do have a daughter with a publican's licence, though. :)
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When I left school I decided I wanted to be a hotel receptionist. I have no idea why, the idea just came to me. When I later started researching my family tree I have discovered very many of my ancestors were hoteliers in the Lake District.
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Now this is another topic altogether - that of what genes do you think you have inherited through your bloodlines...?
Perhaps another post is needed though for that one :o
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Not really a common theme in my ancestry.
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All of them?
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All of them?
:D
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Just joined the forum,
All the women who married into the family I would like to praise; they kept us out of the workhouse, safe, strong , out of prison and out from under the shadow of the hangmans noose, so heres to the female line , God bless them.
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Couldn't agree with you more, Stormtroop- I'm constantly in awe of the way my female ancestors faced down the odds so very much stacked against them and gradually improved the fortunes of the family- better women than me, in so many ways.
(PS- this is not to underestimate their menfolk whose toils kept the family fed and no doubt provided the firm hand needed to raise huge broods of children)
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I have a few common themes ........ one line of my family seem to have rather large families 16 or 18 much larger than the normal - really difficult to manage on a standard family tree another line of the family have a tendency to have women that are a lot older than the men folk (toyboys and cougars is not a new thing :o ). i also have a lot of farmer's sons marrying publican's daughters lol
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Now this is another topic altogether - that of what genes do you think you have inherited through your bloodlines...?
I've always been petrified of canal locks - looking down into them at the sheer sides and thinking how horrible it would be to fall in and not be able to get to the point where there was a ladder to get out. Never had a bad experience myself or been warned to be wary of them, just a deep seated fear in me. When I started researching the family I discovered that I come from a great dynasty of watermen on my grandmother's side - men who worked "flats" around Runcorn and Widnes. One of the wives slipped, fell in a dock and was drowned taking her husband a meal one night, her son fell in the canal and drowned as a adult and my great great grandfather was knocked overboard in an accident and lucky to survive. Have I inherited a wariness of the locks in my genes?
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Now this is very interesting...and yes, it could explain your irrational fear of canal locks. Well, how else can you explain it???
???
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AAHH now Meezer , that is a valid topic!!.
You see , you get this reincarnation "thing", but there is some basis for the belief that it could be genetic "memory" , now where do you get that ability, talent, fear, knowledge you could not have, but l-and I am addressing everyone here; why do we weep at a war which in one year will commemorate the centenary of??, 1914-18 , do we hold deep within ourselves the memory of loss, grief and burden which it imposed upon our families at the time . And then think further back in time.
The possibilities are endless and truly amazing -get searching!
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I find myself thinking this sort of thing a lot to be honest and have to stop myself saying "oh that's where that comes from then".
For example I can see in one line a "pattern" of good mom, bad mom, good mom, bad mom etc but these moms had several daughters and for every "bad mom" I find, there's four other daughters who were good!
(And obviously it's now run it's course because I am a fab mom - even though I am ignoring my daughter right now so I can post this haha) x
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Illegitimacy in particular on the paternal side of the family. Perhaps I should amend my surname to be triple barrelled to suit?? ;).
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Workers!
Whether they worked hard is another question altogether, but I've been very proud of the roles my ancestors have played by the jobs they used to do.
One female ancestor in particular, worked from home, supporting 4 young children after her husband had passed away. There is someone still alive today that remembers her, and told me that she was always working long hours!
Marriages
2nd, 3rd marriages! Confuses the hell out of me!
Not being part of a will. My ancestors always seem to miss out in the will. Although I suppose that doesn't mean they didn't get anything!
Probably common themes among all families, but these are what I have found in mine! :)
Chris
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I come from long lines of Ag Labs and Gen Labs, but my paternal greatx2 grandfather joined the police, and then his son and my grandfather did the same - and lots of the family turned out to be policemen when I researched them. Kept popping up all over the place.
I think the point of doing this was that - unlike most other jobs at the time - being a policeman meant you GOT A PENSION. And that was immensely valuable. :D
No, the occupation's not passed down to me....
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Found more a few of mine worked on the railways and for the same reason I suppose, a good pension. The railway companies were among the first to provide one to their employees and although for many it was a dangerous job (one great grandfather was a shunter on the NE mineral railway) it must have ben a pretty top notch job in it's day.
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My father's family is from County Durham and my mother's from Suffolk, but interestingly there are engine drivers on both side of the family. I think in those days it was a well-respected occupation, probably akin to an airline pilot nowadays.
My great great grandfather was an engine driver and then became a railway agent and from photos taken at that time, the family seemed quite prosperous. Sadly though, the 1930s depression wiped that all out, and left my father's generation having to leave home to sleep rough in order to be able to claim the dole.
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In my Dad's side of the family, we seem to have an awful lot of males biting off more than they can chew and so ending up bankrupt. I also have a whole string of carters to carriers to haulage contractors to mechanical engineers in UK and, surprisingly, in the countries to which they emigrated. Must be in the genes: the love of transport.
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On my Dad's (Welsh)side, it's blacksmithing, on my Mam's (English) it's grocers especially around mining communities. Not forgetting the well-balanced illegitimacy on both sides!
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Mine drop dead before their time :o
My father had 2 brothers and 4 sisters, not one reached 60years old.
The sisters having families have each had children die in turn through heart failure.
Going back father son to 1500's the same problems came up. (possibly missing a generation or so)
I myself having had open heart surgery after having a heart attack at 38years, eldest daughter having blood circulation problems.
Brian
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Mine drop dead before their time :o
My father had 2 brothers and 4 sisters, not one reached 60years old.
The sisters having families have each had children die in turn through heart failure.
Going back father son to 1500's the same problems came up. (possibly missing a generation or so)
I myself having had open heart surgery after having a heart attack at 38years, eldest daughter having blood circulation problems.
Brian
Gosh, Brian, is this something where Family History research comes in really helpful, because if you can't avoid this then at least you can be aware and take as many precautionary measures as possible? :o
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It was down to my eldest daughter doing the chasing about that most of the above information came to light.
During the last couple of years 1 cousin collapsed and died after returning from the local shop @62years old his elder brother (who had earlier had a heart transplant) passed away whilst awaiting a heart/lung transplant (the anti rejection drugs having damaged his lungs), just leaving 3 cousins left.
Seems our family connection is like 'dead people walking'?
Brian (still taking the tablets)
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Definitely keep taking the tablets Brian. Buck the trend :)
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As a final postscript to my sorrow tale, my aged mother 90+years young has a bowel disease that required an operation to remove @18inches of bowel, my younger brother has had the identical procedure, whilst my youngest brother is clear.
Proves a point though 'you can choose your friends but not your family'. :o
Brian
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Aside from old age, I think by far the two biggest killers in my family are cancer and strokes, although not of the same type... I'm collecting enough different types of cancer it's like playing body part bingo. I have however noticed some themes, in that one side of my family had a direct line suffering bronchitis and/or emphysema and my cousin and her son have been diagnosed with COPD, so we suspect that's what they all had. The same line also seems to have a predisposition to depressive disorders, which myself and my mother suffering, her mother having some hints, her grandmother attempting suicide and her great grandmother dying after refusing to have an operation; unfortunately not a lot of information available to analyse that, given that it was, and mainly still is, a taboo subject. There's some suggestion that autistic spectrum disorders may also have a genetic link, but I don't know where that might have come from.