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Research in Other Countries => Other Countries => Topic started by: melsimba66 on Tuesday 06 August 13 08:39 BST (UK)
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Hello , I would like to know if some one can help me . My Gr Grandfathers family came from Karlsruk ? Russia and were German immigrants . They arrived on the Victorian ship in 1908 . headed to Rosthern Saskatchewan Gr Grandfather was John K Gerlock , he has his age as 14 on the ships passenger list but I suspect it might be wrong . He was traveling with his parents John and Elizabeth Gerlock . Then in the 1911 Saskatchewan census it has him down again with his parents and a wife Catherine and children John 5, Park 4 , and Elizabeth 1 . it says the two older children were born in Russia , and in the 1916 Census John is with a Teresa Trippel newly married from 1912 with children from that marriage . I would like to know if there was a marriage back in Russia , and if there is any birth certificates to be found for John or his children ?? I have read how difficult it might be with Russian Researching , but I think it will be worth the effort .
As for the first wife Catherine , and the children I have found no trace of them , I don't know how much divorce there was back then , or if she went back home to Russia after a few years in Canada ?? I do not know her maiden name .
Thank you Melanie
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have u tried familysearch.org firstly???? if not on there, you may have to be visiting a microfische library resource near you to look at the original International Genealogical Index fische, if the record survived in the first instance and was microfilmed in the second.
I am not seeing any genealogical references for "Karlsruk" so I would ask that you identify the geographical placename a bit more ......thanks. But don't get me wrong it may be as you have stated or the place simply was not attended by microfilmers or the village may not exist anymore. If it is not on microfilm you will have to identify the closest archives and contact them; and; possibly start to identify the main religions of your folk to be able to write to the diocese office in Russia of that faith to ask where such records may be housed if they have survived.
Given that you say the family went to Canada, I have a small inklings they may have been one of the many families expelled by Stalin, as mine were from Archangel.
best I can offer at the moment but others may have some suggestions I don't.
fusion
:)
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Thank you , I have looked at Family Search , but it only has John married to Teresa Trippel . I will sjpend some more time searching the IGI , and I will have to check the spelling on his home village .
melanie
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I have Volga German relatives who moved over the to States eventually and have done a bit of research on them. There is lots of material online (compared to native Russian genealogical research) and I was fortunate that a distant cousin is a professor who lectures on the subject.
Some website which might be of interest-
http://www.grhs.org/villages/beresan/karlsruhe.html
http://www.rollintl.com/roll/karlsruhe.htm
http://library.ndsu.edu/grhc/history_culture/history/fromkarlsruhe.html
You might find that the surname was Gerlach (or similar) not Gerlock.
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As I suspected, the name might be Gerlach (as transcribed from passenger list)-
http://irishgenealogy.net/files/ships.txt
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Hello ,
I am going through the links you have given me and there is some great information . I am not sure if or when the name change might have taken place from Gerlock to Gerlach , if I can find something on the Russian end of this it may give me a clue , but for now it seems to be Gerlock .
Take care Melanie
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sometimes folk anglosise their name to "fit in" to the new community..... and sometimes phonetic mistranscriptions take place I wouldn't worry too much about it.....
:)
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Can I ask a dumb question? ;D
Is it possible they came from Prussia, rather than Russia?
Prussia covered what is now parts of Germany and Poland.
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I am not sure if or when the name change might have taken place from Gerlock to Gerlach , if I can find something on the Russian end of this it may give me a clue , but for now it seems to be Gerlock .
Moving from Germany to Russia (although within a German community) and then to U.S. where German was not the language it's not surprising the name has evolved slightly. The transcribed passenger list (I have not seen the original) shows your family as Gerlach. If you search for GERLACH & Rosthern you will see there are more than just your immediate family settled there.
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HI all ,
I thought at first it was Gerlach, and I did see the ships list too and I followed those leads for a while , but even though one of those Gerlach men (Jacob) did marry a Trippel (Mary) ,it was a John Gerlock who married the other sister Teresa in 1912 , There is still the mystery of the first wife which shows with John in the 1911 Census.
Yes , It does seem like an entire village moved to Rosthern :D !
Prussia is a possibility too , but I don't know enough about those regions , as a beginner researching Russia it is very intimidating .
I have found a Death notice from a newspaper in Calgary where the family moved in 1929 , from an Esther Gerlock who was my Grandfathers sister, Esther Gerlock born June 24 , 1924 , died Oct 1997 , she married an Otto Gerlach . It was in this that I discovered the name was in fact Gerlock .......I have sent off some $$$ for the Death notice of the Gr Grandparents John and Elizabeth and since it is only a couple of provinces away hopefully it should not take that long with snail mail ::)...........
thank you Melanie
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In German the surname is unlikely to have been Gerlock but it's likely that some of the family adopted that spelling at some point.
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Hi Melanie,
1. Your family is mostly probably from Karlsruhe, Stavropol, Russia. See: http://www.grhs.org/villages/caucasus/karlsurhe_ncaucasus.html This is located in present day Georgia, almost directly below Moscow. Be careful as there are several Karlsruhes including one in present day Ukraine - which is not the correct one.
There were a number of families from this area that emigrated to Rosthern. I believe with a large enough tree that we are all related.
2. Many of the Karlsruhe settlers were first located in a Volga Colony. See http://wc.rootsweb.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=SHOW&db=volga%5Fstier&recno=16415
and you will find a number of Gerlachs. My great-great grandfather is on the list of Volga settlers, but sometime the family moved on to Karlsruhe, as that is where the family lived before they emigrated to Canada.
3. Unfortunately, the 1897 Russian census was destroyed in a fire - which wiped out at least a generation of records for the people we would like to put in our trees. For example, my great-great grandfather, Conrad TRIOL is on the Volga database, but my great-grandmother Katherina Elizabeth was too young to be found, as was my grandmother, Maria Katherina HELMUTH aka KNIPPEL. So you may gain info from the Volga records, but then have to jump to the Canadian census.
4. You will find that most of the Russian Germans were married more than once. Such was the mortality rate at that time. I, too, suffer from the problem of blended marriages and multiple spouses.
5. Your family is mentioned in Old and New Furrows: the story of Rosthern, which can be read online at our roots.ca; pg 573-575 - if you have not seen that. Reading through this confirms your connection to the Volga village of Warenburg.
6. Do not worry about the spelling of the names too much - you should be looking for Gerlach - the others are simply phonetic guesses. The Swabisch dialect used by this people seems to have been difficult to understand.
If I can be of further help, please let me know.
Laurie
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Hello Laurie
Thank you for all the information . I have found a number of clues and puzzle pieces , but I lacked the know how and German language to put any thing together properly ! I am noticing similar tenancies with this German/Russian branch of my tree as with my Scot,/ Irish tree , . Parents naming children after family members ect ,.But when couples got married did you find that the husband would go to the brides village ? or was that not the case ?
Melanie