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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: ZKT on Friday 02 August 13 17:46 BST (UK)
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My Grandfather was born 7th Feb 1904 at Crewe Cheshire. His mother was Florence Maud Downes. she was a domestic servant. There is no father named on this birth cert. He also went by the name Ernest Alfred Christopher Gibson Downes. (Alfred was his mothers father) The other names may or may not relate to his father. His marriage cert gives his father as Thomas Gibson Downes, Building Contractor.
This or a variation of it may be his father name, but names were often given for marriages to keep a air of respectability.
The family believe that his father emigrated to Austrialia. He kept in touch with Florence and sent photos back. The attached photo of a young man I think is of his father. I also have a photo of a contruction site,dated 30.4.1904. which I believe is where he was working and why he went to Austrialia.
He would have gone to Austrialia between June 1903 and April 1904.
His secret of an illegitimate son may have gone to his grave with him but does any one recognise the man in the photo, his story or have any immigration or employment records that would help identify my Great grandfather?
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This is a fantastic photo :) I have asked a Moderator to move this thread (and your other thread) to the main Australian board, because it should catch more eyes there.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=656085.0
Cheers, JM
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Hi ZKT, I am having a little problem working out who was who from your post :P Not unusual ::)
Was your Grandmothers maiden name DOWNES? or GIBSON?
Was your Grandfather Ernest Alfred Christopher Gibson DOWNES?
It is more than probable that your Grandfather was not actually illegitimate but rather inconveniently born early to your Great grandparents ;D
After all letters and photo's were exchanged so not unlikely that the intention was to marry but the space between them was a bit large, England to Australia...
Neil
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Hi
I am assuming that Florence's surname was DOWNES and that she was unmarried. If so it's unlikely that the father of your Ernest DOWNES actually has the surname DOWNES. My guess, and that's all it is, would be that perhaps the father of Ernest may have the surname GIBSON.
Unfortunately there are so many GIBSONs that it's not possible to be sure that any of them are the person you seek.
This looks like Florence's baptism? (Not that it helps with finding the father of the child!)
Florence Maud DOWNES
Christening: 8 Feb 1885 at Coppenhall, Cheshire, England
Father's Name: Alfred Downes
Mother's Name: Eleanor Downes
I see her in 1901 with her parents at 10 Mirion St, Monks Coppenhall in Crewe and in 1911 as a servant with Horatio ROWE in Birch Heath near Chester.
A very long shot:
Interestingly in 1901 there is a Thomas GIBSON, 25, also living in Monks Coppenhall, Cheshire at 25 Nantwich Rd, with his parents James R and Ann and a number of siblings; occupation hairdresser, born in Crewe. I cannot see this man in 1911.
This is a possible death for the above:
1954, Registration Place:Geraldton, Western Australia, reg no 48
Thomas GIBSON, 82
Father's Name: James
Mother's Name: Ann
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
http://www.bdm.dotag.wa.gov.au/_apps/pioneersindex/default.aspx
This man is buried at Geraldton, but apparently the MI only has his name, age and date of death
http://www.ozburials.com/CemsWA/Geraldton-Greenough/geraldton_f-m.htm
Australian death certificates have excellent information and are worth getting as there are details of spouse, birthplace etc (much better than the info on UK certificates!!). Of course the details on the certificate depend on the knowledge of the person giving the information. Unfortunately WA certificates are quite expensive! There are some marriages for various Thomas GIBSONs which may or may not be the same man.
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Hi following on from judb post,
This could be Thomas GIBSON 1954.
GIBSON (Thomas)
On May 3. at Geraldton
loved uncle of Florence (Mrs. C. Newman Geraldton.
Tom Gibson (Geraldton).
Vera (Mrs A. Thomas. York).
Cyril Gibson (London) and Ida (Mrs. P. Dunsire. Mullewa).
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/49632922?searchTerm=Thomas gibson&searchLimits=l-decade=195|||l-year=1954|||l-title=30|||l-category=Family+Notices
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Hmmm - having nephews with the same surname implies that he had a brother in WA. There were certainly a few siblings on the census entry, but none of the names really fit with these below.
1916 electoral roll has these people with surname GIBSON at Fitzgerald St, Geraldton
Amelia Beatrice, home duties
Florence Emily, married
John, carpenter
John Henry James, fitter
Thomas, decorator
Electoral rolls do not specify relationships and in this case do not even give the house number within the street.
??? :-\ Judith
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Thank you all for your help it is much appreciated. I have found some more photos of my Great grandad sent from Australia. I still dont know his name but in I it is more likely to be Christopher or Thomas Gibson.
I have some old Kodak Austral postcards from the 1920s of him. On the edge of each is written 'stevens photo 18 Regents St Fitzroy'. I dont know if stevens produced the postcards or is this grandads name?
I found a Regents st in Fitzroy Melbourne Victoria Australia.
Does anyone know if there was a photographers shop at 18 Regent st at this time?
I know its a long shot but can any one look up Thomas/ christopher Gibson born 1985 +/- 10years would have arrived Australia between june 1903 and april 1904 possibly arriving Melbourne. The was a builder when he left the UK, although the postcard show him in a field of crops so the may have become a farmer.
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Hmm this may be a long shot but it mentions a James Gibson and 18 Regent St Fitzroy where James assaulted a milk vendor who died. 1918
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article92925775
Strangely the only mention I have found is in a Lismore newspaper - must look some more for the original story in a Melbourne newspaper
regards,
Ros
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Here is an account in Melbourne newspapers - James lived in Nicholson St and found not guilty
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article1661009
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article1657846
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article1650289
The brawl occurred in Swanston street ... James was a labourer and the victim was an electrical engineer.
So it is looking irrelevant :)
regards,
Ros