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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Tikva on Friday 28 June 13 04:56 BST (UK)
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I am having some difficulty piecing together the Parents of a Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb (aka Charlotte Eliza Webb and aka Eliza Webb), who married George Grimes Oxley in St Mary, Islington, Middlesex on the 29th June 1851. The following are the pieces of information I have so far:
- On the Marriage Entry, her Father is recorded as William Starkey, and both her and George's address is recorded as 3 Felix Place.
- Her Mother's name was Charlotte.
- A William Starkey married a Charlotte Webb in Christ Church, St Marylebone, Middlesex, on the 20th November 1831. William is recorded as a Widower and Charlotte as a Widow at the time of this Marriage. Therefore, Charlotte's maiden name was not Webb.
- A Charlotte Richens married a Thomas Webb in St James, Paddington, Middlesex, on the 6th of October 1816.
- Going by the fact that Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb's surname was Webb, and not Starkey, I suspect that she was in fact the child of the Marriage above, and had 2 siblings, Charles Webb and Caroline Webb.
- On the 1841 Census, I have found a Charlotte Webb (the mother) with 3 children, Caroline, Cha (presumably Charles), and Charlotte, with her Occupation recorded as a Laundress, residing with a John Leach in Marylebone (St Pancras), Middlesex. (HO107/684/1124 p 42.)
- There is a Marriage record for a John Leach marrying a Charlotte Webb in the St Pancras Parish Chapel, Middlesex, on the 17th of July 1842. This indicates that she married the John Leach she was residing with in the 1841 Census.
- On the 1851 Census, I have found a Charlotte Leech (the mother) with 2 children, Charles Webb and Eliza Webb (likely to be Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb), with her Occupation recorded as a Laundress, residing at 3 Felix Place, Islington, Middlesex, where she is recorded as a Widow. (HO107/1499/136; Page 23.)
- On the 1861 Census, I have found a Charlotte Leach (the mother) with 2 grandchildren, George and Eliza Manns, with her Occupation recorded as a Laundress, residing at 3 Felix Place, Islington, Middlesex, again recorded as a Widow. (RG 9/126/42 p 36)
- There is a Marriage Record for a Caroline Webb marrying a George Manns in St James, Paddington, Middlesex on the 29th of August 1841, so the grandchildren mentioned above no doubt are children of this Marriage. Of note is the fact that on this Marriage Record, Caroline's father is recorded as Thomas Webb.
- When Charlotte Eliza Starkey Oxley (nee Webb) emigrated to Sydney, Australia in 1857, her Parents names are recorded as William and Charlotte, with William recorded as deceased, and Charlotte recorded as residing in Islington, Middlesex.
To put it bluntly, I am confused. I have 3 Marriage records for Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb's mother, and when she married for the third time (to John Leach), as well as in the 1841 Census, her Surname is recorded as Webb, but she married William Starkey in 1831, so surely her Surname should have been recorded as Starkey on both of those records? If William Starkey died very soon after the marriage, how likely is it that Charlotte would revert to her previous married name of Webb? If anyone else can shed some light on this, it would be greatly appreciated! I'm sure that the information I have above is correct, particularly in light of the fact that when Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb married George Grimes Oxley, her address is recorded as 3 Felix Place, the very same residence that her mother is living in on the 1851 and 1861 Censuses.
Many thanks for any assistance anyone can give!
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Did Charlotte actually marry William Starkey? I can see on the banns that the other entries have a marriage date but theirs has a cross next it? The 20 nov was the third date of the banns being called.
Jo :)
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Most likely she is the illegitimate daughter of William Starkey and Charlotte Webb, who for some reason never actually married, which is why she has both names and Charlotte married Leach as Webb.
Jo :)
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Did Charlotte actually marry William Starkey? I can see on the banns that the other entries have a marriage date but theirs has a cross next it? The 20 nov was the third date of the banns being called.
Jo :)
Ahhh, I hadn't thought of that. Does an 'X' next to an Entry like that usually indicate that the Marriage did not go ahead, as well as the missing Marriage Dates?
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Most likely she is the illegitimate daughter of William Starkey and Charlotte Webb, who for some reason never actually married, which is why she has both names and Charlotte married Leach as Webb.
Jo :)
Yes, I had wondered if she was illegitimate, but the *what I thought* was a Marriage Record, but was only Banns, confused me. If this is the case, would it be odd that she had William Starkey recorded as her Father when she married George Grimes Oxley?
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I have just realised that I've posted this in the wrong Forum, so could a Moderator please move it to the appropriate one? Many thanks.
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If she knew her father was William Starkey (and the Starkey in her name suggests this) then there is no reason for her not to name him as her father. I can't see her baptism anywhere but if her mother Charlotte was a widow in 1831 on the banns record and Charlotte Eliza was born 1833 hen Thomas Webb is not able to be the father. There is a burial at St Pancras for a William Starkey of ?oon Street, age 30, on 12 July 1832. This would make him quite a bit younger than Charlotte but not impossible.
Jo :)
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If she knew her father was William Starkey (and the Starkey in her name suggests this) then there is no reason for her not to name him as her father. I can't see her baptism anywhere but if her mother Charlotte was a widow in 1831 on the banns record and Charlotte Eliza was born 1833 hen Thomas Webb is not able to be the father. There is a burial at St Pancras for a William Starkey of ?oon Street, age 30, on 12 July 1832. This would make him quite a bit younger than Charlotte but not impossible.
Jo :)
It is interesting that you found a burial at St Pancras for William Starkey, as I have been trying to find him in the Censuses, but not finding any in the London area and wondered if he had died before 1837 and the registration of death requirement. I think it is certainly possible that William could have been younger than Charlotte, especially when I don't have an actual record of when Charlotte was born, and the dates on the Censuses vary. Is there any additional information on that Burial record you found, and is there somewhere that I can access it online? Many thanks!
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The record was on the Ancestry site, London Deaths & Burials, no extra details.
Jo :)
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Thank you - managed to find it :)
I'm now wondering if William Starkey was still alive when Charlotte Eliza Starkey Webb married in 1851, as William is recorded as being her father on the Marriage Entry (Church), and his Occupation is listed as Gardener. On Marriage records they seem to usually record if the parent is deceased or not, although I am unsure whether or not this was something they always did. I have found a William Starkey in an 1851 Census, who is a Patient in a hospital, and his Occupation is recorded as an Excavator, which is somewhat connected to being a Gardener (I think?).
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I have found a William Starkey in an 1851 Census, who is a Patient in a hospital, and his Occupation is recorded as an Excavator, which is somewhat connected to being a Gardener (I think?).
An Excavator at that time was usually a labourer working on the building of the railways. I have several ancestors who went into London around this time who are listed as such or alternatively labourers on various records.
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I have found a William Starkey in an 1851 Census, who is a Patient in a hospital, and his Occupation is recorded as an Excavator, which is somewhat connected to being a Gardener (I think?).
An Excavator at that time was usually a labourer working on the building of the railways. I have several ancestors who went into London around this time who are listed as such or alternatively labourers on various records.
Thank you for the clarification smudwhisk :)
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Hi Tikva
I am researching the Oxley/Mitchell family also and I may have some information for you. I live in Dunedin NZ and would love to contact you to discuss our similar research project. This is the first time I have been on this site so I am not sure how to make contact - any suggestions?
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Hi Istock - feel free to PM me, as I also live in Dunedin :)