RootsChat.Com
Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: rosie.posie on Thursday 27 June 13 23:28 BST (UK)
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i have james Brinkley born 1878 barnet . on his marriage cert it says his dad is james , but i actually think his farther is valentine brinkley and his mu was rhoda as my my James came from a gipsy family .i have soo hit a brick wall .. can anyone helphelpas every link i have the james brinkley with rhoda and valentine died 1907 , but i need some proof
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Hi and welcome to Rootschat
What occupation is given for his father and were either of the witnesses surname Brinkley
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Hi
Welcome to Rootschat.
Unfortunately there is no birth date given here but this looks like it might be the James you think is yours
Baptism Register
St Paul Edmonton
Enfield
James son of Valentine and Rhoda BRINKLEY of Winchemere Hill. Baptised privately 8th April 1879. Father's occupation Wire Work Maker
Cheers
Karenlee
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Valentine was a traveller in 1881 and died in 1885
Rhoda then married Christopher Gritty Smith and is on the 1891 census with sons Edward & James shown as Smith. Apparently Rhoda was married to Theophilus Scarrott prior to Valentine. Freebmd has a marriage to Rhoda Smith in 1862 Hendon Middlesex
Somebody called Kathleen has put this information on a transcription error notification so clearly has knowledge of the family
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This is what i know . on the 1911 census he was born 1878 Barnet . he married Elizabeth Kingham in 1913 , but she had 3 children by him previously ( could he have been married to someone else ) he died in 1915 greenwich union . His father on his marriage cert was James Occupation coastermonger.
the witnesses was annie webber (whick is Elizabeths sister)and a martha g goodall , they lived at church street Deptford . Thanks for the welcome :o)
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Interesting - completely different occupation for his father James than that of Valentine. A costermonger is what we would today call a greengrocer
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Long shot
1881 census , Harleston road , Grantham , Lincolnshire
In caravans
James Brinkley b 1851 Cambridge - occ traveller with ginger beer
Other families with him,
surnames
Bugg , Aylward, H?????? , Gray , Savile, Dorking ? , Bunker, Barker, Norton ? , Newey ,
also , a Walter Brinkley b 1859 Norfolk and family
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That 1881 entry does not have a son James b 1878 Barnet
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That 1881 entry does not have a son James b 1878 Barnet
No it dosn't , but he is listed as head of family but on his own \\ and married . No wife/family with him in the camp . His wife and any possible children ? probably elsewhere ?
Maybe Walter is related to the OP too ?
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Will have to do some checking on that Walter BRINKLEY as I have that name in my husband's tree ... from Norfolk area ...
Karenlee
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there is deffenatley a walter brinkley in his tree as my dad remembers an uncle walter .. i just need proof that the james who died in 1907 is that of rhoda and valentine , coz im sure mine is the sone of them .
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although he didnt know him , he remembers his nan talking about him
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There might be a familial link somewhere back in time but my Walter was born 1846 Suffolk, ended up in Norfolk for a while......
This looks like it might be the James and Walter found in 1881...
1861 Census England Norfolk Burnham Ulph and Sutton
RG9/1248/59/17
Burnham Market
BRINKLEY
Johnathan Head Marr 39 Licenced Hawker Hertfordshire Witting
Rachael Wife Marr 39 Wife Herfordshire Walfield
James Son Unmarr 14 Hawker Hertfordshire Southwood
Edward Son Unmarr 12 Norfolk Cley
Walter Son Unmarr 4 Norfolk Flitching
Rosanna Dau Unmarr 1 Norfolk Flitching
Karenlee
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Maybe your James was Valentines grandson , via son James , brought up as his lad ? .
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cause of james age he can only be the son .. i think valentine was a nick a name coz i cant find his birth
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http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/2352/rg14_06732_0325_03/39415015?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3fnew%3d1%26gsfn%3djames%2b%26gsln%3dbrinkley%2b%26rank%3d1%26gss%3dangs-c%26sbo%3d1%26pcat%3d35%26h%3d39415015%26db%3d1911England%26indiv%3d1&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord
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I can see two Valentine BRINKLEY...
Baptism Register
Redbourn
Hertfordshire
Valentine son of Joseph and Anne BRINKLEY of Redbourn. Baptised 14th March 1819. Father's Occupation Labourer
Baptisms in Barton Cambridgeshire
Valentine son of Valentine BRINKLEY a Traveller and Marianne BEETON Baptised 7th Jan 1844 in the abode of William HERTS.
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James Brinkley b 1878 at Barnet
James Brinkley b 1851 Cambridge (1881 census at Grantham , abode caravans ) possibly s/o Valentine b 1819 ?
All somehow related to Valentine bapt Cambridgeshire 1844 ?
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but can anyone see a birth for valentine ? perhaps my james dad had a nick nane valentint just like some gypsies.. im so lost :(
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1861 Census England Norfolk South Lynn
RG9/1257/149/16
5 Guanock?? Road
BRINKLEY
Valentine HeadMarr 38 Cane Chair Maker Herefordshire
Mary A Wife Marr 38 Umbrella Maker Suffolk Newmarket
Anes Dau Unmarr 19 Umbrella Maker Cambridgeshire Cambridge
Sydney Son Unmarr 18 Cane Chair Maker Cambridgeshire Cambridge
Marrelly Dau Unmarr 13 Scholar Norfolk Middleton
Urana Dau Unmarr 11 Scholar Cambridgeshire Cambridge
Valentine Son Unmarr 8 Scholar Norfolk Grimstone
Mary A Dau Unmarr 7 Scholar Norfolk Creal?
Harriett Dau Unmarr 4 Scholar Norfolk Tring
Plato Son Unmarr 2 Scholar Norfolk Starling
Bonner Son Unmarr 3wks Norfolk Lynn
Karenlee
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i have james Brinkley born 1878 barnet . on his marriage cert it says his dad is james , but i actually think his farther is valentine brinkley and his mu was rhoda as my my James came from a gipsy family .i have soo hit a brick wall .. can anyone helphelpas every link i have the james brinkley with rhoda and valentine died 1907 , but i need some proof
I dont think this James is Rhodas son..as far as I know he did die. I am descended from Rhodas daughter Conceletta from her marriage to Theophilus Scarrott. Councey married Walter Brinkley, nephew to Valentine who got together with Rhoda some time in the 1870s. Someone else on here is also researching that James Brinkley - her name is Deb, maybe you can do a search for James Brinkley and find her posts?
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Hi smiley , thats the James i need proof of that was Rhoda's son cos that James that died in 1907 died in a union and had no relatives as i called the relevant ppl and no family WAS WITH HIM WHEN HE DIED i think if Rhoda's son was dying surely she or his brother would be there .. i just need proof that Rhodas son James aint mine .. My dad always said we was related to smiths but only by marriage . whatever that means :o)
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ps the Debs on here is my cousin she is trying to find the same info as me lol . She is a kingham but should be a brinkley :o)
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my dads aunt Peggy Smith married Arthur Brinkley ,she would have been born between 1883 and 1900ish sorry i don't know much more ,there was a grandaughter called Bethorny also an Annjane Brinkley.They travelled the east midlands ,Northants ,Warwickshire and area .
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Hello i have another valentine brinkley born 1874 ely cambridgeshire on his birth cert it says father valentine and mother caroline brinkley (whose married name was brunt and maiden name was ball) but in the 1891 census it has his father as james not valentine and even more confusing is in the 1911 census his name has changed to valentine brunt and caroline has gone back to brunt as well ,i know this is correct as caroline is my great great grandmother my great great grandfather thomas perkins brunt died in 1870 but i cant find marriage for caroline and james/valentine
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I am pretty sure it is Critty (not Gritty) Smith because he was my great great grandfather and I heard his name spoken by his grand-daughter, Lilah GUMBLE.
This is the marriage referred to earlier in the thread:
MDX[15] Gt Stanmore St John m3/2/1862 Theophilus (full) brazier (fa: John – brazier) = Rhoda SMITH (full) (fa: William – brazier)
Rhoda was indeed born SMITH, became wife of Theophilus SCARROTT, then of Valentine BRINKLEY, then of Christopher SMITH, although I am not sure if there was a marriage ceremony for all.
TL