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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: mineyours+ours on Thursday 27 June 13 12:42 BST (UK)
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My great grandfather John Deam arrived in New Zealand between 1871 (last census recorded in, in England) and 1885. I don’t know where, the first sign of him that I have in NZ is a marriage cert in Waipawa, New Zealand.
Some background info about him - I have his birth cert, he was born 12 Dec 1853 to Thomas Deam and Mary Deam, formerly James, in the District of Redruth, in the County of Cornwall. He was a Tin Miner and was with the family still in the 1871 census.
Now, I have his marriage cert to Alice Catherine Hallasey (aged 21, birthplace NZ) at St Peters Church, Waipawa on 23 Feb, 1885. Her parents are Michal Hallasey and Kate Hallasey. Johns (aged 24, birthplace England) father is John (incorrect) Deam and mother Mary Deam, formerly James. On another form, Applications to marry in the Waipawa District, (spelling here is Hallassy) it says for John the length of residence is 5 years and Alice is 12 years (therefore assuming she was born elsewhere?).
The huge problem I have is that he is mentioned, in a newspaper article, as being in Paeroa/Te Aroha in 1887 and they are talking about him being in the area in October 1885 with my great grandmother Sarah. Sarahs mother was quoted as being "an aboriginal woman", her father was from England. I can't find a death for Alice Deam although there is an Alice Dean died 1934 in NZ BDM. Deams are sometimes written as Dean. Have also tried variations of Hallasey. Is this Alice Deam transcribed incorrectly or did they divorce and she remarried? I can't find any marriage for John and Sarah so the family has always assumed they lived together as husband and wife? There is a marriage mentioned on his death cert but is this referring to Alice or Sarah.
??? Any help as to why he left Alice and appeared in the Waikato in the same year would be most gratefully received at this stage. M
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Hi,
Early divorce conditions favoured the male, copying English law of the time. They may not have divorced, only separated.
The history of New Zealand divorce law is here:
http://www.teara.govt.nz/en/1966/divorce-and-separation
I suggest that you adopt the working theory that the Alice DEAN who died in 1934 is Alice DEAM, and work to eliminate her. Look for a burial around where they lived; Waipawa, Paeroa, Waikato region generally. Try to avoid buying a death certificate unless you can confirm it's her.
Online Cemeteries are listed here by region:
http://www.clanfraser.org.nz/genealogy/cemeterylinks.html
Spades
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Hello
Sorry, can't help with information for Alice just yet.
But did you see the newspaper article relating to the death of a George Brewer SIMPSON (1899) ?
It mentions that he, ("Old Geordie" SIMPSON), was the father-in-law of John DEAM of Paeroa.
http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz
"Ohinemuri Gazette" - 12 July 1899 - page 2
~ Lu
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Sarahs mother was quoted as being "an aboriginal woman"
Hi,
Can't help with Alice, but looking at the name of Sarah Simpson's mother, "Riria Hopewai" for the John Deam Family Trees on Ancestry, her name looks like it is Maori, but I stand to be corrected. :-\
Cheers
KHP
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... ooops, apologies ... I somehow misunderstood what you'd written and thought that Sarah was John DEAM's first wife. Silly of me ... but have it sorted out now. ;)
Re: Alice DEAN - died 1934 :
Someone here with a burial locator can possibly give assistance with place of burial for this lady ?
And hopefully that may allow you to determine whether she is a likely candidate.
[This Alice DEAN died on 13 December 1934 and it appears that Archives New Zealand hold a probate file for her - dated 1935. ]
~ Lu
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Hi Lu :D
Alice Dean aged 67 is located at Kelvin Grove Cemetery.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0uyd/
I don't think it is the Alice that is being searched. According to the E/R for 1928 for Manawatu/Wanganui the person above their married surname was actually Dean.
Cheers
KHP
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Divorce was a very expensive option back in the 1880's (and something generally only the wealthy resorted to). And so when marriages amongst the "working classes" foundered, the parties concerned, usually just moved on into other relationships.
It seems feasible that John DEAM could have been in Paeroa/Te Aroha in or around October, 1885 - particularly if the marriage to Alice in February 1885 was short-lived.
~ Lu
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Cheers, KHP.
Yes, I had my doubts it was the Alice being sought.
~ Lu
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HALLASEY / HALLASY
The parents of Alice ("Michal and Kate") are likely the following couple who are buried at Hawke's Bay - Tikokino (Hampden) Cemetery :
HALLASEY - Michael 84 years - died 22 April 1913
HALLASEY - Catherine (wife) - died 13 August 1920 (85 ? years)
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I did try on the cemetery search facility for Tikokino, looking for an "Alice Catherine" with another surname, but to no avail.
What could be helpful though, is that there is a probate file for Michael HALLASEY held at Archives NZ (in Wellington), which may give details of his children ?
I'm happy to have a look at this file for you, when next at Archives.
~ Lu
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Hi Lucy,
A question............
Is Tikokino the Maori name for Hampden? I have only heard of the settlement of Hampden situated between Palmerston (South) and Oamaru.
Just brushing up on my geography! :)
Minniehaha.
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Hi Minniehaha
this confirms your hunch
http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-Cyc06Cycl-t1-body1-d2-d27-d44.html
Cheers Janette
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Ah, you learn something everyday!
Thanks Janette.
Minniehaha. :)
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Thank you everyone for your input. I should have put a few more details shouldn't I.
Lu, yes George Brewer Simpson was the father of Sarah, but when they say father in law in the newspaper article, is that legally father in law or just the term used, but not actually?
It almost sounds like they gave her to him and that was why I was wondering if the marriage referred to on Johns death cert was for Alice.
KHP, yes Riria was Maori. (trying to find her origins also but will try to sort this mystery first).
Thank you for ruling out Alice who died 1934. I was wondering if it was the usual mis transcribing of the m for an n but seeing the headstone definitely rules her out.
Lu I would very much appreciate if you could look at Michael Hallasey's file at Archives NZ as that does look to be her parents, so any information would be wonderful.
Alice just seems to have disappeared! The following is said very light heartedly - in the newspaper article I found, John didn't come across as a man with high morals so it does make me wonder what happened to Alice ;) ;)
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Spades thank you for the two links, I have bookmarked for future reference.
Cheers,
M
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Lu I would very much appreciate if you could look at Michael Hallasey's file at Archives NZ as that does look to be her parents, so any information would be wonderful.
Hi
Have looked at the will of Michael HALLASEY- Farmer - formerly of Taradale and lately of Tikokino, who died on 22 April 1913, and sorry to say, it did not contain a single mention of any of his children. :(
[There was an element of intrigue about the document - the will had been written in November 1872 and somewhat worse for wear, had been handed to a solicitor in Napier in 1902 for safe-keeping (- with a special note on file explaining its plight). "Katherine HALLASEY, my well-beloved wife" was the only beneficiary. Interestingly the signatures of both Michael and his wife, showed their surname as HALLASY. And the wife as Executrix, signed an affidavit (unusually) with two signatures - "Katherine" and "Catherine" HALLASY.]
Mmm ... not of help in finding daughter Alice. :(
~ Lu
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Hi Lu,
Very disappointing :(, but thank you very much.
Since reading this I was entering different spelling anywhere I could think and in Archives, Wellington, there is a Coroners Inquest for a Catherine Hallasey for 1920. It does have restricted access for preservation reasons. Do you think this might be Michaels wife?
I'm not sure how Archives works and whether they can be viewed or not when restricted, but if possible and if you think it might be worthwhile could I impose upon you again Lu next time you are there?
I can find no other records for Alice anywhere but I did find two more births for Michael and Catherine, Thomas Michael born in 1865 and Anne born in 1881. These were under the spelling Hallasy. I also found a death for Michael Hallasey, 9 months died 1864. Can't find a birth for Michael so wondered if this may be for Thomas Michael, also no death for Thomas Michael.
Also found a marriage for a Annie Hallasey in 1920 (Although this would make her 39!) Do you think it might be worth sending for to see if she is a relative and work forward to living relatives who may know some history?
Why oh why don't I have straight forward easy to find relatives ::)
Will wait for your advice Lu,
Cheers,
M
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Hello,
The Catherine Hallasey who died in 1920 was aged 85 years. See New Zealand BDM index @
www.dia.govt.nz
[If ordering at any time, it is best to obtain a printout as these are cheaper, may have more information than a certificate and can be e-mailed to you..............]
Minniehaha.
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I also found a death for Michael Hallasey, 9 months died 1864.
There is a Michael Hallasey aged 9 months in 1865.... location only says Napier :)
Cheers
KHP
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Also found a marriage for a Annie Hallasey in 1920 (Although this would make her 39!)
Did you mean the marriage for 1902?
Cheers
KHP
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A snippet from "Papers Past" concerning brothers M. Hallasey from Hampden and Laurence Hallasay.
[Spelling of surnames as shown.]
'Hawkes Bay Herald' dated 26.3.1900.
Minniehaha.
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School Records:
Name - HALLASAY Annie
School - Hampden
Register Number - 336
Former Reg. - No 169
Admission Date - 11 May 1896
Parent / Guardian - Michael Hallasay
Address - Hampden
Birthdate - 11 Jun 1881
Last School - Hampden
Last Day - 05 Jun 1896
Destination - Home duties
Further enquiries to Oamaru Branch - NZSG
Cheers
KHP
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That is interesting KHP.............Here we have an Annie Hallasay @ school in Hampden. "Further enquiries to OAMARU branch". Would this indicate that the Hampden in this instance is the one near Oamaru, in the South Island?
Whereas mention has been made earlier of family burials in Tikokino (Hampden cemetery) in the North Island.
Minniehaha.
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Interesting as you say Minnie, throwing these into the mix as well, since you mentioned two brothers with the names Michael and Laurence ;D
These will need to be verified if they belong to the same family .... remember that dates of birth on here are taken with a pinch of salt.
Name : HALLASSY Jane
School : Hampden
Register Number : 51
Admission Date : Jan 1882
Parent / Guardian : M Hallassy
Address : Hampden
Birthdate : Oct 1874
Last Day : 06 Aug 1886
Destination : Gone to service
Further enquiries to Oamaru Branch - NZSG
Name : HALLASSY Lawrence
School : Hampden
Register Number : 110
Admission Date : 17 Sep 1883
Parent / Guardian : Michael Hallassy
Address : Hampden
Birthdate : 24 Jul 1878
Further enquiries to Oamaru Branch - NZSG
Name : HALLASSY Lizzie
School : Hampden
Register Number : 39
Admission Date : 21 Mar 1881
Parent / Guardian : A M Hallassy
Address : Hampden
Birthdate : Nov 1869
Last Day : 24 Mar 1881
Further enquiries to Oamaru Branch - NZSG
Name : HALLASSY Theresa
School : Hampden
Register Number : 107
Former Reg. No : 48
Admission Date : 10 Sep 1883
Parent / Guardian : M Hallassy
Address " Hampden
Birthdate : 10 Jun 1871
Name : HALLASSY Michael
School : Hampden
Register Number : 11
Admission Date :Jan 1880
Parent / Guardian : M Hallassy
Address : Hampden
Birthdate : Jun 1873
I notice there is a death for a Michael Hallasey in 1924 aged 53 at Hampden Cemetery
Cheers
KHP
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Yes KHP, this is becoming even more interesting. I 'feel' that this South Island family must be one and the same as that found in the North. Lawrence/Laurence was not a particularly common name and neither I would think, was Hallassy (or its various spellings).
However, is it not too much of a coincidence for the same family to end up at Hampden in both Islands??
Was the Hampden cemetery where Michael was buried in 1924, in the South Island?
Minniehaha.
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I should have said Tikokino Hampden Cemetery ::) Doesn't say South Island, but certainly looks it. Cemetery Fiche numbers are available.
William Hallasey and Mary Elizabeth are there as well.
I notice that for Catherine's age it is shown as 88 and 85 years.
Cheers
KHP
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Had to go on a hunt and just found my NZ Cemetery Records - A List of Holdings Book and Tikokino Hampden is in the Waipukurau/Waipawa District.
I have found these names:
Hallasey Catherine Tikokino (Hampden)
Hallasey Mary Elizabeth Tikokino (Hampden)
Hallasey Michael Tikokino (Hampden)
Hallasey Michael Tikokino (Hampden)
Hallasey William Tikokino (Hampden)
Photographs of the headstones :D link for it at bottom where it says "Information Links"
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0vc5/
Cheers
KHP
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Have just rechecked electoral rolls, and the HALLASY (however spelt) name, is clearly associated with the North Island - Tikokino / Waipawa etc. etc.
And, from what I recall of the Will of Michael HALLASEY (and associated records filed with it), - and also some earlier gleanings from PapersPast,- he seems to have been (only) in the Hawkes Bay region.
KHP - is it possible to find out from NZSG records, whether there was also a South Island (near to Oamaru) school also named Hampden?
Q. Have NZSG indexed two Hampden schools (1 North Island ... 1 South Island) ? Or might it have just been assumed that enquiries should be directed to Oamaru NZSG because the South Island place name Hampden, is more well known than the one in Hawkes Bay ??
Cheers
~ Lu
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RE: NZSG School records ... sorry, don't want to detract from the real purpose of this thread ... just curious about Hampden records (Nth or Sth Islands.)
;)
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Just for the record, Michael HALLASY, is shown as having a freehold property (Shakespeare Rd, Napier) as early as April 1860. He's also recorded as being in the Hawkes Bay area during the 1880's.
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? Or might it have just been assumed that enquiries should be directed to Oamaru NZSG because the South Island place name Hampden, is more well known than the one in Hawkes Bay ??
Cheers
~ Lu
I am guessing the latter Lu.
Cheers
KHP
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Cheers. :)
[A child, Mary HALLASSY - at school in Hampden (Hawkes Bay) 1878 -- A Mr HALLASSY on school committee (same place) in the 1880's.]
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Lawrence Hallasey died in 1949 aged 76 .... location Park Island Cemetery, Napier.
Cheers
KHP
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Cheers. :)
[A child, Mary HALLASSY - at school in Hampden (Hawkes Bay) 1878 -- A Mr HALLASSY on school committee (same place) in the 1880's.]
This could be her marriage from the CD
Year 1884 HALLASY to Edward Reeves
Also of note the NZSG hold in their Certificate Collection for a Kate Hallsay 24 Jan 1896, place Hampden, HBY.
Just of interest and another angle for the surname, on the Kiwi Index .....the 1864 marriage of Michael Hallasy, comments that it is also under MALLESEY
Cheers
KHP
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KHP & Lucy..................
Time you both stopped for a Kit Kat I think! ;D You have provided some very interesting information this morning.
Minniehaha.
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Sounds like a jolly good idea, Minnie. :)
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Hi KHP ... Kate HALLSAY (Hampden, HBY) sounds interesting ... wonder what the 1896 date refers to ?
~ Lu
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Hi KHP ... don't know if you also saw on CD, this following marriage ?
Annie HALLASEY - Edward REEVES - 1902
Did Mary (wife of Edward REEVES) die ... and her sister has gone on to marry her bro-in-law ?
(Some children to an Annie and Edward 1902 +. Also a pre-nuptial child to Annie H. )
Blimey .. we're going "all around the pig" with this one ... where's Alice ??? ;D
~ Lu
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Not sure if this has been covered, but in the first post mention is made of Sarah, second wife (common law/ legal?) of John Deam.
There is a death for a Sarah Deam in 1936 aged 67 years, therefore year of birth abt. 1869.
[NZ BMD Index[] I was not able to find a marriage for her.
Minniehaha.
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Online trees (@ ancestry) - HALLASY / HALLESEY ... mention Jane (m. EBBETT) and Mary (m. Edward REEVES - and her death in 1899) ... but they don't connect back to Michael and Catherine (Katherine). :(
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Undertaker's Records
Name DEAM Sarah
Date 9 Jul 1936
Undertaker W Sibun & Sons
Place of residence Waihi
Cemetery Shortland
Age 67
My eyes can't see her on the website.
Cheers
KHP
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Hi KHP ... don't know if you also saw on CD, this following marriage ?
Annie HALLASEY - Edward REEVES - 1902
Did Mary (wife of Edward REEVES) die ... and her sister has gone on to marry her bro-in-law ?
(Some children to an Annie and Edward 1902 +. Also a pre-nuptial child to Annie H. )
Blimey .. we're going "all around the pig" with this one ... where's Alice ??? ;D
~ Lu
Yes, I did, and the OP posted it this morning in Reply #15, but put 1920 down instead.Sounds like a jolly good idea, Minnie. :)
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Hi KHP ... Kate HALLSAY (Hampden, HBY) sounds interesting ... wonder what the 1896 date refers to ?
~ Lu
Now I am definitely chasing my tail on this one, with all the various spellings,, it is no wonder I tripped myself up, ;D the name should be Hallasy .... apologies .... not sure, what it refers to, could perhaps be a birth of a child, marriage or a death? Guess, that is what we have to find out ;D
I think Kate Hallasy.... is Katherine/Catherine and I am taking a stab, that if her marriage was in 1864 to Michael, then the year 1896 is possibly a marriage of one of the children.
Cheers
KHP
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Undertaker's Records
Name DEAM Sarah
Date 9 Jul 1936
Undertaker W Sibun & Sons
Place of residence Waihi
Cemetery Shortland
Age 67
My eyes can't see her on the website.
Cheers
KHP
Hi KHP it appears she is buried as Dean
DEAN Sarah
Age: 67Years
Date of Birth
Date of Death
Date of Burial 11/07/1936
Gender Female
Last Address
Place of Death
Cemetery Shortland Cemetery
Location PUBL-PLOT-2986
Plot Type Normal
Plot Status Used
Capacity 2
Funeral Director Twentymans Funeral Services Lt
Notes Native of: New Zealand
Twentymans have excellent records,it might be worth an email,
Cheers Janette
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Ta .... I even looked at Dean as well ;D Glasses must need cleaning :P
Cheers
KHP
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I think Kate Hallasy.... is Katherine/Catherine and I am taking a stab, that if her marriage was in 1864 to Michael, then the year 1896 is possibly a marriage of one of the children.
Cheers
KHP
Wasn't a marriage but a death for Theresa.
Cheers
KHP
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Theresa O'SULLIVAN - 26 years - d. 1896. ???
[Theresa HALLASEY m. John O'SULLIVAN - 1894 ]
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At the time I was only searching the maiden name, hence why her parents matched the dates ... so didn't realise that she was married. If I had just done a search with just the year and without names I would have seen the husband's name ;D ::) :P
She is buried at the cemetery link I gave above.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0vc5/
Cheers
KHP
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HALLASEY / HALLASY
HALLASEY - Michael 84 years - died 22 April 1913
HALLASEY - Catherine (wife) - died 13 August 1920 (85 ? years)
http://cemeteries.chbdc.govt.nz
Hi M
Back to your (much) earlier question. :D
Yes, the Coroner's file (1920), is for Catherine, wife of Michael.
Have added the link ^ (above) for their cemetery records which I omitted from previous post.
Will endeavour to view Coroner's file next time I'm at Archives.
~ Lu
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Also found a marriage for a Annie Hallasey in 1920 (Although this would make her 39!) Do you think it might be worth sending for to see if she is a relative and work forward to living relatives who may know some history?
Hi again
Pleased to say you can cross the above Annie (m. 1920), off your list. [ There was a divorce file for her (1963) - and she later used the names "Jean Annie Patricia". She was not however the sister of Alice. ]
I wouldn't buy any (BDM) "printouts" just yet - I think there are some further avenues to try before resorting to spending $$. ;)
~ Lu
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Annie HALLASEY - Edward REEVES - 1902
Did Mary (wife of Edward REEVES) die ... and her sister has gone on to marry her bro-in-law ?
(Some children to an Annie and Edward 1902 +. Also a pre-nuptial child to Annie H. )
Hi M
My hunch re: Annie HALLASEY marrying her late sister (Mary's) husband, would seem to be correct.
But just to confuse matters, after Edward REEVES died in 1913, Annie had yet another marriage - this time using the name of Annie Lilian REEVES. ::)
Possibly when Mary died, she stepped in to care for Mary and Edward's children - one of whom was a son Alfred REEVES who died in WW1. Alfred's file tells that he was born in Hastings, and was the son of the late Mary and Edward REEVES. But on his Army attestation form he'd named his Next-of-Kin as : "Mrs W. QUINNEY (Mother), Boundary Road, Hastings."
NZ Marriage
Annie Lilian REEVES - Walter Francis QUINNEY -- 1914
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Burial - Hastings Cemetery
QUINNEY - Anne - died 10 August 1949 - aged 68 years [bc 1881]
[with Walter Francis QUINNEY - d. 1955 - 73 years ]
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PS : Have another idea we can try in the search for the elusive Alice ... but will add this tomorrow, when I'm slightly more awake. ;D
~ Lu
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Lu, this is possibly John Henry Reeves born in 1893.
School Records (APWs)
Name : REEVES Henry
School : Hampden
Register Number 478
Admission Date : 1 Apr 1902
Parent / Guardian : Mr Hallassy
Address : Hampden
Last School : Pukehau
Cheers
KHP
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Ah .. great work KHP ! :)
Quite probably the grandfather (Mr HALLASSY) ?
Cheers
~ Lu
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Looks like others seem to be looking as there are trees for him on both Ancestry and Mundia, also others with trees for Mary Hallesy.
Cheers
KHP
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Mmm .. think I looked at those earlier ?? Will go back though for another "gizz". ;)
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Just thought it would be of interest of Mary's place of birth :D
Cheers
KHP
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Mmm ... yes, did I see someone had suggested Mary, "born in Ireland - Cork ?".
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Dunno, KHP. ;D
The trees I viewed don't seem to lead "anywhere". Just a collection of names ?
One which has Mary and Edward's children, also has Constance, born 1911 ? [ Constance according to NZ BDM, was the child of Annie [HALLASEY] and Edward REEVES ? ]
Grrr ! Need to find Alice H. :D
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It is frustrating ........... :D
I don't know where Alice is, I have turned every stone sideways, upside down, and whichever way in my sources, just putting Alice's two names in. I did think that perhaps maybe she had died in child birth or something else, but that is only speculation on my part and then there should be a death record.
Cheers
KHP
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Mmm ... I was more of the view that her marriage to DEAM was very short-lived ... and that he moved on, eventually setting up a few years later with Sarah SIMPSON. [ There is no "obvious" marriage record for John DEAM /Sarah SIMPSON. ]
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No, I couldn't find one either, but did notice that the birth of a child to John Deam in 1890 on School Records has been spelt as Diem on the burial locator.
Cheers
KHP
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Hi everyone,
A huge thanks for all the work everyone has been putting in. As I keep telling my family, since joining rootschat, I can't get over how everyone is so helpful with their ideas and the time that is spent. :-* :-*
Now, apologies for the blooper the other night with the year 1920. I am usually doing this in the wee small hours of the morning and occassionally see things I am not seeing ;)
From all the input I have:
Mary married Edward Reeves and after 9 children passed away in 1899 ::)
Anne had a pre nup child in 1901 who died in 1902 at 20months, she then married Edward and went on to have a further 4 children.
Edward passed away in 1913 and Annie remarried WF Quinney in 1914.
Ann passed away in 1949.
I can confirm that you are correct with the sisters marrying the same man and also the last marriage because ..... yesterday, working forwards from the marriage you gave for Reeves I found a living relative ;D (not sure what I can put here as it is a living relative)
She was very interested but isn't sure of the family history but she said her 85 year old sister would know more. Unfortunately she is in Australia at the moment until the end of the month, but she said they will have a think and talk when she gets back and then ring me. Soo it is patience M, patience.
Now, it has me stumped (as well as you, Lu and KHP) about Alice!! With all the records for the other children, and I also think they are all the same family from the Hawkes Bay area, there is nothing for Alice except for the marriage cert. Whether she died, no death certs, or they just split, there is no further records for her.
Also nothing before the marriage cert. Now that comment about Ireland has me wondering. I was just browsing on familysearch and noticed the name Hallasey seemed to be Irish people. Also I have an Applications to marry in the Waipawa district form, and on it for length of residence John states 5 years (after England then ??) and Alice states 12 years. BUT we have the marriage of Michael and Katherine Taylor in 1864 on Kiwi Index, which would have been approx Alice's birth year.
Minnie, re your comments about Sarah, yes I have the deaths etc for her but have never found a marriage. I am assuming if he just left Alice he has simply moved in with Sarah. On his death cert they have, married in Paeroa to Sarah Simpson but personally I think that is a 'formality' to cover the life with Sarah and all the children ;)
Even if I don't find what has happened to Alice I think her descendants will be really pleased to receive all the info we have.
Just remembered, Lu what was your other idea you mentioned for searching for Alice?
Oh well better get some sleep, once again the wee small hours.
I hope I haven't missed anyone with my thanks as I do appreciate the time and effort everyone puts in.
Cheers, M
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Didn't get to bed yet. Just searching, searching, searching.
Please feel free to tell me I'm blooping again but have any of you found another Catherine Hallasey apart from the mother (who is Catherine and Katherine sometimes)?
Because I have just found a Catherine Hallisey. She married Daniel Finnigan in 1889 (John was in 1885) and went on to have 10 children, the first was named Kathleen (Catherines mother was Kate on marriage cert). She died in 1944 aged 78 years which makes birth approx 1865, 66 which would tie in with Alice Catherine. I'm thinking if she has committed bigamy she could have quite easily dropped Alice. Have I found her do you think??
Will wait with bated breath for a reply (no actually I need to go and get some sleep!!)
Cheers, M
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Hi,
The above Catherine Finnigan is buried at Wakapuaka Cemetery Nelson.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0vdm/
Cheers
KHP
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Hmm ... I'd checked out this Catherine HALLISEY earlier. (Not really convinced she was Alice Catherine).
There is a tree at ancestry - suggesting she was born 15 August 1866 at Nelson - no parents names given (and can't see, under various spellings, a listing of her birth at NZ BDM. )
~ Lu
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Only a suggestion, perhaps we need to find out how many children were listed in the parent's death certificates?
Cheers
KHP
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Morning,
To be honest, I don't have much faith in the family trees. I made an enquiry about someone as to whether some members had heard of this person in their families or not and miraculously next time I went in he was in several trees, no checking, confirming, nothing.
Also, just being a devils advocate here, (lack of sleep), there being no confirmation of a birth for Catherine Hallisey made me wonder if that was because it wasn't her name. Having said that can't find a listing for Alice Catherines birth either!
I would have to order the death cert to find out the children wouldn't I. I was wondering myself how to find out the children. How reliable have you found the info because I have one, for another family, which doesn't list all the children. How common is this?
Cheers, M
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The info on a death printout is only as good as the informant who gave the info,so often not very reliable
Cheers Janette
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The death certs won't give the names, but it will give the ages. :D
I have been given info from family where no children were listed, and on further investigation they did indeed have children. So now I take info with a pinch of salt.
Wonder if Alice Catherine stayed in the Hawkes Bay area? I know there was an Earthquake in 1931 and records were destroyed.
Cheers
KHP
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... right, back to business. ;D Had to take a break, we've just had a nasty earthquake here in Welly (5.7) ... it's not very amusing when ya computer monitor starts dancing across the desk ! :D
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Yes, we've scooted all over the place with this HALLASEY family - but that's not such a bad thing - often information can come to light with a wider search.
Rather than purchase any death certs. at the moment, my idea (from earlier) was that you should perhaps contact the Napier Library. They hold information (in various forms) on early families in the area, and so there may be unpublished info for the HALLASEY or related families.
You may also like to ask the Library if they could source from the local newspaper(s), death notices for Michael and Catherine. Both these HALLASEY's lived to ripe ages (in their 80's), so it may be that there are obituaries for them too.
~ Lu
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Oooopsy Do! I just had to mention the word Earthquake and Lu got one ;D
Cheers
KHP
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Also I have an Applications to marry in the Waipawa district form, and on it for length of residence John states 5 years (after England then ??) and Alice states 12 years. BUT we have the marriage of Michael and Katherine Taylor in 1864 on Kiwi Index, which would have been approx Alice's birth year.
Just a clarification regarding "length of residency" as shown on Intention to Marry Notices (ITM's).
"Length of residency" refers to the time the parties (bride and groom), had lived in the actual locality in which they were to be married. [ It does not refer to the length of time they'd been in New Zealand. ]
~ Lu
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Yeah, I had a giggle at that, KHP ... but still kinda quivering in me boots. (Scary stuff). :D
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Link to Napier Library >
http://library.napier.govt.nz/
Main Menu (on side bar) > click on "[ + ] Resources" to find Genealogy link.
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Lu, thinking of you. Went through an e (won't tempt fate with full word) as a child and I have never forgotten it. Horrible.
Yep I knew about the length of residency but was just throwing some thoughts about that maybe they had moved from elsewhere because couldn't find any births for Alice but then shot that one down with the marriage for Michael and Catherine.
Good idea about the Napier Library, will definitely do. Had forgotten about the major e in that area, so as KHP said records may have been destroyed.
Never mind, keeping positive, will contact the library and see what comes of it.
Cheers, M
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Went through an e (won't tempt fate with full word) as a child and I have never forgotten it. Horrible.
Cheers, M
Yes, they are horrible, we experienced one a couple of years ago in Vanuatu which was a 7.5.
Cheers
KHP
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Finally an update. The living relative I spoke of earlier did contact me and yes they remembered a person from the South Island visiting and the name Finnigan did ring a bell.
I took the chance and ordered the marriage cert for Catherine Hallisey and Daniel Finnigan and she is my Alice Catherine Hallasey. The boat he had immigrated on had passed through the Hawkes Bay region so possibly that was when they met.
She went on to have at least 9 children with him and passed away aged 78 yrs.
So, no dastardly deed was committed. Still not sure what John was doing in the area but will contact the library to see if any info.
Many thanks for your time and effort Lu and KHP.
Cheers, M.
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Hello Just wondering if you know who the parents of Riria Hopewai is please?
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Hello Just wondering if you know who the parents of Riria Hopewai is please?
Hi clintonstorer2017
This request needs to have a new thread posted on the NZ board,if Riria Hopewai is still alive we can't post information here,
Cheers Janette
PS this is the completed requests.
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Hi Clintonstorer2017,
Have started new thread:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=800756.0
Cheers, M
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Info on John Deam. I have recently started my family tree on My heritage and it has all the info on there for the links, information from my family records including burial and death certs etc etc. I have spent four days uploading stuff into there.
My mother was Edna-May Dean and John Deam was my great Grandfather on my mothers side.
Riria Hopewai was originally named Lydia, Died in Thames 18 June 1922. I have been compiling rather a lot of what my mother had researched.
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Hi Helen,
Could you make another couple of posts so that I can send a Personal Message to you re our family please. They don't have to include much but new members have to post three times before PM's can be sent.
Many thanks, M
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Of course, just found the hallassy link!
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Seems she was his first wife - before Sarah Deam, in notes made by my mum - they either parted or she died