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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Dumfriesshire => Topic started by: stoop on Sunday 16 June 13 18:51 BST (UK)
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I am interested in identifying individual farms at the Stoop, particularly around the 1820s to the 1840s. Who were the landowners of the farms in the area and are there any records relating to the tenants.? tHANKS STOOP.
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Hi
It could be difficult to identify individual owners at that time. Valuation rolls began in 1855 and should provide all the information from then on. Previous to that there is the 1841 census but that only lists occupants. Another good source is the Horse Tax from 1796/7. Most farmers had a horse but that wouldn't say whether they owned or rented. I should imagine that most of the Stoop would be part of Parkhead estate but I have never came across any records from that.
Ian A McClumpha
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Much obliged Ian, you have added to my knowledge by referring to the Parkhead estate. Any idea who owned the Parkhead?. My g.g.g Thomas Ker farmed at the Stoop in every reference to him, there is not anything more specific than T.k farmer at the Stoop. It is very frustrating trying to trace him because cincidentally I was born and brought up at Greenbrae Loaning Stoop. So his fermtoun must have been close by. He died in 1829. Thanks again ,stoop.
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My 3 x great-grandfather, John Smart, also farmed at the Stoop according to the censuses for 1841 to 1861. He was born in Torthorwald, Dumfries in 1783, although he moved to Hamilton, Lanarkshire, when he married (in 1807). Sometime before 1839, he and his family moved to Stoop. By the 1871 census, John appears to have become well established in the Stoop area as he is described as a landowner, living at Lochmaben Road, Dumfries.
John Smart dies of old age in 1874 at the home of his granddaughter, Elizabeth Tait (nee Smith), on the Clonyard of Southwick farm, Kirkcudbrightshire. His will, proved in 1874, states that his personal estate includes: "Proportion of unpaid rents of property at Stoop of which [he] is Liferenter under the settlement of the late Miss Mary Carson of Stoop, still in the hands of her trustees under deduction of taxes."
I have yet to fathom who Mary Carson is, but she must have had a significant influence on the family as John Smart's eldest daughter (my 2 x great-grandmother), is named Mary Carson Smart. Could this Mary Carson be one of the area's major landowners that you're looking for? According to the 1895 Valuation Roll, John Smart's grandson (and my first cousin, 3 times removed), John Thomas Wingfield Smart (1862-1949), owns and lets out five houses, plus a garden and sundry land, in Victoria Place, Stoop. This is in addition to renting and occupying his family home at 65 English Street, Dumfries, and his joiner's workshop at Catherine Street, Dumfries.
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landj, good morning you have certainly packed your e-mail with detail. The surname Carson rings a bell I will study your post and reply more fully, thanking you stoop.
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Iandj
Not sure whether this will help. There was a Carson who had a small farm/holding , which went from Greenbrae Loaning to Parkhead. I am referring to the 50's/80's.
I lived in Lockerbie Road, not far from the Stoop. His farm ran parallel to our back garden and then there was the Parkhead Fever Hospital. Think the farm is still there.
cupcake
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Hi cupcake, yes you are correct at the bottom of greenbrae there was the farm I used to take tattie peelings for the pigs and get apples in exchange. I had not realised that the fever hospital was named Parkhead, likewise the new park around the bend. It all helps to plot the farm names of the stoop. stoop.
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My mistake, it was just known as the Fever Hospital.
cupcake
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Hi cupcake, I do not want to throw a spanner in the works but I have a recollection of a John Swan related to the farm, can you recall the name Swan?. regards stoop.
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I do recall the name Swan but, Carson is the person I remember having the farm. Perhaps J Swan was there prior to Carson.
Will ask someone who may be able to help.
cupcake
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Thanks cupcake. regards stoop.
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Have done a little research, whether it is helpful, is another story.
Regarding J Swan :
1,3,5,7 Greenbrae Loaning I believe was known as Lindsay Place. There is "Bethel Cottage" where I wonder if someone called Lindsay lived there at one time and where the name came from.
J Swan lived at "Bethel Cottage" and had a small holding and was alive in the 60's. John Carson lived with him, probably related to John Swan.
When John Swan died, John Carson took over the small holding. At present. a K. Scaife has it.
Regarding farms at the Stoop :
All I have found for around 1927 Liam Douglas - (Parkhead Farm)
I also have lists of names for, Stoop - Gasstown and Gateside of Trench for 1927.
cupcake
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Hi cupcake, thanks for your researching. Incidentally I lived at number three Lindsay Place and my grandmother next door at number four. stoop/
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That is spooky as I visited a friend at No 3 the other week :)
cupcake
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If anyone wishes to P M me, I may be able to assist.
Bob.
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Stoop/Cupcake:
I also have a friend at No.3 and I hale from the Stoop, i.e. Stoop Loaning, off Lockerbie Road. I suggested you Private Message me but if you would rather not, we can have a limited discussion here.
I was born at Parkhead Farm, Stoop Loaning, owned by the old Town Council, then bought by my family.
From what I recall many years ago, the field being referred to was always known as 'Wullie Swan's Field' and later 'Jock Carson's Field'. I never recall Greenbrae Loaning or the smallholding of Messrs Swan/Carson being referred to as the Stoop, which I think is confusing the discussions. It seems to me we may all know each other, or at least know OF each other, hence the PM suggestion.
Intriguing.
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I have to agree with Solway, I too don't recall Greenbrae Loaning or the smallholding of Messrs Swan/Carson being referred to as the Stoop.
cupcake
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Going back to original question:
Mr. Johnstone (probably of Lockerbie) held the lands associated with:
Poundland of Craig, Inifield, Outfield, Kelton, Conheath Riggs, Spittalfield, Netherwood, Nunholm, Dalscone, Auchencrieff, Burn, Searth, Dargavels, Wolfgills, Gladstonefield, Corsanfield and Cunninghams.
Every thing else was held by the Duke of Queensbury and the Marquis of Annadale with John Carruthers having Catherinefield (which may not have included the quarry and Tinwood Downs).
Dumfriesshire Valuation Roll of 1771/Directory of Land Ownership c 1770
Don
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stoop: I have personal information which will interest you if you wish to PM me per my posting of 4 December, '14.
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I wonder does anyone recognise this address from 1885
Greenbrae Loaning. Greenbrae. this address was given on John Sewell birth cert. 24 12 1885 but I cant find much about it was it a farm I am trying to trace our great Grandmothers family she was Mary Douglas b 1834 no marriage cert to john Sewell approx. 1852 pos.carlisle Cumberland ever found 5 generations of Johns does not help
thank you
audrey
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Hi Audrey,
In 1885, houses in Greenbrae Loaning would probably have comprised a row of small cottages with a small farm half way along, known as a smallholding and which seems to have been attached to Bethal Cottage. As far as I know, the name Greenbrae probably arose from the fact that the area was surrounded by green fields on sloping ground (brae).
If you Google DG1 3DG, this will locate the Loaning which links the Lockerbie Road with the Annan Road, in Dumfries.
Hope this helps.