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General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: karrienz on Saturday 15 June 13 05:24 BST (UK)
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Hi All
I was wondering after reading a lot of different posts on these boards, and other sites, how other people mayfeel when looking up the records online; especially the UK census, and like me in a few short hours, a whole lifetime of one person or a family can be viewed and sometimes if I've had a really 'good' day; in say 4 hours, have gone from birth to census' then to burial etc . Sometimes I feel a bit like I've desecrated their memory - my ancestors' lifetime coping with poverty/politics/religion/employment/child bearing/child birth etc of the times all condensed, abridged, indexed.
I started my research 20 years ago and it was quite a slog then with writing letters; visiting archives; librarys; peering at microfilm etc., screeds of notes, joining the history societies to get the magazine to get the 'surname interests etc. It also took time to 'digest' the info gathered - some of it vague and some of it irrelevant and sometime a success. Nowadays I can download/upload/copy/paste and wham - done and dusted!
Anybody have similiar thoughts?
Karrienz
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You may have done the genealogy of the person in a few short hours but have hardly touched on the family history.
You mention " poverty/politics/religion/employment/child bearing/child birth etc of the times" have you researched the specifics of your ancestors' experiences of those?
As an example have you researched where each ancestor lived, i.e. their house, how many rooms it had how it was heated, if it had running water etc.
There are thousands of details that put the bones on families that are not contained in online records and it is doubtful if they will be digitised in our lifetimes.
I also doubt if family reconstruction pre 1837 can be undertaken in a few short hours. In many cases it means reverting to written registers as they have not been digitised and where one register has been digitised it may not be the original register for that parish. Some parishes have three evolutions of a register plus a Bishop's Transcript. To research comprehensively each copy should be viewed and compared.
When searching registers pre 1751 are you sure you have the correct year for the events of January, February and March do these months come at the beginning of the year or the end? ;)
Cheers
Guy
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Hi Guy
I appreciate your comments; I was only suggesting that because of technology today it can be quite an... let's say... 'emotional experience' to be privy to basically someone's whole life from birth to death in a few hours - that's really what I was meaning.
I've been researching quite a long time now as I mentioned and was just trying to see how other folks felt about the way family history research is able to be carried out today and how it makes them feel.
I have so much in the way of notes; books; files; photographs; diaries; correspondence and other reference material garnered over 20 years and transported back to NZ from the UK and it's all precious and I continue to research using the NZ archives and also because I'm in New Zealand of course I can't visit the PRO in Kew anymore (used to live down the road) or GRO but have to rely on google and the Archives online and sometimes the websites like this one online and FHS memberships overseas etc.
I've enjoy using the internet for the British History websites (all the archaeology websites etc too) learning about all sorts of 'social history' specifics (as you mention) of my ancestors and their families' lives - it's a great tool. I lived in London for 15 years - I do miss it. Anyway thank you for reading and commenting.
ps: I only meant 'done and dusted' as a reference to what appears to be what many folk are doing these days - as I described in that sentence...upload/download/copy/paste ....it's not for me.
regards
Karrienz
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Yes I thought that was the way you felt, I was really using your posting to show others that the internet still only scrapes the surface of family history research.
Unfortunately many new researchers think that if it is not on the net it does not exist.
Cheers
Guy
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I agree, it is much 'easier' to access lots of records, but I don't get the same sort of satisfaction as when I used to trawl through the microfiche indexes at our library for a whole morning or afternoon. But then I don't have the opportunity to do that really. I know that my research is something that grows at different rates at different times in my life. I look forward to putting more flesh on the bones as time goes by. :)
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I started off going to Record Offices and looking at microfilms but became ill a few years ago and have since been very grateful for everything on the internet. But my most special experience was sitting in Lancashire Record Office, reading the life story of my 6xggfather, Abraham Broadley from the Petre accounts (DDPt1). He was born about 1693 and died in 1760 and became the carter to the Dunkenhalgh estate, so there are hundreds of references to him. claytonbradley
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[quote author=clayton bradley link=topic=650508.msg4969990#msg4969990
my 6xggfather, Abraham Broadley from the Petre accounts (DDPt1). He was born about 1693 and died in 1760 and became the carter to the Dunkenhalgh estate, so there are hundreds of references to him. claytonbradley
[/quote
Oops, quote didn't work!!
Ooh, Clayton, I have Abraham Broadley in Lancashire too! Not got back thst far though, the Abraham I have was baptised Oct 1811, son of John and Ellen, living in Clayton. My direct ancestor is this Abraham's brother, Hargreaves. Any link?
Toffee
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I do know what you mean Karrienz and have felt very similar emotions. So much so, that in the binder where I keep all my BMD certificates I have posted a poem in the front sheet which says this beautifully, and gives me a little lump in the throat whenever I read it. I don't know whether or not you know it, but it's by a late Victorian poet called Ernest Dowson. It reads:
They are not long, The weeping and the laughter, Love and desire and hate. I think they have no portion in us after We pass the gate.
They are not long, The days of wine and roses, Out of a misty dream Our path emerges for a while, Then closes.....
As you can see, it's the source of a well known saying. But it really does give pause to think about how short and, if we're lucky, sweet it all is.
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Dear Toffee, Guy and Winterbloom
Thank you very much for your posts; I'm glad I'm not alone in feeling the way I do sometimes.
Guy - I had a friend who had 100's and 100's of 'names' in their 'tree' - I couldn't understand why it mattered so much to collect so many and they just used the internet more and more as their primary resource without even thinking about how anyone lived their lives or what the occupations for some of them really meant. I do have 100's of names in a database for one family so that I can disseminate the info I find and use it to help other people researching that family; but that's a one off - and it's turned out to be an interesting exercise in how family names and locations and dialects etc can influence things. Imagine a Danish person and a Prussian person marrying in New Zealand in the 1800's and the Irish registrar (with a scrawl) having no idea how to spell a birthplace - took me 3 years to eventually find it! ;D
Toffee - I'm overwhelmed - that poem is beautiful and 'so right' - I would love to do what you have done if that's ok with you (copy your post and put it in my folders) - something to add to the meaning of what my research is about. And I'm glad my post here meant you and Clayton were able to 'connect' too. A real bonus.
Clayton - how special to be able to read about your ancestor's life and so long ago; I've come across a few references here to some of my NZ family in our newspapers from the late 1800's and early 1900's - my own wee grandfather (aged 5) and his brothers singing at the Temperance meetings in the local hall and even his mother getting a wee prize for her spelling at school aged 6 - not so long ago as yours but never the less precious forever.
regards
Karrienz
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Hargreaves and Abraham's parents are John Broadley and Ellen Hargreaves. John died of consumption 3 nov 1826. He was born 23 jun 1791, bap 17 jul at Altham, son of Abraham Broadley and Mary Pilkington. The key to this branch of the family is a will by John Broadley, bap 24 nov 1728 Church Kirk, possibly murdered his first wife, (look for Ellen Strange) died 27 jun 1813 Bell Lane, buried Altham 30 jun 1813 age 86. There are 2 Abrahams at Altham, one with a shorter run of children. Abraham 8 may 1737-4 dec 1826 (age given at death is wrong because his second wife was younger) is the brother of John, 1728-1813 and the other Abraham, with the longer run of children, is son of the first Abraham. The will makes it all clear.
So John 1791 is son of Abraham c 1761 son of Abraham 1737 son of John 1700-68 (and Marjery Briggs), son of John Broadley 1760-1733 (and Alice Grimshaw) son of Abraham and Ellen Broadley who turned up in Over Darwen near Blackburn by 1654 from where?
Your ancestor,John 1700-1768 was the youngest son, and after his father's death, he seems to have become a Presbyterian. He went to live with his oldest brother Abraham, who was a Catholic and lived at Black Lane Head. Abraham and John appear in the Dunkenhalgh accounts working together, cb
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Can't take credit for the lovely poem - that was Winterbloom!
Clayton - have pm'ed you. Thanks! ;D
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Karrienz - You're more than welcome to use the poem - I'm very glad to hear that you appreciate it as much as I do. One of the things I love about genealogy is doing all the back reading and following all the paths and tangents it takes you to. Reading all about the poet Dowson, I found out that he had had a very sad life. He died relatively young, with depression and alcohol taking its toll. A really odd thing that I discovered was that he was buried in a graveyard that was literally next door to a flat that my son and his wife were living in a couple of years ago, right on the other side of London from me.
That was lucky about Clayton and Toffee making a connection through you, too. I love it when these things happen. Recently, I had a contact from a man in Canada who had seen a posting I had made over two years ago. He was putting together a printed version of his grandfather's war diary and wanted me to know that it contained both a reference to and two photographs of my own great uncle who was killed in 1918.
My own researches tended to come to a grinding halt somewhere in the latter end of the 1700s, when I realised that it was very difficult to be sure whether you were looking at the right people or not, and there was very little to see other than a name. Since then, I have paid far more attention to filling out the lives of the people that I have found out about, and visiting the places that they lived to walk a little in their footsteps. Luckily for me, none of them ventured too far away, so it has been mainly a case of roaming around the British Isles!
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Thank you for that Winterbloom (apologies for posting the wrong name earlier) - I agree that when you get back to the late 18th century things get a bit hazy - however as you say it is more interesting to concentrate on what you have and go with that. I'm currently researching another family where the father was a miller all his life and found it is so interesting learning about mills and milling etc and also finding snippets of info on how the family lived and where they moved to. And that is so amazing that the young Poet Dowson is buried near where your own family lived. My miller baptised 5 of his 7 children at a wee church in Brentford, Mddx - only 2 were born there in Brentford - I couldn't understand why only 2 were bp in Bucks - when 5 were born there - and do you know I lived in Brentford for 12 years and walked past that church practically everyday and it was only after I got back to NZ 16 years ago and started looking at this family's history that I discovered about the Brentford connection - I tell you it felt a bit uncanny! ;D
Cheers
Karrienz
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Oh, absolutely. These coincidences go on and on. I worked for years in an area of East London, in a job that involved my calling to various addresses within a very small area for a time. It was only when I started doing the tree in earnest a couple of years ago that I learnt that my maternal grandmother's family and ancestors had lived in these few streets for a couple of generations. None of us, including my grandmother, had any idea about this connection. I sometimes wonder how I would have felt if I'd known then.
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Strange that you posted what you have, I don't mean that in an offensive manner. You have, just by doing your research put a name from your past into some sort of context. Yes you may only have several dates for them but it is the timeline that is important. Without those people from your past you wouldn't exist today, by completing the link you have given substance to their lives. They would be happy indeed to have someone write them up as being of significance. Bit like giving your mother a card or sending one to Granny, it is linking the generations. If you just want a tree, plant one. that's what a lot do in writing and they get as many on it as they can to make them more significant. Big branches of people who had no bearing on your life, stick with your direct lines they played a part in getting you here today. So we don't know all about them, they knew nothing of us. Study the history of the areas they lived and you get some insight into their hardships and daily existence, were they happy, probably sometimes, sometimes sad, but aren't we all.
All the way from -13th century England to Australia + today
Neil ;)
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I couldn't agree with you more, Neil. I have this thing that I want them to 'know' that they are remembered. That might sound a bit daft, but this is the woman who sometimes stands in front of war memorials and reads every name, just so that they can be mentioned again (in case they're up there somewhere, looking!).
On another note, I see from your other posts that you have some interest in the name 'Makin'. Did you ever have any London connections there? My granny's aunt married a man called Richard Makin in around 1890 (don't have the bumf in front of me at the minute, but it was around then). They had a daughter called Ellen Mary, but I don't know what became of her. You never know - it's always worth asking. S