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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Glamorganshire => Topic started by: Murphester on Saturday 01 June 13 11:41 BST (UK)
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Hi all
I am trying to find information on a potential first marriage of my GGGrandfather but I've come to a bit of a standstill regarding his (possible) spouse.
What I know from the marriage certificate:
Edgar James Went (aged 24yrs) m. Mary Ann Jones (aged 22yrs)
27 Apr 1872 in Swansea
Both their fathers were deceased at the time (James Went and James Jones respectively)
Her residence at the time of marriage was 8 Sea Beach Terrace, Swansea. So, I thought I would try and find her on the 1871 census but nothing is coming up with address. I'm with ancestry and not having any joy...unless I'm not searching properly. Her father was deceased so possibly she was living outside the family home - maybe working elsewhere?
Any assistance would be greatly appreciated. I'd like to somehow find out if she passed away while they were married, if they divorced, if they had any children?
If this is the same person, Edgar James Went remarried in 1881 in Newport.
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The 1891 census has:
Class: RG12; Piece: 4374; Folio: 130; Page: 51
41 Upper Jeddo Street, St Woollos, Newport, Monmouthshire
Went, Edgar James Head M 41 Pilot's Man b Brightlesea, Essex
Went, Ellen Wife F 30 b Ilfracombe, Devon
Went, Mabel Daughter F 9 Scholar b Newport
Went, Ellie Daughter F 7 Scholar b Newport
Went, Ethel Daughter F 4 Scholar b Newport
Divorce is highly unlikely - it was very expensive back then.
Can't remember the dates when it changed, but it also might have needed an Act of Parliament?
Marriage, March qtr 1881
Newport (Monmouthshire) district vol 11a, page 239
Went, Edgar James
+ and probably +
Davis, Beatrice Ellen
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Thanks KGarrad. I have this one as Beatrice Ellen DAVIS is my GGGrandmother, and his second wife from a marriage in 1881.
Mary Ann Went (nee JONES) is my person of interest - Edgar James Went's possible first wife.
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Sorry! I like to look from first principles!!
1881 Census: Class: RG11; Piece: 5268; Folio: 53; Page: -8
Aboard the "Admiral", a Pilot Boat, at Newport
Whent, Edgar James Married M 32 Chief Mate b Brightlandsea, Essex
So that seems to confirm that the 2 marriages are the same chap?! ;D
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1871 census for 8 Seabeach Terrace Swansea
Mary J Webber head W. 41 Laundress bn Devon
Agnes " dau 9 scholar " Blackfill Swansea
Ellen " 7 " " " "
Bessie H " " 4 " "
William Smith lodger 23 labourer bn Barnstaple Devon
John " " 26 " " Burrington "
Class RG10 Piece 5451 Folio 35 Page 20.
claire
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Thanks claire - she obviously wasn't at that address for very long before marrying in 1872. Mayeb likely that she was a lodger.
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She only had to be there for 3 weeks!
Same law applies even today. ;D
Maybe Edgar James & Mary Ann just agreed to part ways?
Many couples did that before divorce became affordable!
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What I know from the marriage certificate:
Edgar James Went (aged 24yrs) m. Mary Ann Jones (aged 22yrs)
27 Apr 1872 in Swansea
Both their fathers were deceased at the time (James Went and James Jones respectively)
If this is the same person, Edgar James Went remarried in 1881 in Newport.
Does it give the occupations of both father's?
What occupation was given for Edgar?
Who witnessed the marriage?
1851c HO107; Piece: 1782; Folio: 117; Page: 36
Edgar WENT age 2 (1849) Brightlington Essex
parents James 29 occ Mariner, Catherine 26 & Charles 4mths
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What I know from the marriage certificate:
Edgar James Went (aged 24yrs) m. Mary Ann Jones (aged 22yrs)
27 Apr 1872 in Swansea
Both their fathers were deceased at the time (James Went and James Jones respectively)
If this is the same person, Edgar James Went remarried in 1881 in Newport.
Does it give the occupations of both father's? James Went (Mariner) and James Jones (Farmer)
What occupation was given for Edgar? Mariner
Who witnessed the marriage? John Coslet and Alfred Henry Thorpe
1851c HO107; Piece: 1782; Folio: 117; Page: 36
Edgar West age 2 (1849) Brightlington Essex
parents James 29 occ Mariner, Catherine 26 & Charles 4mths
Yes, this looks like Edgar in 1851
How can I find out if any children came from this marriage between Edgar and Mary Ann?
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How can I find out if any children came from this marriage between Edgar and Mary Ann?
http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
I’ve tried births on FreeBMD district Swansea
Nothing shows up for surname Went between 1872 – 1881 :(
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How can I find out if any children came from this marriage between Edgar and Mary Ann?
I don't know whether Reginald may have been a child of Edgar James Went & Mary Ann Jones
there this birth entry
Neath Sep 1876 vol 11a page 587 Reginald William WENTE
This looks to be his death
Merthyr T Jun 1879 Reginald William WENT age 2
the only way of finding out his parents names would be to order the b/c,may just be a coincidence but Edgar & Ellen named a son Reginald :-\
just for info. - you probably have these entries for their children
WENT Births Registration district Newport Mon
Dec 1881 Mabel Caroline E
Dec 1883 Gertrude Lilian M
Mar 1886 Edgar James died age 0 Sep 1886
Mar 1887 Ethel Alice E
Dec 1891 Frederick Robert
Jun 1896 Violet May
Dec 1898 Gladys Irene R
Sep 1901 Elsie Victoria
Jun 1904 Ivy Maud
Jun 1907 Reginald George
Haven't had much luck finding a death for Mary Ann Went nee Jones born c 1850 or finding her with her father James - Farmer ???
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Thanks Ladyhawk, that's interesting and worth looking in to. However, my gut tells me that they would have lived very near to a port as being in/on water is the type of work Edgar always did (dredger, mariner etc). Nevertheless, I will see how much more I can find out about Reginald.
Oh, how I wish the census was taken more than every 10 years!
And, yes, I have that list of the children. Gertrude is my GGrandmother. :)
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Thanks Ladyhawk, that's interesting and worth looking in to. However, my gut tells me that they would have lived very near to a port as being in/on water is the type of work Edgar always did (dredger, mariner etc). Nevertheless, I will see how much more I can find out about Reginald.
Again you may already have this info. confirms Swansea till 1880
Unfortunately Edgar James Went’s home address or marital status not given see link for full details http://www.swanseamariners.org.uk/swanseamariners.php
Edgar James Went b1849 Brightlingsea Essex A B
Ship Velindra http://www.swanseamariners.org.uk/shipsregister.php
Sign on date 25 04 1878 sign off date 20 7 1878
“ “ 25 07 1878 “ “ 26 10 1878
“ “ 08 04 1879 “ “ 28 7 1879
29 08 1879 21 1 1880
20 01 1880 24 07 1880 port of discharge Swansea
nothing after this date
1871 RG10; Piece: 1093; Folio: 124 - Sussex England
Ship Purveyor
Edgar James Went unmarried c1849 Brightlingsea Essex AB Seaman
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Thank you! I didn't know that information existed!
On his marriage certificate (to Beatrice Ellen) he listed his status as Bachelor. I guess if he and Mary Ann just parted ways, and no official divorce took place, then he would feel that was the right term to use.
Easy to see how things may not have worked out ... he was away at sea a lot!
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you can rule out the 1876 Reginald, his father was Francis Bernard
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VF8W-FYS
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you can rule out the 1876 Reginald, his father was Francis Bernard
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VF8W-FYS
:(
Oh well at least you didn’t have to buy the certificate to find out it was wrong
back to the drawing board finding a Mary Ann JONES with father James occ Farmer on the 1851/61 census – difficult with the name Mary & Jones in Wales
I wonder if we can assume that she was born somewhere around the Swansea area,
her age 22 on 1872 marriage cert. so born c 1850
Did Edgar & Mary marry in a Church - if so what was the name?
There are three birth entries on FreeBMD for 1850 Reg. district Swansea
Mary Ann Jones Mar 1850, Jun 1850 & Sep 1850
also MAJ 1851 (x 2) & 1852 (x 1)
I wonder if either of the witnesses to their marriage may give us a clue
John Coslet & Alfred Henry Thorpe
Interesting that the 1872 marriage FreeBMD also has a Mary COSLET on the same page
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Edgar appears in the British Newspaper archive a few times - some are related to absconding from is master's service in 1870, when an apprentice. There's also something from the Belfast News-Letter of Monday 23 April 1877 but the free search result doesn't give enough clues