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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cornwall => Topic started by: Hemmum on Friday 22 March 13 08:14 GMT (UK)
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Hi Rootschatter
Can anyone help me find two burials? (Or any other clues I know how clever you are!)
have found a removal for a Mary Jago a widow in 1817 and am trying to understand her situation.
I believe Mary herself was born 1750 buried in 1822 at Maker of Millbrook.
She worked for a Mr. Joseph Kerley at Lower Anderton in the Parish of Maker. To understand the chronological order I would love his year of burial etc.
Mary was the widow of Robert Jago who she married in 1776 at Maker and their children were baptised in Maker 1778-1792.
Therefore I assume Robert died after 1792 but before 1817 but I cannot find a burial.
One thought is that there were mariners in the Jago family and I wonder if he died at sea.
Mary Jago's last job was working at The Kings Brewery at Southdown, Millbrook which also has obvious Naval links.
Any help would be greatly appreciated?
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Cornwall OPC Database is showing this death:
28th March 1814
St Martin by Looe
Robert Jago, age 69
Resident of Holland in the parish of Morval
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Hi KGarrad
I had seen that burial but Morval seems a tad out of the area.
Depending on the burial of Joseph Kerley (so I can get the years sorted) I think Mary (and therefore Robert Jago) were living Stephen by Saltash Mary was a servant to Mr. Antony Brooking at Pill for 2 years (?1813-1815). Mary then was removed to Maker as servant to Mr. Joseph Kerley at Lower Anderton for 11 mths. Therefore I assume Roberts burial to be in the Saltash or Maker area.
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St Stephens by Saltash parish records are problematic - I know because I requested them for transcribing. ;)
To clarify that -- there are big gaps, e.g. my StSbyS surname doesn't return any baptisms at the OPC site between 1770 and 1905, which is of course the period I want. My grx2 grmother's baptism c1820 is at FindMyPast but not at the OPC site. The OPC coverage page says:
burialsBT 1679-1773 2,480
burials 1894-1937 3,186
So the gap covers the period when Robert would have died. You'd have to check FindMyPast to see what their coverage is.
Apparently the films aren't available to the OPC people. There is a very helpful OPC who may be able to help you, but essentially the only source appears to be FindMyPast.
I don't have a sub at FindMyPast but basic search results aren't showing any Robert Jago in StSbyS, but there is a Robert H burial in Callington, for instance, no dates shown.
The name Joseph Kerley doesn't appear anywhere at the OPC site, and the surname Kerley (even as Kearley) is pretty scarce on the ground itself.
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Hi Janey
Thank you for your advice. I do have a sub to FindMyPast and have been unable to find Robert Jago's or Joseph Kerley's burial in Saltash, Maker or Cornwall.
As Roberts sons were Mariners I wonder if he also was a Mariner and died at sea.
Mary Jago (I think) was buried aged 72 born 1740 on 22 Mar 1822 of Millbrook at Maker Cornwall.
This ties in perfectly with Mary Henders baptism in Lanteglos.
Joseph Kerley was of Lower Anderton but I could not find anything there except that it is near Millbrook on the Maker Road.
Searching for a Joseph who buried within the time frame, strangely there ia a Joseph Hender born 1740 of Millbrook buried at Maker in 1815 but I cannot see a relationship to Mary although she 'went to J.K's house for six week after J.K's death to see to domestic services' so perhaps was a trusted family member but it seems a stretch to see 'Kerley' as 'Hender'!
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The to-ing and fro-ing across the river from the StSbyS area to Devon and back -- my people from that area did it at least twice a generation between c1815 and c1865, for instance. FindMyPast shows quite a few Kerley events in Devon in the 1800s-1900s. Possibly he was from Devon and buried there ...
(And the to-ing and fro-ing of bits of Cornwall itself: in 1841, one of my StSbyS ancestors was living in Maker, which was called Devon in that census.)
"Mary Jago (I think) was buried aged 72 born 1740 1750? on 22 Mar 1822 of Millbrook at Maker Cornwall."
"This ties in perfectly with Mary Henders baptism in Lanteglos." i.e. 1750, parents John and Eliz:
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms&id=1493310
John and Eliz (misspelled Elizebath for Mary's baptism) also seem to have had in Lanteglos
John 1742
John 1744
Margaret 1748
Do you think that Joseph Hender burial might be him and there was an error made in the parish records resulting from a mixup with Mary's family name, if they were related? Perhaps he was a nephew, son of an unmarried sibling of Mary ...
But ... FindMyPast shows two Joseph Hender marriages in Maker,
1765 to Elizabeth Cowling
1797 to Philadelphia Lander (son of first - baptised 1773 maker, parents Joseph and Elizabeth)
the first of which is most likely to account for the 1815 death.
(It looks like the younger couple moved away -- Philidelphia Hender died 1817 in St Endellion and Joseph Hender cordwainer of Indellion was in Bodmin jail in 1823 for a month for being idle and disorderly -- results of person search at OPC site.)
Something that might be worth looking into:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J733-38K
baptism Joseph Kerly, 1707 Maker, father John. A previous generation? There are other births in that batch C05287-1 to parents John and Hannah.
A John Charles Kerley was baptised 1865 Lanteglos by Fowey, parents John and Lavinia, residence Polruan. Don't see that birth or a marriage for the parents in the GRO index. Father was a railway clerk, maybe from away, but there's still no registration. In 1871 that child (John Kerly) shows as born in Plymouth, living in Polruan with Stephens grandparents. I suspect the parents weren't married - a spinster Lavinia Stephens married a widowed Thomas Bunt in 1881 in Lanteglos by Fowey. Lavinia was born 1841 Falmouth and is with her sister in Polruan in 1871. No clue as to who John Kerley the father was.
Just looking for any Kerley connection with Lanteglos or Maker or StSbyS and that is all I am finding!
Burials for StSbyS at FindMyPast seem to be only 1813-1837.
So Robert Jago could have been a mariner -- or if buried at StSbyS, the record just isn't accessible.
Thank you for your PM and offer, I will definitely keep it in mind!
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Once again Jamey, thank you for your time and interest and I agree the to-in and fro-in does complicate matters and your correction regarding Mary's birth year is 1750 from her burial. It was Joseph Hender that was born in 1740 according to burial record, so if he was related to Mary he was more likely to be an uncle or cousin.
Robert and Mary Jago’s last child was bap 1792 Maker, Mary’s settlement from Maker to Saltash was in 1817 her husband deceased therefore Robert died between 1792 (no children bapt S.St.S -1817) Burial 1810 +or- 20yrs in Saltash returned 9 results 1813-1829 (no Robert Jago) but a search on William? suggests that burials start 1808.
I probably need to look closer at Hender but Jago (and how they move around) is taking all my concentration at the moment. My tree is complicated as I have two separate Jago lines in another branch of the tree.
Robert and Mary Jago’s eldest child Elizabeth (I believe) married as a sojourner in Kelly Parish Devon (no home Parish given). She bapt her last son Robert in 1815 (after her father as this was not a given name in her husband’s family). Robert married an Eliza Jago (baptised Kinsman in Tavistock) although they married in Plymouth St Andrew probably as Eliza was fiercely NC.
Robert and Eliza lived at Tavistock, Morwellham then Okel Tor and their daughter married a LANG and moved to Millbrook where he managed the brickworks. Currently I cannot see how the two branches link but then I did not think I would find out where or when Mary Hender was born until I found the removal order!!
(calculations additions in brackets)
(Sessions at Lostwithiel) . 21st February 1817
Mary Jagoe, residing Millbrook, p. Maker, widow.
Born Lanteglos (1750) by ?(1772); at aged 22 yrs. moved to Rame, servant to Daniel Tom of Trehill, 2 yrs, 3gns p.a (1774).; married late husband Robert Jagoe (1776 in Maker, last child 1792 Maker), servant to Mr. Spry Roberts, Parish of Landrake, for 3 yrs (?). then removed to St. Stephen by Saltash as servant to Mr. Antony Brooking at Pill for 2 yrs (?); then to p. Maker as servant to Mr. Joseph Kerley at Lower Anderton, p. Maker, 11 mths. when J. K. died (?); then labourer at H.M. Brewery at Southdown and went to J.K's house for six week after J.K's death to see to domestic services; seven children now living all married and provided for.
Mary Jagoe, widow, from Maker 5th September, 1817
These documents are held at Cornwall Record Office St Stephens Parish
Although Mary was removed from Maker to Saltash but as she was buried in Maker I assume that one of her surviving children (probably a son after returning from sea) later supported her. I am not sure if you can see anything else from the order?
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I'm seeing the question but nothing else myself, I fear.
1792 last child born in Maker
6 years (3 yrs + 2 yrs + 11 mo) accounted for between 1792 and 1817
1817 she is a widow and was settled to Saltash from Maker
Where the 6 years fit into the 15-year period is the question, Robert having presumably died before those six years, so likely no later than 1811.
All I can say is that I'd kill to have even that much info about my Cornwall people during that period! ;)
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I agree, but remember what I said about knowing nothing about Robert and Mary until the removal order surfaced. I am sure it was not available when I searched 4 years ago, or did I not notice?
I have listened to researchers that say 'I just follow the male line' believing that it gives a true picture but 'I believe' - follow the girls! Mary definitely 'showed me the way to develop the Jago line.
I have a true fondness for her d-in-law Eliza who as, only an Agr Labs wife, but according to newspaper reports was called on by the other ladies in her parish for emotionally, medical and religious support.
I still have no idea of where or when Robert Jago was born - perhaps 1757 in Roseland? Looking at the 'names' they 'fit' but obviously 'we need more' which is why I was desperate for Roberts age at burial.
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The following might be of some help. there's various bits of info on it - http://www.ramehistorygroup.org.uk/
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Hi Norma
Thank you for the link. I had visited it before but it is always worth revisiting as they so add bits.
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The parish records for St Stephens in Saltash haven't been digitised but the microfiche are at Saltash Heritage. Their email is
archivist@saltash-heritage.org.uk
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just in case you still get reminders of postings - even this late, here's an image I picked up on ebay and grabbed a copy. No date but late 19thC?
Roger Collins
Rame Peninsula History Group
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Funny this should pop up. ;)
A few days before the last activity in this thread, October 2013, I closed the deal on a new house in a new city, and we moved here in early 2014.
The house isn't actually new -- circa 1880 to be exact -- and an elderly neighbour told me it was known as "the old Jagoe house". Mrs. Jagoe died here about 25 years ago, after living here from childhood (around 1905) with her mother and stepfather. Mr. Jagoe is the man she married and then stayed on in the house with to raise their family, nearly 80 years in the house altogether.
I've been trying to figure out where the family of Mr. Jagoe (birth reg as Jago in the mid-1890s in Canada) originated. His father (and his father's mother) show in censuses as born in Canada, but since I can't find his father's father's birth or marriage, or find him in a census, I'm stymied for the moment. I wonder how many John Jago(e)s were born in how many places 1830-1850ish. ;)
Anyway just amusing, who knows, maybe the Jago family who ended up in my house two or three generations later were neighbours of my StSbyS/Maker people and related to Hemmum's. :)
I hate Pinterest, but there is a photo there that was taken at the same place as the one of Capt Bob Jago:
"1900s Old CDV Real Photo Beautiful Victorian Girl Photographer Jno Hawke Devon | ebay"
https://www.pinterest.ca/pin/261842165808105741/
I don't know whether that might help to date Capt Bob. Not a lot, I think.
(https://i.pinimg.com/474x/56/c1/e7/56c1e7ff93b8619ca425788786bfdbe3--old-photos-devon.jpg)
However, I do think, from the mutton chops, that the date of the photo is more likely to be earlier in the 1800s, like the 1860s. And I would guess that Jonathan is an overreading of "Jno" and he was more likely just John.
And another photo at ebay dated as 1875.
https://tinyurl.com/ya5rzugd
Here is something about the photographer and dates:
http://www.thewardrobe.org.uk/research/the-collection/detail/9267
A sepia portrait photo of Ensign E S Garratt in civilian clothes in 1867; ... Photographer; J N O Hawke, 53 Union Street, Stonehouse, Devon
(I distrust sellers' date estimates. I found a photo of my gr-grfather's sister on line showing her in costume as an actress, dated 15 years after the year she was actually on stage at the Adelphi in London.)
Edit - in the 1878 White's History, Gazetteer and Directory (and up to 1893 that I can see), John Hawke, photographer, is at 8 George St, Plymouth. I ran across a photo of those premises on line earlier but undated:
http://www.daveuptonphotography.co.uk/plymouth-hawkes-photographer-151#photo
"Hawke photographer's Old Studio.
8 George St."
Of course I have to say also: Absolutely follow the girls!
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Parish records for St Stephens, Saltash have been transcribed by Saltash Heritage but they are not on the internet because we would lose donations which we rely on to keep the centre open. However. I am more than happy to do any look ups and the index is searchable by name. Please email me at
archivist@saltash-heritage.org.uk and I will see what we have.
Mo
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Terrymo, thank you for that offer and I think I will take you up on it when I figure out just which of mine were in St Stephens by Saltash when!
Meanwhile, this thread spurred me on to delve a little more into "my" Jago(e)s in Ontario, more stuff being available on line all the time, and I discovered that one of mine was once a local mayor. :)
Still haven't figured out where they came from ... but it's interesting that he was married to someone with a fairly unusual surname that was the name of my ancestors from St Cleer.
... But rats, now I see that I did track him down last year, and his father was born in Ireland. (Hard enough to keep track of one's own family tree, let alone strangers'!)
And turns out it was a different Jago married to the woman with what I'd thought was my St Cleer ancestors' surname, but no, duh, it was my Kent ancestors' surname (they're similar ...), but she was from the unrelated Lancashire branch. I think I'll stick to my own tree for a while!
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Might "Capt. Bob" have been an informal honorific?
1891, Robert Jago, born in Plymouth c1866, is a member of crew (stoker) on HMS Black Prince stationed in Devonport. He is also enumerated in Plymouth with his wife and parents-in-law, as a naval stoker.
In 1901, his wife Elizabeth and children are in Plymouth.
In 1911, he is Chief Stoker Pensioner, a caretaker, in Bath.
If so, my guess as to the date is the one that was way off. ;)
Probably son of Samuel Jago and Agnes Braginton, born 1865 East Stonehouse.