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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: REIVER CLAN on Sunday 17 March 13 21:31 GMT (UK)

Title: Regiment identification
Post by: REIVER CLAN on Sunday 17 March 13 21:31 GMT (UK)
Hi all. i recently aquired this photo of my great grandfather and brother in law. my great grand father is standing at the back , he was in the Northumberland fusiliers and was called John Johnston and lived at the time in Blyth Northumberland. I was wondering if anybody could tell me what the star means on his sleeve. He died of the spanish flu in 1919  and is buried at cowpen in Blyth in the same grave as his mother in law.

I would be interested if anyone could id the regiment of the soldier sitting down.

We believe his name was Tom Symmington but  changed his sir name to his partners name when he ran away with her.

thank you in anticipation

steve
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: mmm45 on Sunday 17 March 13 21:56 GMT (UK)
He's machine gun corps
There are two possible medal index cards.....did he have middle name?

Ady
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: joboy on Sunday 17 March 13 22:05 GMT (UK)
Would it not have been the Machine Gun Cavalry? ... I have a similar photo of my father complete with spurs which the seated chap seems to have.
Joe
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: REIVER CLAN on Sunday 17 March 13 22:31 GMT (UK)
Thanks Ady and joboy.  As to the question about middle names he doesnt seem to have one on my records.

thanks
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: mmm45 on Sunday 17 March 13 23:36 GMT (UK)
Yes joboy that's why I was enquiring about a middle name the Thomas H Symmington served in 10th hussars initially then became a Machine Gunner probably with the Cavalry Squadron Machine Gun Corps ....man in pic has 3 yrs overseas service and is definitely mounted.
The other Thomas Symmington was discharged to pension

Ady
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: mmm45 on Sunday 17 March 13 23:40 GMT (UK)
Stars look like Efficiency Stars from Volunteer/territorial uniforms.

Ady
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: alan o on Monday 18 March 13 03:15 GMT (UK)
That is a unique photo.  The 2 uniforms should not be in the same photo.  The standiung man is a member of the Territorial Force and is a Northumberland Fusilier.  However the uniform was not worn after 1914 but replaced by khaki. 

Your machine gunner is a member of the Machine Gun Corps but as has been said a mounted soldier.  The wearing of collar badges is a rarity as well and was not the norm.  The MGC was a wartime creation and the fact that he has overseas service chevrons means that he had served in France or the Middle East for 3 years whent he photo was taken.  So it must be post 1917.  In which case the Fusilier should not be in an obselete pre-war uniform.

That is clealry a family photo and irreplacable but the photo would be worth a lot of money for those reasons.  Have you looked up their medal cards?
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: joboy on Monday 18 March 13 03:52 GMT (UK)
The MGC (Cavalry) chap looks as though he has a soft cap cover or are my old eyes deceiving me?
Joe
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: mmm45 on Monday 18 March 13 07:56 GMT (UK)
I initially thought that some kind of 1919 photoshopping had occurred and brought two pics together?

Ady
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: PrueM on Monday 18 March 13 09:17 GMT (UK)
I initially thought that some kind of 1919 photoshopping had occurred and brought two pics together?

Ady

I don't think so - not unsophisticated enough for that ;)  You would easily see the "joins" if this was a composite photo.  This is definitely a picture of two men in the same room at the same time.
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: jess5athome on Monday 18 March 13 09:34 GMT (UK)
Good morning, could I please ask a question regarding the gentleman in the MGC, would the style of spurs he is wearing be the same for all mounted units? ie MGC, Royal Artillary etc.
Frank.
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: REIVER CLAN on Monday 18 March 13 21:15 GMT (UK)
Thank you for all this info, the soldier standing was in the territorials for 8 years, before he was discharged .  i was wondering if there is any next of kin on the sitting soldiers info,

steve
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: alan o on Wednesday 20 March 13 07:33 GMT (UK)
I ahve been told that the service stripes were authorised Jan 18 not late 17 as I thought so that would date the photo to 1918 or 19.  As there are no medal ribbons it is likely to be no later than that.  If your man had served 3 years then he probably serving oversseas in 1916/17/18.  If he had been overseas before 31 Dec 15 he would have been entitled to a 1914/15 Star which would have been worn as a ribbon on his tunic in 1918 even thought he actual medal was not issued until later.
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: John915 on Wednesday 20 March 13 21:51 GMT (UK)
Good evening,

As a rule of thumb Frank, yes the spurs would all be the same. That style is for wear with laced boots hence the pad over the instep which is "supposed" to hide the laces. The only time you would see different would be officers or cavalry wearing riding boots.

John915
Title: Re: Regiment identification
Post by: REIVER CLAN on Wednesday 20 March 13 22:49 GMT (UK)
Thank you all for this info, really interesting i am now passing it around the family.

Thank you