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General => The Common Room => The Lighter Side => Topic started by: Mike in Cumbria on Thursday 07 February 13 09:47 GMT (UK)
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This might seem a strange request.
I grew up in Mirfield, in the West Riding of Yorkshire and at Christmas, the glass balls we hung on the tree were known as Wesley balls or wesselbobs. Naively I assumed the rest of the country used these names too. Now that I live away from there, I have been made forcefully aware of my error and have never met anyone who has heard of this term. I'd be interested to know whether anyone here has heard of Wesley Balls and, if so, when and where they heard it.
Unfortunately, Googling the term didn't find much apart from some very dubious Star Trek related porn writing!
Thanks in advance
Mike
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Hello Mike. I too grew up in Mirfield & lived there for 38 years before migrating to Australia. I knew them as Wesleybobs, balls you hang on the Christmas tree. (James) Rosebud OH
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Brilliant! I have tried some more nuanced searches and found a couple of references to them in Leeds too but it's great to know that you knew the term in Mirfield.
When and where were you in Mirfield, if you don't mind telling me?
Mike
PS, I'm going to show your message to my wife, who thought I had gone completely mad.
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Hello again Mike. I was born in 1944 & my parents moved to Mirfield when I was about 2, I don't remember the move though :) I went to school in Mirfield, but if you want more detail I would be more than happy to provide it through my wife rosebud 2's email address. James.
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If you have access to one of the 19th century newspaper databases, a search for wesley-bob brings up some Christmas references from 1877/8.
One says it is a Yorkshire tradition, a large bunch of evergreens hung with oranges, apples and coloured ribbons, carried by carol-singing children. Another pins it down to Leeds, and says it was a bower of evergreens, inside which were wax dolls representing Persons of the Nativity
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Well Mike, on trips to Cumbria I've heard acorns referred to as "yakbobs".
Skoosh.
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Well Mike, on trips to Cumbria I've heard acorns referred to as "yakbobs".
Skoosh.
Well, they grow on "yaks", so yakbobs makes good sense! Interesting connection with the bobs - that had never struck me before.
Thanks
Mike
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"Wassail Bob " http://www.christmasarchives.com/bronte.html
"Wesley-bob" http://tinyurl.com/al9w3p7
"Wesley-bob" http://www.childrensnursery.org.uk/british-customs/popular-customs%20-%200584.htm
"Wessel-bob" http://www.gutenberg.org/files/19979/19979-h/19979-h.htm#CHAPTER_XV
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"Wassail Bob " http://www.christmasarchives.com/bronte.html
"Wesley-bob" http://tinyurl.com/al9w3p7
"Wesley-bob" http://www.childrensnursery.org.uk/british-customs/popular-customs%20-%200584.htm
"Wessel-bob" http://www.gutenberg.org/files/19979/19979-h/19979-h.htm#CHAPTER_XV
Ahhh - now those are interesting links. I always assumed Wesselbob was derived from Wesley ball, but it seems to be the other way around. Wassail bobs, or Wessell Bobs pre-date Christmas trees, so perhaps the glass balls took on the old name to become Wesley Balls. I always assumed it was something to do with John Wesley, but clearly not.
Many thanks or finding these references. I wonder why it seems to be so restricted to West Yorkshire though.
Mike
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Hi, I'm 50 years old and grew up in a house called Cross Hall where the preacher John Wesley lived.
Our family has always called them wesley balls. When I met my now wife she didn't have a clue what I was talking about.
Always have been and always will be Wesley balls :)
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Hi, I'm 50 years old and grew up in a house called Cross Hall where the preacher John Wesley lived.
Our family has always called them wesley balls. When I met my now wife she didn't have a clue what I was talking about.
Always have been and always will be Wesley balls :)
Nor did mine. I'm not sure she believes me still.
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There is quite a bit about wassail/wessel bobs in the Dialect Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/englishdialectdi06wriguoft/page/394/mode/2up
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There is quite a bit about wassail/wessel bobs in the Dialect Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/englishdialectdi06wriguoft/page/394/mode/2up
Thanks Jen, that's interesting
Funny how some threads get revived after a long absence.
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There is quite a bit about wassail/wessel bobs in the Dialect Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/englishdialectdi06wriguoft/page/394/mode/2up
Thanks Jen, that's interesting
Funny how some threads get revived after a long absence.
Thank goodness they do. :)
I have added that very handy looking Dialect Dictionary to my Favourites. Thanks Jen.
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Wesleybobs must have been a very local name. In the Holme Valley, over to the West of Huddersfield and not that fsr from Mirfield, I never heard the term used.
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Wesleybobs must have been a very local name. In the Holme Valley, over to the West of Huddersfield and not that fsr from Mirfield, I never heard the term used.
It seems so. My Mum's family were from the Dewsbury area (and Leeds), and only ever called them Wesley Balls or Wesselbobs.
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There is quite a bit about wassail/wessel bobs in the Dialect Dictionary
https://archive.org/details/englishdialectdi06wriguoft/page/394/mode/2up
Thanks Jen, that's interesting
Funny how some threads get revived after a long absence.
Fascinating thread...
It is strange how some threads get revived after a long absence.
I am willing to bet someone made a reference to John Wesley, Yorkshire customs, or wessel bobs, and Googling delivered this thread.
Reading through Gutenberg Project link I am interested to note how many age old British customs are still in evidence linked to Morris dancing.
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I have added that very handy looking Dialect Dictionary to my Favourites. Thanks Jen.
The link I gave above was only to Volume 6 of the Dialect Dictionary, words starting T - Z
This should take you to the complete collection. I've found it very useful particularly for words occurring in old farming inventories https://www.rootschat.com/links/01q5n/
You can search within each volume, using the 'search inside' box (NOT the general 'search' box top right)
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I have added that very handy looking Dialect Dictionary to my Favourites. Thanks Jen.
The link I gave above was only to Volume 6 of the Dialect Dictionary, words starting T - Z
This should take you to the complete collection. I've found it very useful particularly for words occurring in old farming inventories https://www.rootschat.com/links/01q5n/
You can search within each volume, using the 'search inside' box (NOT the general 'search' box top right)
Thanks Jen, it wasn’t until I added it to my favourites, then looked more closely that I noticed it didn’t seem to ‘work’ .... I thought I must have been doing something wrong. Thanks again.
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Thank you Jen.
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This afternoon I had an email from a distant cousin who, speaking of her grandparents, said,
" And they never had a Christmas tree, always a wessill-bob (wassail - very primitive. They were Berry Brow poor. Hoops with greenery on.)"
So the term was definitely used in the Holme Valley.
Regards,
Lesley
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Interesting that wessill-bobs were known in Berry Brow - at the Huddersfield end of the Holme Valley.
Any cases of wessil bobs further up the valley eg Holmfirth?
Just in passing and piggybacking on the local vocab West Yorks theme: anyone know what a "spetch" is?
I think I may have floated this before and have only ever met one person outside my dad's Hade Edge family who called an elastoplast a spetch.
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Just in passing and piggybacking on the local vocab West Yorks theme: anyone know what a "spetch" is?
I think I may have floated this before and have only ever met one person outside my dad's Hade Edge family who called an elastoplast a spetch.
You'll find several nice definitions in the Dialect Dictionary I linked to in reply #17 ;) :D
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When I was growing up (in Almondbury/Magdale, but of Berry Brow stock) there would be an offer to put some spetch, not a spetch, on an injured knee , perhaps because elastoplast came in a roll, not as individual plasters?
Lesley
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Good to find another spetch user.
And the stuff from a roll still is better than the individual plasters.
JenB, the ref to dialect dictionary sounds really interesting but I can't seem to use it. Any tips on how to get to the page with 'spetch' on it? Thanks in advance.
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JenB, the ref to dialect dictionary sounds really interesting but I can't seem to use it. Any tips on how to get to the page with 'spetch' on it? Thanks in advance.
It's a 6-volume work, and JenB's link takes you to the page showing all of them - though possibly not in the right order. Click on the one you want, and you can search or browse the contents.
Wessil-bobs also appear in Walter E Haigh's "A New Glossary of the Dialect of the Huddersfield District" (1928):
https://huddersfield.exposed/wiki/A_New_Glossary_of_the_Dialect_of_the_Huddersfield_District_(1928)_by_Walter_E._Haigh#page/n177/mode/2up
(Spetch is also in there, as spech.)
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Arthurk, thanks for guiding me to the Hudds Glossary.
What a treat!
Just checked that it includes some of my favourites:
Spech
Mank
Throng
Lake/lek which as well as referring to playing games, is used to mean laid-off from work, unemployed.
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From the 'Glossary of the dialect of Almondbury and Huddersfield (Rev. Alfred Easther 1883)
Spetch- a patch of any kind, even a plaster on the hand
Spetch- to patch
Wassail bob (pronounced wessel bob) a garland or bouquet carried on New Year's Eve from house to house, and adorned with fruit, evergreens, artificial flowers etc. Formerly a doll gaily dressed, representing the Blessed Virgin, was placed in the midst. On Tuesday, Dec 29, 1874, a wessel bon was brought here for exhibition. It consisted of two hoops covered and ornamented with an apple, an orange, a doll (like a man) and a wax cherry. The bearers sang the song 'Here we coma a wesselling'
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Lake/lek which as well as referring to playing games, is used to mean laid-off from work, unemployed.
Ah, but did you get spice or spogs when you were laking out?
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Spice, definitely. My father at the age of five was suddenly uprooted from Huddersfield as my grandfather had been drafted back into the army in 1915 and was sent to train raw recruits at Hamilton barracks near Glasgow. Little Ronnie went to the corner shop with his Saturday penny, and asked for a pennorth of spice. He was disappointed when he got home to find his paper bag contained picking spice!
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Spice, definitely. My father at the age of five was suddenly uprooted from Huddersfield as my grandfather had been drafted back into the army in 1915 and was sent to train raw recruits at Hamilton barracks near Glasgow. Little Ronnie went to the corner shop with his Saturday penny, and asked for a pennorth of spice. He was disappointed when he got home to find his paper bag contained picking spice!
Um, he would probably get something completely different if he asked for that at certain corner shops today .... don’t think he’d get much for his penny either:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/aug/06/spice-zombie-drug-devastating-communities
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Spice, definitely. My father at the age of five was suddenly uprooted from Huddersfield as my grandfather had been drafted back into the army in 1915 and was sent to train raw recruits at Hamilton barracks near Glasgow. Little Ronnie went to the corner shop with his Saturday penny, and asked for a pennorth of spice. He was disappointed when he got home to find his paper bag contained picking spice!
Um, he would probably get something completely different if he asked for that at certain corner shops today .... don’t think he’d get much for his penny either:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/aug/06/spice-zombie-drug-devastating-communities
True. The only harm that spice did to our community was to our teeth.
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Spice/ "sparse" definitely still used in 1950's Holmfirth for sweets.
"Fair" and "right" meaning very still used today.
"Starved" meaning very cold and a bit miserable as in "tha looks fair starved through, lass"
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"Starved" meaning very cold and a bit miserable as in "tha looks fair starved through, lass"
Starved in Lancashire too.