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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: sezzle on Tuesday 05 February 13 19:35 GMT (UK)
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updated:
i know who the children of Thomas jnr are, but i dont know where he was in 1891 or 1901
i also need to find Thomas Snr who passed before 1921
thats where im at now ::) (before i delve into Bridgets side)
Thomas Buckley (jnr) b1881 married Bridget Wyse (wise) in 1903 in Ireland, moved back to Manchester in 1906ish with Bridget and children. In 1911 he was a foundry labourer.
Later married Elizabeth Ridings/Harding in 1921
His occupation was labourer, age 41
His father, also Thomas Buckley (snr)is listed as dead in 1921, his occupation was lithographic printer.
Im now trying to locate where Thomas Buckley Jnr was pre 1900 and also more info on his dad :)
Thanks for the help so far guys :) its clearing up my confusion so much!
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Hello,
do you not have the marriage details from the Bridget Wyse marriage? That may help with his occupation and perhaps verify his father's name.
regards
heywood
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Hi
John Thomas Buckley married in Oct-nov-dec 1927 Portsmouth spouse called Sturmey
There is a birth record for John Thomas Buckley Ireland Civil registration Births Index.
Was Thomas's second wife called Mary Ann Ridings? If so, they married in 1917 at Ashton under Lyne, Christ Church. www.cheshirebmd.org.uk
Heather
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There is a possibility for Bridget in 1901 - Limerick and a few T B entries for Limerick - born England and within the age range. http://www.nationalarchives.ie/
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Looking on familysearch, there is a Bridget Wise born Jan-mar 1885 Limerick which fits with the census.
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There is a death for
Bridget Buckley aged 36 born about 1884 in 1920 Chorlton, Manchester
Vol 8c page 706
so this might make the 1921 marriage correct
Heather
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Bridget died and he remarried, now going off the bmd the year was 1917 but i went to view the record and it was 1921 :-\ confusing much?
There is a tree - yours I think which has the 2 marriages:
Free BMD shows the 1917 marriage to Mary A
The tree then has the 1921 marriage to Elizabeth Ridings in Miles Platting but I can't see this on Free BMD.
Perhaps both should not have married in 1917 but on the death of one or other spouse they were free to marry and had a church wedding? No- I see they married at Christ Church- sorry.
Have you seen the certificate re 1921 did you say?
Oh dear- just seen the other marriage on Lancashire BMD ::) Elizabeth Harding/ Ridings.
Is this the same person as Mary Ann?
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1881 census:
Reference RG11, Piece 3997, Folio 35, Page 21
52 Richmond Street, Manchester
Buckley, Thomas Head M 32 Tile Cutter
Buckley, Alice Wife F 30
Buckley, Ralph Son M 11 Scholar
Buckley, Elizabeth Daughter F 9 Scholar
Buckley, Mary A Daughter F 6
Buckley, Thomas Son M 4
Buckley, Ellen Daughter F 2 All born Manchester
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There are these possible marriages to look at
In 1871
Thomas M Buckley and Alice Lamb at Manchester Cathedral
Thomas Buckley and Alice Newall at Manchester St John
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Going back to the Ridings/Buckley marriage - if your ancestor was Elizabeth then perhaps there were two marriages with same surnames but yours is the 1921 marriage and not 1917. This would then fit with Bridget's death as Heather points out.
Hopefully that solves one of your problems. :)
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Ireland 1901
Quay Street,Louth,
Margaret Flyn, aged 50 head,co Louth ,dressmaker
Patrick Flyn,son aged 17,Louth,house painter
John Roddy,30 son in law
Mary Roddy aged daughter
Margaret Roddy aged 7 ,granddaughter
Patrick Roddy aged 6,grandson
James Roddy aged 3 grandson
Lizzie Roddy aged 2 granddaughter
all Catholic
James Mullholland aged 25,son in law
Bridget Mullholland aged 23,daughter
Kathleen aged 1
Patrick aged grandson
Thomas Buckley aged 25,born York,soldier,sgt 8th WRI Hussars,church of England(boarder)
Alice Buckley aged 28,born Irladoy,(boarder)
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Hello,
do you not have the marriage details from the Bridget Wyse marriage? That may help with his occupation and perhaps verify his father's name.
regards
heywood
Bear with me, I'm on my mobile,
I haven't seen Bridget's marriage record, they were married in a barracks, I will get the name tomoro as I've forgotten it but I didn't have any luck finding where their records were kept x
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Hi
John Thomas Buckley married in Oct-nov-dec 1927 Portsmouth spouse called Sturmey
There is a birth record for John Thomas Buckley Ireland Civil registration Births Index 1864-1958 but I don't have the right subscription to view it on Ancestry.
Was Thomas's second wife called Mary Ann Ridings? If so, they married in 1917 at Ashton under Lyne, Christ Church. www.cheshirebmd.org.uk
Heather
That's the right birth record, they moved to manchester when my g-gran was 5 (Mary)
Much history is lost as Mary passed away when my gran was very young so details are sketchy
No that's not the right marriage record for Thomas but thanks for the John Thomas one, I think I've forgot how to work ancestry :head slap:
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Looking on familysearch, there is a Bridget Wise born Jan-mar 1885 Limerick which fits with the census.
Yes her surname varies, it changes from wyse to wise, I checked the irish census and found her there :)
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So is it the Bridget daughter of Stephen in Limerick,
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Bridget died and he remarried, now going off the bmd the year was 1917 but i went to view the record and it was 1921 :-\ confusing much?
There is a tree - yours I think which has the 2 marriages:
Free BMD shows the 1917 marriage to Mary A
The tree then has the 1921 marriage to Elizabeth Ridings in Miles Platting but I can't see this on Free BMD.
Perhaps both should not have married in 1917 but on the death of one or other spouse they were free to marry and had a church wedding? No- I see they married at Christ Church- sorry.
Have you seen the certificate re 1921 did you say?
Oh dear- just seen the other marriage on Lancashire BMD ::) Elizabeth Harding/ Ridings.
Is this the same person as Mary Ann?
I think that is where I got confused, I was told her name was Elizabeth ridings, but the only ridings married to Thomas Buckley I found was Mary Ann so I saved it, that clears that one up tho
Yes I saw the second marriage record, his father is listed as Thomas Buckley deceased, I'll dig my sheet out tomoro after work with his occupation on :) but Elizabeth's father was George Harding and she was also a widower so that cleared that one up
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Ireland 1901
Quay Street,Louth,
Margaret Flyn, aged 50 head,co Louth ,dressmaker
Patrick Flyn,son aged 17,Louth,house painter
John Roddy,30 son in law
Mary Roddy aged daughter
Margaret Roddy aged 7 ,granddaughter
Patrick Roddy aged 6,grandson
James Roddy aged 3 grandson
Lizzie Roddy aged 2 granddaughter
all Catholic
James Mullholland aged 25,son in law
Bridget Mullholland aged 23,daughter
Kathleen aged 1
Patrick aged grandson
Thomas Buckley aged 25,born York,soldier,sgt 8th WRI Hussars,church of England(boarder)
Alice Buckley aged 28,born Irladoy,(boarder)
Ill look into that one tomoro.
I've just remembered it was st pats barracks Bridget and Thomas were married at
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So is it the Bridget daughter of Stephen in Limerick,
No, daughter of John and Mary :)
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That doesn't look to be the right Thomas Buckley in 1901 in Louth.
Bridget is with her parents John and Mary in Limerick in 1901.
The T B s in Limerick in 1901 are in different barracks. Occupations vary -Clerk ; Collier; Cutler and a Labourer.
I hope you find the records again. Perhaps it was St Patrick's Church.
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That doesn't look to be the right Thomas Buckley in 1901 in Louth.
Bridget is with her parents John and Mary in Limerick in 1901.
The T B s in Limerick in 1901 are in different barracks. Occupations vary -Clerk ; Collier; Cutler and a Labourer.
I hope you find the records again. Perhaps it was St Patrick's Church.
Hmm not sure now, that was one thing my gran was sure of.... I shall have a nosey about after I finish school later,
As for Thomas bUckley the father, he was listed as a lithographic printer on the 1921 marriage record, the Thomas marrying Elizabeth is listed as a labourer
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The 1921 marriage is to Elizabeth.
I think you need to get the certificate for Bridget's marriage and ensure you have the right second marriage.
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The 1921 marriage is to Elizabeth.
I think you need to get the certificate for Bridget's marriage and ensure you have the right second marriage.
bah being on a phone makes things harder lol
the 1921 marriage is correct (i was told her name was elizabeth harding, but was only able to find the ridings record, then when i went to view it it had elizabeths dad as a harding)
so so far i know that
Thomas Buckley married Bridget in 1903 (been told st pats barracks but need to confirm)
He later married Elizabeth in 1921, His age was 41 and his occupation was a labourer (on the 1911 census he is listed as foundry labourer)
His father (also Thomas) is listed as dead but his occupation is Lithographic Printer.
i know who the children of Thomas jnr are, but i dont know where he was in 1891 or 1901
i also need to find Thomas Snr who passed before 1921
thats where im at now ::) (before i delve into Bridgets side)
going to update orginal post :)
thanks for your help so far :D :-*
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Hello again,
you don't need to update your original post as the developments are usually shown throughout the thread.
It may be that Thomas has invented/enhanced his father and his occupation. It may not be so. That is why it would be good to get the Bridget Wyse marriage certificate to see what information he gives there.
It would also hopefully explain where Thomas is in 1901.
heywood
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Hello again,
you don't need to update your original post as the developments are usually shown throughout the thread.
It may be that Thomas has invented/enhanced his father and his occupation. It may not be so. That is why it would be good to get the Bridget Wyse marriage certificate to see what information he gives there.
It would also hopefully explain where Thomas is in 1901.
heywood
ick id already updated before reading this :-\
i will send for the record to ireland me thinks, i confused myself on the dates when fathers details were added :headslap:
but it should confirm some of bridgets info too :D
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Hi
Could this be the family in 1891 without father Thomas?
At 12 Higginbottom Buildings Ardwick, St Silas parish
Alice Buckley widow 40 Charwoman
elizabethBuckley 18 Waterproof maker
Mary A Buckley 16 Waterproof maker
Thomas Buckley 14 Tile Cutter
Ellen Buckley 11
Jane Buckley 9
3169/71/17
Heather
Jane
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1881 census:
Reference RG11, Piece 3997, Folio 35, Page 21
52 Richmond Street, Manchester
Buckley, Thomas Head M 32 Tile Cutter
Buckley, Alice Wife F 30
Buckley, Ralph Son M 11 Scholar
Buckley, Elizabeth Daughter F 9 Scholar
Buckley, Mary A Daughter F 6
Buckley, Thomas Son M 4
Buckley, Ellen Daughter F 2 All born Manchester
Thomas snr here (1881) is a File Cutter (not Tile Cutter) and the family are here:
1891 : 3169/ 71/ 17
Alice is a widow and young Thomas is now a file cutter also. There is now also a daughter Jane aged 9 yrs.
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sorry for repetition. :)
They are File Cutters though. (No Lithographic Printers as yet!)
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i havent a clue ???
i have no info of the family other than thomas jnrs children and i had thought names would run through...
his children are John Thomas 1903, Mary Catherine 1905, James Henry 1908, Elizabeth 1916 and Bridget Buckley (1920) Bridget snr died in 1920 during childbirth.
There is also a possible Margaret but i cant find a record of her, she would be younger than John and Mary though as they were born in Limerick.
My gran remembers her mum Mary wasnt allowed out with aunt marg because she was a bad influence (according to marys husband)
After he remarried he went on to have Ada and William Henry Buckley.
so going off the name theory.....
its possible that as theres an Elizabeth and a Mary (but bridgets mum was a mary too)
gah im baffling myself again
do you think the irish marriage record would have his uk address or the place he was staying over there?
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The Irish Cert should have his Irish address and occupation.
You have the idea that he was connected to the army - hopefully that would show.
I didn't check the actual 1901 census earlier so the ones I mentioned - listed as ' T B' initials only have those occupations mentioned before enlistment.
The various regiments there seem to be Lancers and Yorkshire regiments so that's not much help.
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im wondering if he went there as a labourer and just got married at the barracks, but the family thought barracks meant he was military?
i dont know ::)
Ada is still alive but very senile so the little information i have actually comes from her, and no one seems to like questioning her any further
:(
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It's difficult. I would now go for that Irish certificate and see what transpires.
Good luck - do you have all the details?
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i have the details from ancestry
Name: Thomas Buckley
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1903
Registration district: Limerick
Volume: 5
Page: 231 .
FHL Film Number: 101260
thats the right bit isnt it
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You don't need the film number - just the year, quarter volume and page - plus of course the names and place.
You can download a form from here: http://www.groireland.ie/