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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: Kar.Ma on Monday 04 February 13 10:04 GMT (UK)
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Hi, searching for any information on the family of Lovells, my Father-In-Law is Albert Lovell (born 1924), he and his brother John Lovell (born abt 1915) and Amelia (sister) were born in Middlesex, to Maud Mary Ilsley, his Father was John Lovell, there were also half sister's Queenie and Phoebe Lovell. Albert's Grandmother was Katie Lovell and she was a flower seller in the Chiswick area, these were a Romany family, so no birth certificates, they were in the Ealing, Chiswick area, long shot, but there may be someone who reads this and these names may ring bells. My husband and I would be grateful if anyone has any information relating to them. we are doing this for Bert.
Many thanks
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These are my Middlesex LOVELLs. (The numbers in square brackets refer to the current Borough.) There is probably a generation missing between these finds and your own earliest search and LMA data could be fill in the gaps.
MDX[9] Acton St Mary bp22/7/1821 (b9/7) Drusilla d/o John/Unetta, Gipsey of A.
MDX[7] Bloomsbury St George bp31/12/1813 (b12/12) John s/o Uriah/Agnes, cutler of Streatham, B.St.G.
MDX[18] Chiswick Christchurch bp3/2/1855 (b25/1) Constance d/o Riley/Caroline, lab of Turnham Green [LOVEL sic]
MDX[18] Chiswick Christchurch bp9/11/1856 (b16/10) Laura May Frances d/o Riley/Caroline, lab of Turnham Green [LOVEL sic]
MDX[18] Chiswick St Nicholas bp10/2/1849 (b28/1) Henrietta d/o Raleigh(?)/Caroline, brazier
MDX[18] Chiswick St Nicholas bp14/6/1846 (b1/6) Keziah d/o Lalla (Riley)/Caroline, brazier
MDX[13] Hammersmith (Shepherd’s Bush) St Stephen bp11/5/1862 (b18/4) Ada d/o Uriah/Marian, trav (Gypsy) of Latymer Road [LOVEL sic]
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp22/3/1813 Louisa d/o Thomas/Union, ch.matter of Lascelles Ct.
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp20/5/1814 Sarah d/o James/Linety, tinker of 3, New Street
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp31/7/1815 Major s/o Thomas/Susanna, knf.gr of Compton Place, St Pancras
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp26/5/1816 Angelina d/o Thomas/Catherine, knf.gr of 4, Blackhorse Rd., Cleveland St., St Pancras
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp31/8/1918 Charles John, bb s/o -/Ruth, vagabond Gypsey of 7, New Bolton Street
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp4/4/1819 Soloman s/o Edward/Ann, ch.btr, Charles St. Drury Lane
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp22/8/1819 Edward s/o Uriah/Agnes, knf.gr of Bainbrigg Street
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp22/8/1820 Ann d/o Alexander/Ann, ch.mkr of 25, Cross Lane
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp8/1/1821 Agnes d/o William/Susannah, ch.mnd of 12, New St.
MDX[7] Holborn St Giles bp25/12/1821 Edwin s/o Thomas/Catherine, ch.btr of 48 Charles St
MDX[19] Islington St Mary bp15/9/1782 Mary d/o Solomon/Domonah (noi)
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp27/4/1856 Betsey d/o Robert/Sarah, lab, Potteries
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp27/4/1856 Robert s/o Robert/Sarah, lab, Potteries
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp27/4/1856 Edward s/o Robert/Sarah, lab Potteries
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp19/11/1858 Charlotte d/o Joseph/Elizabeth, dec’d of Mary Place
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp11/11/1866 Clara s/o Duriah/Mary Anne, trav of K.
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp1/11/1868 Mary Ann d/o Uriah/Mary Ann, trav
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp25/1/1874 Israel s/o Uriah/Mary Ann, ch.btr of 19, St Mary’s Place [BOSWELL sic]
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp26/3/1876 Thomas s/o James/Altialia, ch.cnr of 22, Bangor St
MDX[20] Kensington St James Norlands bp6/1/1878 Violetta d/o Uriah/Mary Ann, ch.cnr of 15, Martin St., Latimer Road [BOSWELL sic]
MDX[33] Marylebone St Mary bp7/8/1796 (b24/7) Ruth d/o Duriah/Elizabeth (noi)
MDX[7] St Pancras Old Church bp6/8/1815 Uriah s/o Uriah/Agnes, grinder of Conbtr Place
MDX[12] Shoreditch St Leonard bp27/7/1823 Letitia d/o John/Union, cutler, Crooked Billet Yd
MDX[14] Tottenham All Hallows bp13/4/1817 (b2/4) Thomas s/o Hezekiah/Mary, gipsy knf.gr
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Thank you for that, I have found them!!! The entire family lived in William Street and descended from Hezekiah Lovell (born 1774) Occ: Knife Grinder, he married a Mary.
They had Thomas born 1817 Thomas Lovell married Mary Ann.
They had Albert born 1855 Albert Lovell married Catherine Selina Lovell (Katie) The Catherine threw me out, but she is on a census named Kate Lovell at William Street, Devonshire Rd, Chiswick, Middlesex.
They had John Lovell (Albert's Dad)
Just filling in the missing bits now, very grateful for your reply, must be a conncection there :)
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I meant to say there is a connection there (if I am reading it right, fairly new to this, so please bear with me).
So far have manged to build up quite a tree for Bert, they seem to have a number of occupations, which is so interesting.
Even more interesting was seeing that one of John's (Berts Father) occupations was a musciain, Bert also played (piano accordian and piano...left handed) :)
It's certainly going to put a big smile on his face when we hand onver the completed tree, so thank you again!!!!!
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You might be very interested in this....
http://www.chiswickw4.com/default.asp?section=community&link=http://appasp.ChiswickW4.com/server/app/forum/default.asp?site=1
There is still a Lovell's 'shop' on Chiswick High Road - you can see it on Google Earth between the Police staion and As Nature Intended
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Hi I'm not quite sure if I'm doing this correctly but here goes! I've been attempting to trace my grandmothers family who were Romany Gypsies. Her name was Elizabeth Lovell (Lizzie Lovell). I came upon roots chat by accident and read your message and couldn't believe what I read. I know of all the people you spoke of! I have a photo of Kate Lovell with her basket on my piano also one of her son John outside his house in Larraine Road Chiswick (he was my Dads grandad). In your message you mention Queenie and Phoebe! Sorry to say the name Queenie is wrong it's Lizzie and Phoebe two very young sisters who's mother had died leaving them with John their father but actually granny Kate (the flower seller) raised them.I just about remember Albert or Bert as you call him as a very you child, but remember his sister more because we used to visit sometime but we new her as aunt Millie. It would be great if you could reply I know it was back last year when you posted. Fingers crossed.
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Hello
I have just read your message and I am new to this site. I am one of (aunt) Millie's grandaughters. She spoke often of her life as a child and Pheobe & Lizzie. I took her to visit Lorraine Road at Strand-on-the-Green, Chiswick. She was always very proud of her Romany history. We lost our beloved nan in 2007. So glad we sat and listened to her talk about her memories of growing up in Chiswick. She told us her father (John) was very strict. She spoke of her brother, Bert and her brother who passed away very young. She was in contact with Bert throughout her life. John, Bert and Millie were/are very musical. Millie loved music and singing, Bert piano and accordian (?) and their father used to busk musically but never locally as he was a very proud man. I know the music continued down the line. I too have a photograph of Kate with a basket of flowers. We were in contact with Jaqueline in the US around 2006. I can't quite recall her connection to Phoebe/Lizzie but we had exchanged a couple of letters. : )
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Hello Saroma
So very sorry to hear of the loss of your Nan (my great aunt Millie). I often used to see her around the Brentford area waiting for a bus. I remember her wearing a red mac! You must have heard lots of stories about the Chiswick days and of the Gypsy ways! My nan (Lizzie) would often speak Romany to my dad, and would tell us lots of stories of her family especially her granny Kate and of her uncles and aunts. (Uncle Henry and his horse! :) You speak of John being a very proud man, I think the whole family were and very proud of their roots as am I. Do you know if Bert is still alive? Lizzie had four boys all very musical. Jacqueline is the daughter of Phoebe who is also musical, and you must be the daughter of either John or Jean Stone?
Would love to rootschat more. Thanks so much for replying.
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Just wonder if the Lovells you are talking about we're anything to do with the flower shop in Chiswick high road as my uncle harry Lovell married my dads sister Reenie and uncle Harry's dad owned the flower shop in Chiswick or is it just coincidence uncle Harry was very dark with curly black hair I have a photo of him
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Hello
Yes think there is a connection although not sure how. I can remember my Nan (Lizzie Lovell) talking to me about them saying they were related. I believe they also sold flowers outside Chiswick New Cemetery!
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Hi All
Thank you so much for your replies
And to find there are a fair few of the family still out there... I am the wife of Bert's son :) He married Beanie, was an electrician, loved his boys and lived a happy life, sadly he passed too, well over a year ago now... ~ he was such a lovely man , he had the most welcoming hug... ~ I started researching the tree for him some years ago and did find quite a few ~ which he was delighted by :)
saroma :) Bert told us about Millie, so sad for your loss ... Yes he kept in touch with Millie and was saddened by her passing ... and yes he was VERY musical and played Piano Accordion ( left handed )
We have the photo of Kate ( my husbands Great Grandmother) and her basket of flowers and a couple of John ~ ( My Husband's Grandfather) ~ The older brother Bert had was also named John and he passed away in his twenties ~ he had two children.
StellaFielder
Hi and thank you so much for your reply :) Another member of the Lovell family :) It was Bert who mentioned his sisters, is there possibly a Queenie also ( as he often mentioned her could be a cousin or distant relation maybe ? Or I may have become confused with all the names, I did find a whole street almost with Lovells ( William Street) ) As mentioned above to saroma ~ we have the photo of Kate and a couple of John and one of the oldest son who passed young.
John Lovell married twice... the second was to Maud Mary Barrett, Bert's mother ( had great difficulty locating her ... could be she was married before... or from Ireland) ~ I do know she often left and 'went on her wanders' as Bert put it...
( incidentally I also have Romany in my Ancestry ~ I did not find this out till researching my own tree... There is a photo of Bert playing the accordian on my Ancestry.co.uk Page and some other information I have collected http://trees.ancestry.co.uk/tree/51575405/family
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Hi, I've just found this site as I'm trying to do the family tree for the Lovell side of my family. I can identify with the original post and some of the responses so I'm hoping you can help.
I was married to Ernest Alfred Lovell b1929, father Thomas E A Lovell, grandfather Walter Lovell, GGF Thomas Lovell, GGGrandfather Hezekiah Lovell. Ernie always told us he was of Romany Gypsy descent but he had no evidence to share. His family and himself were Greengrocers in Chiswick, he had a Cousin John Lovell who lived in Hounslow in the 1970s when I knew him, married to Joan. John had a Greengrocers shop in Ealing. We lost touch with the Lovell side of the family, I am trying to make connections and find out all I can for our two daughters and their children, many who carry on the Lovell name. Any information would be very much appreciated. Are there any close relatives to Ernie or John that can add to our limited history? Thanks for reading. Sue
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Hi
The lovell family mentioned above Besnie Bronco Millie and Lizzie are all related to my late nan Phoebe . My Dad (Phoebes son) is still alive .
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Hi My sister and I have read this post with great interest . Phoebe Lovell was our Nan and the people mentioned are our Dads family members . We remember Bronco , Mille, Beanie and others . Our Dad Phoebes son is still alive and we would love to know more about this family tree . Thank you
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Hi Linzi - I am married to Bronc's son - Beanie and Bronc and Millie have now sadly passed away - but yes Phoebe was Bert's sister - how amazing, I have done a Tree on Ancestry, sadly not done much since Bert died, but the bare bones are there, they were all descended from the Romany folk that lived on Barnes common
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Posted a bit quick there, Bert Lovell was a lovely man, very fond memories.
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Hi
My name is Kym Moss and I am looking for any information on a Sapy Lovell born around 1802 and died in 1885 she was sent to Australia as a convict and died here she was married ? to a Augustus Lee, a Richard Miles and a Lewis Boswell she had several children on these children went on to be an ancestor of mine that is if I have my information correct would love to hear if you have any knowledge of her
Thankyou
Kym
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Sorry Kim, I wish I could help. I hope you managed to find some info.
Re The grandchildren of Kate Lovell (The lady with the flower basket) who’s son was John LOVELL, father of Pheobie, Lizzie, John jr, Millie, Albert aka Bronc; I attach a couple of photos of him. One walking with Maud (I’m pretty certain) Maud was mother to Millie and Bronc. Another photo has handwriting on it. I recognise Millie and could possibly be around the Lorraine Gardens area as I think that’s where they all lived when she was very young.
I came across some newspaper articles online mentioning petty offences, lots of Lovell boys mentioned 😂 but was dated 1900 /01 and puts them all living in William Street, which we know was where a lot of them lived before it was demolished. I’m sure my Nan (Millie) told me she shared a tiny house in William Street with her aunt Kate for a short while when she first married my grandad.
As you say, Maud was unfortunately, not always present and would take off for periods of time leaving John to raise the children. Millie made a connection in Manchester with a man called Ernest who was related to Maud! Could this be where she used to go? It’s possible she has family there.
I am blown away with your finding a link to Hazeikia back in 1775!
Hope all is well and good.
Sarah (Jeans daughter, Millie’s granddaughter)