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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: monke on Thursday 31 January 13 15:31 GMT (UK)
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Hello to everyone :)
my question on this topic is from ship script from 1907. In the sixt line it should write Pero Misur.
In the line city or town on Pero's space writes something with M. Ellis island crew translated it as Minorica. But it's not correct. There is no stop on second letter. If the last letter in his name is O and is written like that, could it be the same in in his name of town.
I appreciate everyones help :)
(http://i46.tinypic.com/27dwk.jpg)
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Is his country of origin Hungary?
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yeah that says on script. But i think he should be from today's Croatia. Back then Croatia was part of Hungary.... Why do you ask?
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Just trying to pin it down a bit geographically. It does look like a serbo-croat ending.
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And his name Pero is typical for Croatia. I don't think there are Peros in Hungary
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Mitrovica. It's in northern Kosovo.
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no, absouletly not. Mitrovica is on Kosovo. Not part of Hungary...
But nice try though. :)
I don't think that second letter is I, there is no fullstop on top. I think it's A.
If the last letter in his name is O then this could be A or O. I also believe it's not T, that it could be H.
I really need someone who has experience reading this.
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I was about to post Mitrovica before I saw Mike's reply. Before ruling it out completely, keep in mind that borders changed. There are several towns of this name, one of them may have been part of Hungary before the war.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitrovica
(perhaps I should add I do not have experience reading Hungarian place names)
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I really need someone who has experience reading this.
Good luck
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Yeah those Mitrovica could have been part of Hungary but in Serbia.
Pero was Croatian. And there is no fullstop on top in letter i.
Not Mitrovica for sure... Pero was Croatian
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Maybe this one then? :
From Wikipedia under Sremska Mitrovica (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sremska_Mitrovica)
With the abolition of the Slavonian Military Frontier in 1881, Sremska Mitrovica was included into Syrmia County, which was part of the Kingdom of Croatia-Slavonia and Kingdom of Hungary within Austria-Hungary.
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No, it's not mitrovica for sure.
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Could there be written Mahovica ??
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Where's that? ???
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It's a small small village in Croatia. Now is called Maovice but 100 years ago it was mahovice.
The question is could that writing be Mahovica ?
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Why are you so dead set against Mitrovica? The ship's manifest says his "Race or People" is Croatian, and his "Last Permanent Residence" was Mitrovica, Hungary, which seems to make perfect sense. I can't read that place name as anything but Mitrovica -- the lack of a dot on the "i" is really not significant, as I can see at least 3 other definite "i"s in the snippet which are undotted.
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because mitorvica is in kosovo or in serbia in north. Ethnicity would be serbian or albanian....
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I think you are wrong on that one. The line says he is Croatian, with his last known permanent address in (wherever) Hungary. Sremska Mitrovica is close enough to Croatia that it doesn't seem impossible for someone born in Croatia to live there for a while -- especially someone who later turned up in America! Unless you have reason to believe that an ethnic Croatian would not have been able to live in Mitrovica at that time, in which case you need to provide your evidence.
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@ monke
I looked through an old atlas I have - and there's two towns called Mitrovitza (in that spelling), one of which is most likely Mitrovice, as stated above, one of which is close to the border with modern-day Kosovo and Serbia.
Could one of these be the towns or villages you're looking for? I made notes, but can't now find them: I believe they were both in old Serbia. I'll find them and report back.
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I also have an old atlas (1928) which has the following index entries:
Mitrovica Yugoslavia 44.59 N 19.36 E
Mitrovitza Yugoslavia 42.43 N 20.57 E
... neither of which are in Croatia.
:-\
K.
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OK. Here is what I have from my particular atlas:-
Mitrovitza, town on R(iver) Save, Sijem dep(artment). Croatia, Slovenia, (pop. 12,935) NW of Belgrade on map
Mitrovitza, town, Serbia. NW of Pristina on map
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OK. Here is what I have from my particular atlas:-
Mitrovitza, town on R(iver) Save, Sijem dep(artment). Croatia, Slovenia, (pop. 12,935)
Mitrovitza, town, Serbia.
Seems to fit the bill very well. Good find.
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Cheers, Mike. Glad to see you might have got the cap-badge ID sorted.
John
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Cheers, Mike. Glad to see you might have got the cap-badge ID sorted.
John
Hi John. I'm still hoping the Shropshire guy will come back with a better scan but, yes, it's looking as though it's sorted. Thanks for your help with that one.
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I think you are wrong on that one. The line says he is Croatian, with his last known permanent address in (wherever) Hungary. Sremska Mitrovica is close enough to Croatia that it doesn't seem impossible for someone born in Croatia to live there for a while -- especially someone who later turned up in America! Unless you have reason to believe that an ethnic Croatian would not have been able to live in Mitrovica at that time, in which case you need to provide your evidence.
mgf i respect and aprecciate your help very much. But i think you are wrong. I know better circumstances in these lands of that age. The land says Hungary because Croatians didn't have their own country and were part of Austro-Hungarian empire and they wrote their country as Austria or Hungary. Secondly nobody from Croatia wanted to live i Kosovo at that time or in Serbia, it was much poorer country than Austro-Hungary. Believe when i say that Southe East Europe was not America and people didn't change town of living that much. Believe it or not there were no divorces at that time in Croatia. I always suprise when i read this forum how someone's ancestor divorced and it gives difficuties to trace him.
Once more thanks everyone for help :)
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But what about the Mitrovica in Croatia that John found for you?
I don't know why you're so sure that it's not Mitrovica, when it looks exactly like that on the page, and there is at least one place that it could be. What do you think it is?
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And are you sure his name is Pero? It looks like Petr to me. The end letter is the same as one a few higher which is an r.
Can't comment on anything else as on my screen I can't get past the column after his profession for some reason (and I've slid the bar across as far as it will go, thanks)
Dawn M
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I agree with those who have said it is written "Mitrovica" or "Mitrovrica". As to which modern town that relates to it's not certain but you have had some good suggestions which i would suggest you should follow up rather than dismissing out of hand.
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And are you sure his name is Pero? It looks like Petr to me. The end letter is the same as one a few higher which is an r.
True -- but on the other hand check out the o on the end of Laszlo on line 2.
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Hmmm. See what you mean. Could be either I suppose.
Dawn M
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Place name.
Regards
Malky