RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Derbyshire => England => Derbyshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Yasmina4 on Monday 14 January 13 18:07 GMT (UK)
-
::)I have posts running on the Short family under other Countries India and here on the Derbyshire
section.
I have finally traced the errant William Holwell Short's arrival in New York in 1834.
He appears on the 1850 census in Lewiston, New York with son Laurence William Short, born 1832, Ashover, Derbyshire and a Jane Short aged 26 born England.(WHS is 46 on the census).
As far as I know, WH Short was still married to Maria Eliza Decima Griffies- Williams,mother of Laurence . The marriage took place in Islington in 1831.
Jane was too young to be a nursemaid when WHS took off for USA in 1834 with the child Lawrence.
Could someone investigate please?
Sandra....extract from 1850 census below
·
1850 census for Lawrence W Short in Lewiston, Niagara, New York, United States
William H Short M 46 England
Jane Short F 26 England
Lawrence W Short M 18 England
Moderator Comment: Post edited. Please do not cut and paste information from other websites.
-
I don't have any informatin on Jane, but do have Ashover PR's if you are interested.
Carol
-
Sorry I do not understand "PR's".
It seems unlikely that Jane was from Derby. ::) Unless she was a niece???? Sister??
Looking forward to the PRs especially if they show some light on why WHS left his wife stranded.
Many thanks for the reply.
Sandra
-
I have Ashover Parish Records on CD.
Carol
-
::)ooo!
Any Janes born in 1824 please?
Regards Sandra
-
No Jane Short but there are other Short baptism / Marriages / burials
Do you have these?
Carol
-
Have date birth 1769 Laurence Short who became a Rector of Ashover, and dobs of his children by
the second wife.
Would like marriage (and births )of his parents Ann Slate and John Short....approx 1768. Any possibility that you have the births of this John Short and Ann Slate. His parents are supposed to be John Short and Caroline Emma Hay ,anything you can find on them?.
Is there a chance that you can identify the address that John Short gave when Lawrence was born?
That's all I can think of so far.
Oh yes, Maria Eliza Decima Short residence at time of death aged 70. Date of death please. I cannot figure why she stayed on in Ashover after being deserted by her husband.
Thank you
Sandra
-
There is this burial
Eliza M.D.G. Short buried 23.2. 1880 aged 70
Carol
-
Thank you. Does it not give place of residence at time of death?
Sandra
-
Can you explain.
Have just found " my " Eliza Short on Census for 1851. And 1861
She is described as a boarder in the Household of Eliza Short. Does that mean she rented the property?
Regards Sandra
-
Hi Sandra
The only address given for the burial is Ashover.
In 1851/61/71 census she appears to be a boarder with the Wall family and is described as a
Annuitant, so she was getting an income from somewhere.
I can't see any other information sorry. Have you tried looking at the Derbyshire Records Office online catalogue.
http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/leisure/record_office/records/catalogue/search/default.asp
Carol :'(
-
Hi
Thank you for helping me.
She was a getting £50 per year from her father's estate. This was to be administered in a kind way by her brother allowing no interference from her husband or others! So they had got WHS measure by then.
Would love to hear more of her life but I think thats all we can find. She seems to have been very badly treated. No home of her own, living amongst strangers, her son taken from her when he was a toddler.
Did the census give an address for the Wall family?
Regards Sandra and many thanks
-
Hi,
Not sure what information you have but:-
LaWrence Short = Charlotte Eleanor Holwell 30th April 1801 at Thornbury, Gloucestershire
she was the daughter of the Rev. William Holwell of Thornbury, Glocs.
There is an obituary for her Father 13th February 1798 in the Gentleman's Magazine:-
February 13 Rev William Holwell BDFRS vicar of Thornbury in Gloucestershire prebendary of Exeter and formerly chaplain to the King distinguished by very superior talents as a scholar and for a critical knowledge of the Greek language He published in 1766 Selecti Dionysii Halicainassensis de Priscis Scriptoribus Tractatus Graece et Latine of which see the Anecdotes of MrBowyer pp 212 381 and in 1775 Extracts from Mr Pope's Translation corresponding with the Beauties of Homer selected from the Iliad 2 vols 8vo ibid p 577
The above also had a son William Holwell who took the name of Carr (this all to do with
his wife and inheritance) for more information about this you need to go to:-
http://books.google.co.uk/
and search for Rev. William Holwell Carr.
The Reverend Holwell Carr left all his collection of Paintings to the Nation - go get them back
they are worth a fortune. ;D
There is also information for Rev. Laurence Short on:-
http://www.theclergydatabase.org.uk/jsp/search/index.jsp
and the Cambridge Alumni:-
http://venn.lib.cam.ac.uk/cgi-bin/search.pl?sur=short&suro=c&fir=laurence&firo=c&cit=&cito=c&c=DBY&tex=&sye=&eye=&col=QUEENS&maxcount=50
You will see it states that Laurence was the son of John Short of Dronfield & Madras.
Think you should look for information in Dronfield Derbyshire for John Short.
Hope this helps
Spendlove
-
That shook me for a minute ???I thought I had been following the wrong William Holwell but realise
your William Holwell is not my William Holwell Short son of the Reverend Laurence.
Will have a look at William Holwell Carr with interest.
There is a window in the Church dedicated to Reverend Laurence Short. Unfortunately the dedication plaque has been removed , we are asking the present incumbent to reattach it. :(
On some sites Laurence is the son of Anne Slate and John Short of Dronfield formerly of Madras
and grandson of John Short and Caroline Emma Hay.
One of Laurence's sons Edward, went out to Madras and founded a family business after his army career there.
Laurence born 1769, parents married 1768. Unable to find parents and grandparents in Derbyshire
and it seems to early for accurate records in Madras.
Many thanks for the input Sandra
-
Hi,
Sorry to have confused, but as many of your ancestors names contained the name Holwell,
I thought it would be putting "meat on the bones" do discover how well connected the Short
family became with the marriage of Laurence Short to Charlotte E. Holwell.
You will see that the Cambridge Alumni & the Clergy data base, connections given, confirm information you have about Laurence.
SHORT OF NEWHAM HALL
SHORT, REV HUGH MARTIN MA of Newham Hall, Stokesley co York Vicar of Thornthwaite Keswick Cumberland, JP b 8 Aug 1817 m 1 July 1842 Mary Anne dau of Featonby Burrell, Esq of Newham Hall, Yorkshire and Billingham Grange, Durham son of Peter Burrell Esq Durham by his wife Jane Watson of Burn Hall Durham and has issue:-
I LAURENCE FEATONBY HOLWELL b. 6 Feb 1846
II Hugh Martin b 27 Oct 1850
III George Ofspring Blackall b 24 Dec 1855
IV Arthur Burrell b. 2 Aug 1858 d. Feb 1859
I Mary Anne Nodder
11 Isabella Thurston
III Emily Frances Burrell.
LINEAGE - The late REV LAURENCE SHORT MA rector of Ashover Chesterfield son of John Short of Madras by Caroline Emma Hay his wife m Charlotte Eleanora dau of the Rev William Holwell BD vicar of Thornbury Gloucestershire prebendary of Exeter senior censor of Christ Church Oxford and chaplain in ordinary to HM King QEORGE III and had issue:-
HUGH MARTIN SHORT (REV), of Newham Hall (see above)
WILLIAM HOLWELL m 12 April 1831 Eliza Maria Griffies dau of Sir George Griffies Williams, Bart of Llwynny Wood, Carmarthenshire.
LAURENCE.
EDWARD HOLWELL m Miss Coffin dau of General Coffin Madras.
BERESFORD.
ANNE-HOLWELL m to Edward Kirkby son of Samuel Kirkby Esq of Grove House Sheffield,
HARRIOTT HOLWELL
CHARLOTT ELEANORA HOLWELL
martha isabella holwell m to George Buxton JP Northampton son of George Buxton Esq JP Cold Ashby Northamptonshire.
It then gives the description of the coat of arms which I have not given.
The above is from "A genealogical & heraldic history of the landed gentry of Great Britain" Vol. 2
page 1259 by Sir Bernard Burke.
You will see that Burke does not give marriage details for Laurence or Beresford. Would also add
it is vital that all the information in such publications is actually checked - many are submitted
by the various families and are not correct.
However you have the birth dates of the Children of Laurence - so easy to check.
Laurence is listed as widower when he married Charlotte Holwell, so looking for records in
Dronfield :-
Laurence Short Bpt. 1.2.1769 Dronfield Derbyshire Father John
Laurence Short = 12.8.1794 Dronfield Sarah Staneforth
There is also a Thomas Short Bpt 12.6.1770 at Dronfield Father John Short
John Short = Ann Slate 17th February 1768 at Dronfield
This early no Mother is state in Church Registers - so it is necessary to discover other evidence.
Have you discovered a Will for John Short?
Spendlove
-
Many thanks for the research. Useful again.
My line is descended from Laurence's son Edward Holwell Short who married Louisa Coffin, daughter
of the General.
As so often happens I came against the John Short brick wall and started to look at other relatives.
Got curious about the William Holwell Short and the son's disappearance and went off at a tangent.
No I have not found John Short's will. Have had a look but am at present using free research sites
I do so wish I could find the John Shorts on line. The" formerly of Madras" is tickling the curiousity as we wonder if the Estates (Coffee,tea and fruit plantations), set up by son Edward were on land given to the John's by the East India Company.
Cannot get up to London and records do not seem to be available for Madras pre 1760 on line.
Again thank you very much for your interest. It is a very interesting family.
Have read the description of the coat of arms but was unable to see an image of it.
Sandra
-
Hi,
Sorry to have confused, but as many of your ancestors names contained the name Holwell,
I thought it would be putting "meat on the bones" do discover how well connected the Short
family became with the marriage of Laurence Short to Charlotte E. Holwell.
You will see that the Cambridge Alumni & the Clergy data base, connections given, confirm information you have about Laurence.
SHORT OF NEWHAM HALL
SHORT, REV HUGH MARTIN MA of Newham Hall, Stokesley co York Vicar of Thornthwaite Keswick Cumberland, JP b 8 Aug 1817 m 1 July 1842 Mary Anne dau of Featonby Burrell, Esq of Newham Hall, Yorkshire and Billingham Grange, Durham son of Peter Burrell Esq Durham by his wife Jane Watson of Burn Hall Durham and has issue:-
I LAURENCE FEATONBY HOLWELL b. 6 Feb 1846
II Hugh Martin b 27 Oct 1850
III George Ofspring Blackall b 24 Dec 1855
IV Arthur Burrell b. 2 Aug 1858 d. Feb 1859
I Mary Anne Nodder
11 Isabella Thurston
III Emily Frances Burrell.
for info. relates to some of the Short family above
Mary Ann Short of Thornwaite Cumberland died 21 Jan 1872 wife of the Rev. Hugh Martin Short, Clerk Admin. of effects granted to Rev. Hugh, effects under £600
Lawrence Featonby Holwell Short born 10 Mar 1846
Baptism Date: 5 Mar 1846 St John the Evangelist Wortley
Father Hugh Martin Short mother Mary Anne
Hugh remarried 26 Feb 1876 Emma Catherine Cox, both widowed his occ. clerk in orders Thornwaite Keswick Cumberland father Laurence (too faint to make out witness & occupation of his father Laurence it may just read dec'd)
Lawrence Featonby Holwell Short of Rockhampton Queensland colony of NSW gentleman died 16 Dec 1893 probate London 26th Feb to Tansley Witt public accountant effects £3106 4s 2d
The Rev Hugh Martin Short of Aislaby Lodge Whitby Clerk died 9 June 1898 Probate
London 20 Oct to Mary Anne Nodder Short spinster & George Ofspring Blackall Short gentleman, effects £960 5s. 4d. Resworn Feb 1899 £1080 15s. 4d.
Hugh Martin Short age 81 (1817) Abode Whitby
Parish: St Stephen Kirkstall Burial Date: 14 Jun 1898
Emma Catherine Short of the Rectory Manorhouse Fakenham Norfolk widow died 2 Nov 1904 probate London 25 Nov to James Percy Chadwick solicitor & Tansley Witt chartered accountant Effects £29504 1s 2d. Resworn £30954 9s. 4d
Emma Catherine Short age 86 (1818) Rectory Manor House Fakenham Norfolk
Burial Norwood Cemetery Norwood Rd Lambeth Burial Date: 8 Nov 1904
-
Hi
That's all new to me. Thank you so much. Cannot see where the John Shorts come in.
We knew one branch went off to Australia. So that solves that.
All grist to the mill.
Very grateful. Sandra
-
There is this burial
Eliza M.D.G. Short buried 23.2. 1880 aged 70
Eliza Maria Decima Griffies Short widow died 20 Feb 1880 at Ashover
probate 4 Feb 1890 Admin of the personal estate was granted at the Principal Registry under the
usual limitations to William Jones Evans Solicitor of Llandovey lawful Attorney of
Lawrence William Holwell Short the son only next of kin now residing in Canada
Effects £334 5s.7d.
-
Oh that is such good news.
She kept in touch with Laurence. Thank you.
Any chance that you could find Laurence on any passenger lists to UK?
I would like to think they saw each other occasionally. What a puzzle.
Laurence was using a Llandovery attorney. Where his mother was from. It seems that he was
familiar with his mother's home in Wales.
Sandra
-
Any chance that you could find Laurence on any passenger lists to UK?
Sorry no luck :(
Interesting that on LWHS marriage 8 Aug 1860 Perth to Eliza S Gill his parents named as William & JANE (you would need to check original document)
I’ve added the links from your previous threads for Lawrence William Holwell Short hopefully not to duplicate the same info.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,629766.0.html
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,629723.0.html
Reading the thread I don’t think you had the 1861 census or the deaths for Lawrence & Eliza Short
1861 Fullarton Perth Canada West
William Short 27 England dittoed occucpation as watch maker
Elliza 22 States
Methodist married 1 year
L W H Short age 72 died 25/11/1905
Place of death Blanshard - See link http://vitalstats.gov.mb.ca/Query.php
Eliza Sophia Short died age 88 26th Jul 1927 Vancouver
I have found these two Uk censuses with 2 Lorance Shorts & a Charlotte Short on
do you think they relate to your Short family?
1841 Class: HO107; Piece: 108; Book: 19; Civil Parish: Stockport: Cheshire; E D 25; Folio: 4; Page: 2
Wood End
Lorance Short 30 (1811) Calico Printer
Charlotte Short 65 (1776) Ind.
Harriott 25 “
Charlotte 20 “
Lorance 9 (1832)
Not born in this county
1851 HO107; Piece: 2218; Folio: 554; Page: 10
John WATERHOUSE 52 Derbyshire Designer
Harriett 29 Ashover
Charlotte SHORT mother-in-law 79 (1772) Thornby Gloucestershire Cleryman’s widow
Harriet Broadhurst visitor 17
Hannah Barnett servant 20
marriage of Harriet Holwell Short to John Waterhouse, father Lawrence Short
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMRK-8YL
and this from Lancashire OPC gives more detail
2 Feb 1845 St Stephen, Salford, Lancashire
John Waterhouse f/a Pattern Designer single father James Manufacturer
Harriett Holwell Short f/a single father Lawrence occ Clerk
both of 9 Simpsons Buildings, Salford
Witness: George Waterhouse; Ann Strongitharm, (X)
Death of Charlotte Eleanora Short
Sep 1855 Barton Upon Irwell Lancashire
Now back to the start of your thread and the question you asked
"who was Jane Short"?
Public tree on An*y gives her name as Jane SHAW no dob or pob or marriage date
(can see no evidence that supports this) the only way I can think of to find out is to obtain
a b/c of one of their children, unfortunatley I haven't found anything online
This you may already have
William Holwell Short age 28 (1804) England occ Army
arrived NY on 6 Feb 1832 on the ship named John Jay,
2 other male passengers plus Master Nathan H Holdinge
1860/1870 Canadian Census
William SHORT b1803 (Farmer), Jane b1823 & family in Oregon Dan Wisconsin
Perhaps if you can find a birth certificate of one of William & Jane’s children this may help
discover her maiden name - children named
William W Short (1851) , Florence A (M) (1857) & Fanny (1861) born Wisconsin
EDIT
this is where the SHAW surname has come from marriage possibly a second of dau Florence Amelia Short father named as William H Short mother Jane SHAW
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XRVD-H9Z
and looks as if they had a dau born 1845 Wales (shame they didn't add the name Shaw )
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/X1R8-449
Charlotte Anne Jane Halwell Short
Sep 1845 Llanrwst Denbighshire vol 27 page 176
-
:o My you have been really busy.
So much to take in.
I found that Laurence had married in Ontario to an Eliza Gill. He had many children but by 1901 seems to have separated form his family. He was a Farmer.
From another investigation Laurence appeared briefly in Ontario at the age of 15 but reappeared aged 18 living with his father WHS and the mystery Jane Short in New York Census 1850.
I did find a Jane Short living with a William H Short in new york with a child named Florence.
I went back to Jane's born in England of her age and settled on a Jane Elliot but that was not her as she lived all her life as a Housekeeper firmly based in UK/
Reverend Laurence had a daughter who matched the Waterhouse marriage as she was the one who paid for the dedication Church window in Ashover.
Note that the wife WHS left behind was described as a widow when she died. Which ties in with the WHS death. It seems unlikely that he actually ,married Jane!
I will have a close look at your other findings.
I am very impressed by what you have managed to come up with. Thank you.
-
Interesting that on LWHS marriage 8 Aug 1860 Perth to Eliza S Gill his parents named as William & JANE (you would need to check original document)....will make a note of that
I’ve added the links from your previous threads for Lawrence William Holwell Short hopefully not to duplicate the same info.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,629766.0.html
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,629723.0.html..Thank you did not know how to add links.
Reading the thread I don’t think you had the 1861 census or the deaths for Lawrence & Eliza Short
1861 Fullarton Perth Canada West
William Short 27 England dittoed occucpation as watch maker
Elliza 22 States
Methodist married 1 year....He was born in 1832. Understood he was a farmer.
L W H Short age 72 died 25/11/1905
Place of death Blanshard - See link http://vitalstats.gov.mb.ca/Query.php ....Will note that..... Looks likely.
Eliza Sophia Short died age 88 26th Jul 1927 Vancouver. I think they had separated by 1901.
I have found these two Uk censuses with 2 Lorance Shorts & a Charlotte Short on
do you think they relate to your Short family?
1841 Class: HO107; Piece: 108; Book: 19; Civil Parish: Stockport: Cheshire; E D 25; Folio: 4; Page: 2
Wood End
Lorance Short 30 (1811) Calico Printer
Charlotte Short 65 (1776) Ind.
Harriott 25 “
Charlotte 20 “
Lorance 9 (1832)
Not born in this county............? I wonder if they are related. They seem very fond of the names Charlotte, Harriet and Laurence...but then again perhaps the names were fashionable. The Rev Laurence died in Whitby so they seem to have ties with Yorkshire.
1851 HO107; Piece: 2218; Folio: 554; Page: 10
John WATERHOUSE 52 Derbyshire Designer
Harriett 29 Ashover
Charlotte SHORT mother-in-law 79 (1772) Thornby Gloucestershire Cleryman’s widow
Harriet Broadhurst visitor 17
Hannah Barnett servant 20................this has to be right.
marriage of Harriet Holwell Short to John Waterhouse, father Lawrence Short
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMRK-8YL
and this from Lancashire OPC gives more detail
2 Feb 1845 St Stephen, Salford, Lancashire
John Waterhouse f/a Pattern Designer single father James Manufacturer
Harriett Holwell Short f/a single father Lawrence occ Clerk
both of 9 Simpsons Buildings, Salford
Witness: George Waterhouse; Ann Strongitharm, (X) ...........I saw clerk and thought surely not but at some point Rev Laurence was a Clerk in orders somewhere so yes this must be them. The money for the church window must have come from Daddy Waterhouse..manufacturer. I wonder what they manufactured?
Death of Charlotte Eleanora Short
Sep 1855 Barton Upon Irwell Lancashire.. he would have been mortified that the Holwell was not included in her name.
Now back to the start of your thread and the question you asked
"who was Jane Short"?
Public tree on An*y gives her name as Jane SHAW no dob or pob or marriage date
(can see no evidence that supports this) the only way I can think of to find out is to obtain
a b/c of one of their children, unfortunatley I haven't found anything online...I will try to contact the tree owner thru Mundia. Many thanks
This you may already have
William Holwell Short age 28 (1804) England occ Army
arrived NY on 6 Feb 1832 on the ship named John Jay,
2 other male passengers plus Master Nathan H Holdinge.....I had been told that he had arrived in New York 1832 so this confirms it......Army, now then thats something to go on, his younger brother,Edward, was in the army in India so it seems likely that WHS was out there too. Will have a look. My daughter in her one look up came upa with a William H Short in the army but we were busy pursuing other line and she did not save that inf for further thought.
1860/1870 Canadian Census
William SHORT b1803 (Farmer), Jane b1823 & family in Oregon Dan Wisconsin
Perhaps if you can find a birth certificate of one of William & Jane’s children this may help
discover her maiden name - children named
William W Short (1851) , Florence A (M) (1857) & Fanny (1861) born Wisconsin. I /wonder?
EDIT
this is where the SHAW surname has come from marriage possibly a second of dau Florence Amelia Short father named as William H Short mother Jane SHAW
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XRVD-H9Z
and looks as if they had a dau born 1845 Wales (shame they didn't add the name Shaw )
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/X1R8-449. So they may have been in Wales for a while.
Charlotte Anne Jane Halwell Short
Sep 1845 Llanrwst Denbighshire vol 27 page 176. Thats her!.............My grandchildren are going to be so pleased at all the Welsh connections.
That is an amazing amount of research you have achieved and I am really really grateful.
:)Sandra
-
I am new to this site and just came across your question regarding Jane Short. She and WHS were my great great grandparents and her birth name was Jane Shaw. I have also been trying to find out more about her. She and WHS had 3 children together as well as raising LWHS together. One of their children, Fanny (Francis), was my great grandmother. I have Jane's stitching sampler from 1836 with her name "Jane Shaw". I have been given information through family records that Eliza Maria Griffies Williams had gone insane and that is why WHS left her. I'm not sure of your connection to the Holwell line, but if interested, I have a family tree that goes back from Charlotte and Laurence's children all the way to the 15th century!!
I look forward to chatting with you and, hopefully, solving the puzzle of Jane :)
-
:)what a marvelous Christmas present.
I had almost given up hope of tracing further back than Laurence 's grandfather, John Short of Dronfield, formally of Madras. John seemed to pop up married and ready made , apparently a nabob, in Dronfield.
Laurence's grandfather, the Rector Laurence Short ,was my son in law's great great grandfather..
I happen to live a few miles from the estate where William's wife hailed from. the Llynywormwood estate in myddfai, outside llandovery, Carmarthenshire, Wales. The estate is now owned by HRH Prince Charles. The mansion, 13 bedrooms, has been pulled down however.
If you can place two more posts on here, we will be able to exchange private messages..
I am delighted that you have joined Roots Chat.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra!! So nice to "meet" you!!
Unfortunately, I don't have much information on Laurence Short's lineage. I do, however, have his wife's (Charlotte Eleanora Holwell) lineage and can send a photocopy image once we can exchange private messages.
I had heard of Eliza's father's estate and that HRH Prince Charles had purchased it a few years back. What a lovely place to live!! I have several of Eliza's belongings ~ a "nosegay" (as my grandmother called it) that she created with silk thread...I can take a photo of it and send it to you as well, as well as a journal of sorts that she carried with her on her travels all over Europe. She must have been a fascinating woman!!
Only one more post to go ;) !!
-
Oh how lucky that you have an Eliza nosegay and her journal. I would love to see both.
I would also love to hear more about her. Personally I refer to her as Decima as that was one of her names and it appeals to me.....I have a Septimus in my family you see..he was the seventh son.
I am interested in jane shaws background. She may not have been a blood relative but is of great interest.
So no news of john short in your records.
The holwells.. Yes I would love to see their lineage. It must be fascinating.
My son in law's mother. Maureen Holwell Short born 1922 was the last in her branch of the family to carry the Holwell name it was used by her grandfather.
One more post to go and then we can really get down to this.
Sandra
-
Hi Sandra~
So it seems that your son-in-law and I are distant cousins?? And is he descended from Laurence and Charlotte's son, Laurence?? I do have quite a bit of information on all of Laurence and Charlotte's children...can't wait to share!! I'm hoping after this post that I will be able to privately send several documents...yeah!!
Gina
-
I looked and looked for your third post in my mail box. Nothing showed . just had the sense to look on roots chat web and you had answered.
I have pmd you.
Regards sandra
-
Here's the baptism of Lawrence William Short in Ashover, Derbyshire on 29th March 1833
Name Laurence William Holwell
Sex Male
Father's Name William Holwell Short
Mother's Name Eliza Maria Decima Griffies Short
Event Type Christening
Event Date 29 Mar 1833
Event Place Ashover, Derbyshire, England, United Kingdom
Eliza Maria Decima Griffies Williams is the brother of Rev. David Herbert Thackeray Griffies Williams (1805-1877). He is buried in Llandyfeisant Graveyard on the Dynevor Estate in Llandeilo Carmarthenshire, Wales which is the focus of my research.
-
Here is the obituary of William Jones Evans, the Solicitor and Agent for Llwynywormwood. The Misses Williams mentioned below are the daughters of Rev. D.H.T. Griffies Williams, brother of Eliza Maria Decima Griffies Williams, Llwynywormwood, Llandovery, Carmarthenshire, Wales
https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3747020/3747026/150/Llwynhelig
Tuesday, 6th November 1900
DEATH OF MR W. J. EVANS, LLANDOVERY - OLDEST PRACTISING SOLICITOR
£6,000 LEFT TO HIS CLERK.
The death is announced of Mr William Jones Evans, of Vron. The deceased gentleman, who was 85 years of age and a bachelor, was admitted a solicitor in 1839, since which time he successfully practised at Llandovery. He was believed to be about the oldest practising solicitor in the kingdom. Mr Evans was agent for the Llwynywormwood Estates for nearly 50 years, and a better agent and landlord never existed. The town of Llandovery and the whole neighbourhood mourns his loss, for he was highly respected by one and all.
The death occurred on Thursday, and the funeral, which was private, took place on Monday. The interment was at Llandingat Churchyard, and the only persons present were some of deceased's personal friends.
We understand the persons principally benefited by the testator’s will are Colonel H. Davies Evans, of Highmead (lord lieutenant of Cardiganshire), the Misses Williams, of Llwynhelig, Llandilo, and the testator's clerk, Mr John Rees, of Gloucester House, Llandovery. It appears Mr Rees had been Mr Evans' confidential clerk for the last 33 years, and all his friends in and out of Llandovery will be glad to know that the testator has left him by his will real and personal estate to the value of something like £6,000. We understand that the will also contains bequests in favour of the Carmarthenshire Infirmary, towards which institution the deceased gentleman had only recently given £100, the Solicitors' Benevolent Association, and the National Schools of Llandovery and Mothvey.
-
Thank you for the additional information.
My son in law and I were discussing his short ancestors yesterday.
Lawrence son of the Reverend Lawrence short enlisted with the east india company. He became a coffee plantation owner in south india.All his descendants remained in India until 1947. My son in laws mother married and moved to Pakistan. She died in Oregon.. USA.
I have searched and searched and find it impossible to find out where john short of madras came from. And no information on his wife.