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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Norfolk => Topic started by: katlady on Thursday 10 January 13 03:39 GMT (UK)
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My ancestors James Torrens/Torrance Smith born 1817 in Great yarmouth and Lydia Manthorpe born 1817 Herringfleet, Suffolk, married in Gorleston, Suffolk in 1838.
I believe James Smith's parents were James Smith from Great Yarmouth and Charlotte unknown.
Would love to find a link to James Torrens parents somewhere.
Any help would be appreciated
Regards Katlady
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On familysearch.org
James George Smith
baptism - 30 Sep 1817
Great yarmouth Norfolk
father - James Smith
mother - Charlotte
And this
James Smith
baptism - 15 Oct 1817
Great Yarmouth, Norfolk
father - John Smith
mother - Phoebe Smith
On same page FreeBMD
Marriages Mar 1/41838
Lydia Manthorp and James Smith Mutford &c 13/627
No mention of Torrens/Torrence on marriage record.
The marriage cert will show his father"s name and occupation.
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here is another baptism in 1817. Why are you leaning towards James and Charlotte being his parents? When did the middle name Torrens/Torrance appear?
James Smith
baptism - 28 Mar 1817
Great Yarmouth, Norfolk, England
father -James Smith
mother - Ann Smith
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Hi, is a poss that, it being a middle name, it could be Terrence?? Dave.
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The baptism for the James Smith born to James and Charlotte shows he has a second name - George -
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-12346-131116-90?cc=1416598&wc=MMVP-HB5:618385096
I can't find a mention of the name Torrens/Torrence until one of James and Lydia's sons was baptised on August 23 1857 - George William Torrens Smith - https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-14263-25957-5?cc=1823613&wc=9020045
The entry is from the Bishops Transcripts, and isn't all that clear, unfortunately
Yorkslass
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Hello to all that replied to my original message and thanks.
Firstly the name James Torrens/Torrance was passed down through earlier attempts at family history using personal knowledge of elder family members, so quite possibly incorrect. I dont have any corroborating evidence at all. The same goes for his parents names James and Charlotte. It is quite likely that one or both of these facts are incorrect.
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Since you have no specifics re. the marriage you can't really know that it did take place in Gorleston. Mutford regn. district covered numerous parishes and it could have taken place at any of them.
Also, as pointed out already, there were 3 James Smith's baptised in 1817 - not knowing definitely where the marriage took place your only option seems to be to obtain a copy of the marriage certificate to at least establish his fathers name and occupation to establish which James he was. If he was James George Smith bp.30/9/1817, son of James and Charlotte, he is their only child baptised in Gt. Yarmouth.
There are some online trees for James and Lydia but none of the contributors have got this marriage certificate - without it, it's just a case of if's, but's and maybe's. With a name like Smith you need to be certain.
Annette
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Thanks for that advice Annette. What is the quickest way to get a copy of birth record from this era. Katlady
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Go to FreeBMD here http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
and check that this information is correct. (when ordering have to use the info as given even though it may be incorrect spelling of names as you know it)
Marriage
March 1/4 1838
Lydia Manthorp and James Smith Mutford &c vol 13 page 627
Order from GRO online here
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/default.asp
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Many thanks for that information, will get onto it and hope it gives me what I am looking for. Do you know exactly what sort of information will be included, and is there more than one option to buy, and if so what is the best one to buy.
Regards Katlady
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If you go to this page of the GRO site and scroll down the page it will tell you what you want to know. :)
https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/most_customers_want_to_know.asp
Ordering online you will get the full certificate, cost 9 pounds 25p. The full certificate is hat you need.
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Just an update,
Have ruled out 2 of the 3 James Smith's baptised in 1817.
James born to John and Phoebe doesnt match.
James born to James and Ann doesnt match.
So that leaves me with James born to James and Charlotte.
Hopefully when marriage certificate of James and Lydia arrives it will yield more information.
Katlady
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Hi,
I have an interest in this family too, and have recorded the results of my research at http://www.thosebefore.com/g0/p270.htm (http://www.thosebefore.com/g0/p270.htm). I am particularly strong on his son Walter Thomas Smith who came to Australia, and I have been lucky enough to have received good information from many other researchers.
However, I don't know anything about James (c1817-1900) m. Lydia Manthorpe. i see there was some interest in obtaining his marriage certificate - did someone actually obtain it? I'd be very interested in seeing what was on it, especially relating to his parents etc. and how it ties into the possible baptism certificates.
Thanks,