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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: merlinmagic on Friday 21 December 12 05:29 GMT (UK)
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I am wondering who owns copyright on old family photos. I have many, some taken in England before 1920 other taken in Australia, most before 1900. Many are originals, and they have been handed down by grandparents and parents. I can put them up on a website, what I want to know is can others copy them and display them on their webpages or website.
Suggestions on how to display without downloading or printing welcome please.
Merry Christmas to all have a safe one
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Basically you can't easily prevent someone that is determined to download a picture from website from doing so. You can watermark the picture, and there are some products that will track who has downloaded and used the picture but as I recall they are extremely expensive.
What I do is add some Javascript to the page to disable the right click
<SCRIPT LANGUAGE="JavaScript">
<!--
function click() {
if (event.button==2) {
alert('Copyright of Me');
}
}
document.onmousedown=click
// --></SCRIPT>
Hope this helps
Kevin
ps I forgot to mention that even with this script in place you can really stop someone with the knowledge of how to read the pages HTML.
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Please see the topic here about copyright for photographs:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,459330.0.html
However, this relates only to copies of the original photo (e.g. a scan that you want to post on Rootschat). Once you post a copy on a website, it is as Kevin has said...hard to stop anyone from nicking it. You could also add a copyright message of your own to your webpages to try to deter people.
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What I do is add some Javascript to the page to disable the right click
Kevin
Can the javascript be defeated, Kevin?
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Chinakey
Yes it can. I will PM you if you want to know how.
Kevin
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Hi
The issue of copyright of the photos may be a bit more complicated, I think that the photos taken in England would be governed by English copyright law and the photos taken in Australia by Australian law. In Australia copyright expires 70 years after the death of the photographer, and I believe that photos taken before 1st Jan 1955 are out of copyright. I think it means that just because you own an old photo that has been handed down that you don't own the copyright.
http://www.copyright.org.au/find-an-answer/ (http://www.copyright.org.au/find-an-answer/)
On the other hand if you have your own website then the material on that website would, I believe, be your copyright. Unfortunately many people think that anything on the internet is free to use. if others copying your material is of concern then it may be worth getting legal advice re copyright, and your options if someone does download, before posting your material.
One thing to keep in mind re family photos is that a number of 'originals' may have been printed off the negative so other branches could have the same photo.
I haven't tested it but the snipping tool on Windows Vista and Windows 7 enables you to capture what is on the screen so probably bypasses the disablement of the right click, a watermark might be the way to go.
Andy
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Thankyou very much for all your assistance and information. I do have a website which is locked, only those with a password to access can look at photos but they can also download them with the password. I will take all the replies I have thus far on board and think about what to do. It is a difficult to decide what to do as I have seen photos from supposedly safe sites copied and then displayed as their own on other site ( if that makes sense).
Please keep responding.
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If your photos were taken before the 1960s then there is NO copyright on them, per se.
Copyright on photos didn't exist before then.
The only copyright you can claim is the way you display them on your website.
But, as others have said, it is hard to stop people from downloading them, anyway.
Dawn M
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Of course asking this question opens a new can of worms ....... did you have the rights to post the photo in the first place ? ;D
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If your photos were taken before the 1960s then there is NO copyright on them, per se.
Copyright on photos didn't exist before then.
The only copyright you can claim is the way you display them on your website.
But, as others have said, it is hard to stop people from downloading them, anyway.
Dawn M
Take care ! Copyright laws vary from country to country ! :o
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If your photos were taken before the 1960s then there is NO copyright on them, per se.
Copyright on photos didn't exist before then.
The only copyright you can claim is the way you display them on your website.
But, as others have said, it is hard to stop people from downloading them, anyway.
Dawn M
Take care ! Copyright laws vary from country to country ! :o
Indeed, which is why I posted this earlier:
Please see the topic here about copyright for photographs:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,459330.0.html
However, this relates only to copies of the original photo (e.g. a scan that you want to post on Rootschat).
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With respect, copyright laws are not really that clear-cut - there's a lot of 'grey areas'. I haven't re-read the thread you linked to, but I clearly recall Guy Etchells reminding us all that a photo or scan of a document or image itself carries a copyright, if of course the person who did the scanning had the rights to photograph the item in the first place.
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I understand the complexity of copyright laws, but surely photo's of a certain age would not be covered, just as some music and books are now in the free domain. Unless of course someone has re-copyrighted them.
This situation has come up in recent times here in Australia. School photo's and the photo companies that take children's photo's in shopping malls now apparently cannot be copied, because the copyright belongs to the photographer. Even though they are photo's you have paid for, of your own children! Personally, that's one law I don't mind breaking, because I am not going to pay for more overpriced photo's.
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I guess it really depends on which side of the cash register you are!
If I were a professional photographer I would be pretty mad if I thought someone was scanning my work and therefore taking the cash out of my pocket for producing a copy of it. Of course if they didn't charge so much for them people wouldn't mind so much.
For family 'snaps' I am not sure I would even bother with a copyright. Who other than family members is going to care about 'stealing' a copy?
I always consider the internet much like a newspaper...never put anything on there that you don't want others to read or copy. :)
Just my two cents.
Kevin
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With respect, copyright laws are not really that clear-cut - there's a lot of 'grey areas'. I haven't re-read the thread you linked to, but I clearly recall Guy Etchells reminding us all that a photo or scan of a document or image itself carries a copyright, if of course the person who did the scanning had the rights to photograph the item in the first place.
Yes, that's right - the link has links to sites about Copyright of photographs/artistic works for various countries. Copyright of the original photograph (i.e. the right to make and distribute copies of it) and copyright of any copies (e.g. a copy of an old photo on a website) are two different things.
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Irrespective of what country you are in, photos taken 1920 and previous would - BEFORE 2005 - have run out of any copyright they might have held.
The photographer would surely be dead or at least past caring :P :P :P
Dawn M
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Take a look at what Rick Falkvinge had to say about copyright last August;
http://torrentfreak.com/get-ready-for-another-forty-years-of-corporate-copyright-bullshit-120826/
I am inclined to agree with his views ........ a lot of people would agree too methinks.
Joe
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I couldn't agree with that more ! The UK has the most draconian copyright laws in the western world. It's still illegal to make backup copies of a CD that you have purchased. If you've ever 'ripped' one of your own CDs to put it on your MP3 player, you have broken UK laws.
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Well this certainly is a strange one.
As a lot of us probably remember, who came from the era of expensive photography and developing and even more expensive studio pictures.
All the best pictures were sent overseas to cousins and aunts and uncles and friends, just to let them see our major events, and how well we could afford to dress the children, the nice holidays they had, the prizes they had won.
Personally I would like to see them returned to the original owner as often they just go out in the rubbish when someone dies or end up in second hand shops for strangers to buy.
Ever lent photo's to family members to copy? (believe you me they are like books never returned) especially if you tell them how precious they are to you.
But I am sure if I saw a picture of a greatgreat ancestor on line I would feel they belonged to me in the same way as the owner obviously does and I would want a copy. Perhaps a link from their site to yours might be the answer, then you could share all the family information not just keep it to yourself, after all that's what families are suppose to be all about caring and sharing.
I have often noticed in newspaper reports in times of fire and flood what was the most important thing lost family photo's even people rushing back into burning buildings to try and save them. I just hope other family members rallied around to help replace them.
I think this is just an area where people would have varying views according to their own experience and there is no right or wrong answer.
Cheers H
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Well put, Heather.
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You could always put them on Facebook, as they seem to claim exclusive copyright to anything on there. ;D
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Copyright issues seem to be popping up quite regularly, especially lately.
Not exactly sure where this is from but it seems quite clear.
"Prior to 1 August 1989, the copyright in photographs, portraits and engravings (and only those types of work) which were created as a result of a commission were owned by the commissioner and NOT the creator"
If someone, way back when, asked for a photo be taken, and paid for it, they were commissioning it, and were therefore the copyright owner.
Following that, this can be found on ipo-gov.
Do I need to register copyright?
No - copyright protection in the UK is automatic, so there is no registration
system, there are no forms to fill in, and no fees to pay.
Can copyright be transferred to someone else?
Yes - copyright is a form of intellectual property and, like physical property,
it can be bought and sold, inherited or otherwise transferred. It is also
possible to transfer only some of the rights you are entitled to. Anyone who
is a copyright owner can choose to license others to use their work
Those words I expect are copyright of HMGov. I borrowed to illustrate only.