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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Sussex => England => Sussex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: toni* on Friday 07 December 12 13:30 GMT (UK)

Title: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Friday 07 December 12 13:30 GMT (UK)
 Quickie for you :

1841 Census I have Mary Stevens (aged 41) nee Waters at Three Cups Warbleton
She is with her daughter Naomi aged 9
And Joshua Stevens aged 10 months I do not know who Joshua is
HO107;  1108; : 4; : 20;  6;


For information:
Mary Waters married Samuel Stevens on 19 Aug 1815 at Warbleton
Sometimes Stevens is written as Stephens

They had children:
Mathew 1816-1901 (marries Jane Watson has children from 1849)
Faith 1817 (no further details known)
Mary Ann 1819 (ditto)
Matilda  1821-1882 (marries Thomas Mitchell in 1839)
James 1823 (no further details known)
Selina 1825 (has an illegitimate child Frank in 1851 and then marries Charles Howell and has more children from 1852)
George 1826 (no further details known)
Sophia 1828 (ditto)
Samuel 1830 (ditto)
Naomi 1832 (ditto)

I know I am missing a lot of detail but I have only just begun to follow up this line completely, I descend from Matilda

I am assuming that Joshua is the child of either Selina, James, Matilda, Mary Ann, Faith or Mathew but I just can’t seem to fit him in anywhere.


Can you help please ?
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Sharon01 on Friday 07 December 12 13:34 GMT (UK)
Hi,

Family Search has a baptism of a Joshua Stevens on 25.12.1840. Warbleton, Sussex. Mother Mary Stevens.

Sharon
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Roy G on Friday 07 December 12 14:10 GMT (UK)
Sussex Family History Group also has that most likely baptism (Christmas day 1840), but they also have another in 1838 to the widow Marrianne (Mary Anne?) Stevens. 
To confuse matters further, neither Joshua seems to have an entry on FreeBMD, so it is possible that the Mary's baby was officially registered just as a male child or under the father's surname.
Roy G
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Friday 07 December 12 21:52 GMT (UK)
thanks for your help  :) i see the 1838 baptisim is to a widow Marianne whilst this could be Mary Ann (b.1819)  she would not be a Stevens if she was a widow ?
unless  it is of course to Mary nee Waters although i have only ever seen her transcribed as May and not Mary Ann / Marianne etc. this is by no means conclusive i shall have to try (harder)  and track him on later census. The 1840 baptisim looks more likely considering his age in June 1841 i.e. at the time of the census he was given as 10 months so possibly born around September 1840 ? again with the mother being given as Mary this could be Mary nee Waters or Mary Ann b. 1819
i had not considered before that Joshua may belong to Mary nee Waters but it is not impossible.
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Sunday 09 December 12 20:02 GMT (UK)
not having any luck locating Joshua in later census can someone look to see if they can find a burial please

 i also need to find a burial for Samuel Stevens senior i would assume after 1831 as Naomi was born in 1832
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Roy G on Sunday 09 December 12 20:18 GMT (UK)
There is a probable marriage in the Hailsham district for Joshua Stevens in 1863.    Although the family seems to have been broken up by 1841, it does seem to tie in with sightings in Hailsham/Hellingly on both the 1841 and 1861 censuses.  In the latter however, Joshua Stevens gives Heathfield as a birthplace and appears to be living with Reuban & Sophia rather than a Mary.  The Reuban & Sophia combination of Hellingly appear in close proximity on all three censuses, so could there have been a connection between that couple and Mary?     Roy G
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Monday 10 December 12 11:57 GMT (UK)
thank you i shall look into that

 :)
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Monday 10 December 12 21:36 GMT (UK)
name:   Sam Stephens
gender:   Male
baptism/christening date:   09 May 1791
baptism/christening place:   WARBLETON,SUSSEX,ENGLAND   
father's name:   James Stephens   
mother's name:   Ann

MARY WATERS   
Family
    Marriage:    
19 AUG 1815     Warbleton, Sussex, England

samuels siblings christened warbleton
sarah 19 aug 1791
fanny 25 July 1794
Sophia 09 Jun 1793
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Monday 10 December 12 21:38 GMT (UK)
Name:   Reuben Stevens
Spouse's Name:   Sophia Shorter
Marriage Date:   1 Jun 1825
Marriage Place:   Warbleton, Sussex, England
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Monday 10 December 12 21:43 GMT (UK)
1851 for Reuben & Sophia
 HO107;  1638;  364;  17 - Warbleton

Reuben Stevens   50 b. Etchingham
Sophia Stevens   70 b. Warbleton
Elizabeth Stevens   13 niece b. Jevington
George Pankhurst   25 servant (ag lab) b. HEathfield

not sure i am going down the right path here


1861 - still Warbleton
Reuben Stevens   60 b. Etchingham
Sophia Stevens   61 b. Warbleton
Elizabeth Stevens   23 niece b. Willingdon
Reuben Sweetman   13 nephew b. Warbleton
 RG 9 569; 118;  11;
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Roy G on Tuesday 11 December 12 08:19 GMT (UK)
Hi Toni.  Re the right path. 
Unfortunately I do not subscribe to those websites that ask for large subscription fees, so my access to census info is more via indexes to them than the censuses themselves.  I had picked up that Reuban & Sophia Stevens always seemed to be sequential entries with Mary's family, suggesting they may have either been living together or in close proximity with them.   Your findings on the 51 & 61 census above tell us they were certainly not living under the same roof, but do seem to have a liking for permanently accommodating displaced members of the family, so perhaps are still worthy of consideration.

As for the elusive Joshua Stevens of Hailsham, the LDS Copy of the 1871 census is a little flexible with his age, but lists him and his wife Mary Ann Stevens, and children: Flora Eunice Stevens 1864 and​ Joshua Chas Stevens 1868.  He is still in the same location in 1881 (a further year of flexibility with his age), and appears as a widowed pork butcher, having seven children to care for.   Mary Ann died Hailsham district 1880 (Freebmd)

It might be worth your while to find or purchase a copy of his marriage cert to see who he lists his father as, and who were the witnesses.
His marriage was in the Hailsham district, Sept quarter 1863, ref 2b 101,  Joshua Stevens to Mary Ann Paine.

LONGSHOT
Given the fact that FreeBMD has no Joshua Stevens - Stephens born Sussex 10 months before the 1841 census, a longshot is a Freebmd first name search for a Joshua (no surname) born in the Hailsham district about that time.  Only one name turns up, a Joshua Billins, birth registered in the Hailsham district in the June quarter of 1840.  Could this be your Joshua's birth registered under the surname of a father who was not married to his mother?  The 1841 census shows only 3 people with the Billins surname in Sussex, all of them living in Hailsham, and none a Joshua.  Two were husband and wife, born in the 1780s, and the other a William Billins born 1821.  Unfortunately there were also a number of people in Hailsham whose surname was Billiness but again there is no Joshua amongst them.  So there certainly was a Joshua Billins or Billiness born about 10 months before the 1841 census who that census has no record of.  The question you have to ask yourself is, could Joshua Billins have been the 10 month old son living with a 40 year old Mary Stevens who either was, or purported to be, his mother?

Roy G 
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Tuesday 11 December 12 21:19 GMT (UK)
thank you for your thoughts Roy that is certainly something to consider.  :)
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Tuesday 11 December 12 21:45 GMT (UK)
There's a Joshua Stevens in Heathfield on 1861 - "son in law"  of James Luck (55) and Mary (40). Guessing this is as in step son, given he is unmarried.  Need to find a marriage but wonder if this is Mary the daughter
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Tuesday 11 December 12 21:49 GMT (UK)
Have found the family in 1851, ref HO107/ 1638/ 393/ 7 - transcribed as Lucks

James is a beer house keeper with Mary Ann, who Ancestry have as 50 but probably 30? Joshua is listed as a Lucks, aged 10. Also with them is a Naomi, aged 19
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Tuesday 11 December 12 22:05 GMT (UK)
Hmm - Mary is again older than James on 1871 (aged 76) so my theory may not be that strong. UNless  she's Mary senior?? If her age is rounded down on 1841, it's possible.


Looking again, on 1861 there's a James Mitchell, 12 yr old grandson with James & Mary Luck - checking back it's quite possible he's Matilda's son and Mrs Luck is mary senior.


I haven't seen a marriage - but it does raise the question is Joshua the son of James Luck?
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Mabel Bagshawe on Tuesday 11 December 12 22:34 GMT (UK)
Looking at the other options suggested - I can see a Joshua Billings aged 1 in Warbleton on 1841 and 11 on 1851, son of John and Hannah

Joshua Billings
Christening Date  29 Mar 1840
Christening Place  Warbleton, Sussex, England
Father  John Billings
Mother  Hannah
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: Roy G on Wednesday 12 December 12 03:26 GMT (UK)
The further alternative spelling of Billins = Billings and a Joshua Billings of about the right age turning up in both Baptisms and census, certainly kills off my theory.   Pity, I thought we may have cracked it.    Roy G
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Wednesday 12 December 12 11:26 GMT (UK)
thats brilliant thanks for your work x
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Wednesday 12 December 12 11:27 GMT (UK)
I wonder if Joshua could have been registered under male Stevens / Stephens
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: sue9 on Wednesday 12 December 12 19:55 GMT (UK)
Hi Toni

Just looked at Anc******
Under male Steven born 1840 Warbleton - none
then I entered
Joshua born 1840 warbleton
and Yes -   Joshua no surname
Male
25 Dec 1840
Warbleton
mother - Mary Stevens

You take care on the ice
best wishes
Sue
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: sue9 on Wednesday 12 December 12 20:29 GMT (UK)
Hi Toni

Just checked marriage for a James Luck
and there is one
marriage Jan-Feb-Mar 1841 Tonbridge, Kent
and on the same page is a Mary Stevens.
Is this part of our/your Punnett line! :)


Best wishes
Sue
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: toni* on Thursday 13 December 12 10:07 GMT (UK)
Hi Sue,

Thanks for looking i didnt get a chance to yesterday.

Yes it is part of the Punnett Line.

Herbert Samuel married Ann Matilda Mitchell, Ann parents were Thomas Mitchell and Matilda nee Stevens / Stephens Matildas parents are Sam Stevens / Stephens and Mary nee Waters.

Ice all gone today - have you moved yet ?

Toni  :)
Title: Re: Joshua Stevens / Stephens 1840
Post by: helenp48 on Sunday 16 February 14 15:26 GMT (UK)
hello Toni, I'm Helen, I have just registered as found this site by chance whilst looking up some family history. I realise yours is an old posting from 2012 so I'm hoping you are still looking for your ancestors. I have quite a bit of Stevens history already, you say your direct line is from Matilda Stevens, mine is from Matthew her brother, who is my great grandfather. Are you still searching for info. I have looked up most of Matthew's siblings with some success, also his father and grandfather. Do hope to get a reply as still needing help.