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General => Armed Forces => Topic started by: kinsey on Tuesday 23 October 12 02:28 BST (UK)

Title: Help with Headstone - Completed with Thanks
Post by: kinsey on Tuesday 23 October 12 02:28 BST (UK)
Hi All

Not sure if this is the right page for this post but the photo is of my Great Grandfather standing next to a headstone he worked on in Cheltenham. I'm trying to work out what is on the top of the headstone. It looks to me as if it could be for a regiment (but I could be completely wrong  :P).
Any help would be most appreciated.

Kinsey
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Ruskie on Tuesday 23 October 12 05:37 BST (UK)
Kinsey, I'm not sure if this question ighty be better on the military board if it is an insignia of some sort (however I suppose it is possible that it's not be a military one). Or maybe it should be on the deciphering board in case the inscription can be enhanced enough to be read, and more detail brought out in the symbol.

Maybe a moderator will be able to make a decision about this.  :)
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Wiggy on Tuesday 23 October 12 06:23 BST (UK)
Certainly looks like a military insignia - cropped, enlarged and I tried to sharpen - without much success - but more enlarging just makes it more indistinct.

Like Ruskie, I also suggest linking this to military - and maybe scanning again at high resolution for easier enlarging to decipher what is said - I think we might be able to read some of the engraving if it were scanned in colour mode and at higher resolution.

Wiggy    :)
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Tuesday 23 October 12 12:09 BST (UK)
This is just a scanned photo sent to me so not sure how to enhance  :-[ but will see what I can do  :) I also don't think there is any inscription on the stone only the insignia from what I can see.

Thanks, Kinsey

Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Ruskie on Tuesday 23 October 12 12:22 BST (UK)
I may be imagining it, but I think I can see 'impressions' of letters on the stone.

I'm not sure if it is possible to get a better scan, but it may help if you are able to ask the person who supplied you with the photograph, to give it a try.
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Tuesday 23 October 12 12:25 BST (UK)
I may be imagining it, but I think I can see 'impressions' of letters on the stone.

I'm not sure if it is possible to get a better scan, but it may help if you are able to ask the person who supplied you with the photograph, to give it a try.

Thanks Ruskie I'll ask if they can scan a better copy  ;D

Kinsey
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Wiggy on Tuesday 23 October 12 21:32 BST (UK)
I'm pretty sure there is quite a bit of lettering on it - just couldn't get it clear enough - well worth asking the person who sent it to you for a better scan!

Wiggy   ;)
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Ruskie on Wednesday 24 October 12 01:19 BST (UK)
I still think the Armed Forces experts may be able to ID the insignia.

Can you work out by the age of your gr grandfather, the approximate year the photo may have been taken (this might narrow down the possible war the deceased served in). (But he may not have died in service so scrap that idea.  :-[)
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Wednesday 24 October 12 12:03 BST (UK)
My Stepfather tried to rescan the photo at 1200 dpi and then played with contrast, brightness and gamma but still was not able to make out the inscription is on the headstone. At the very bottom of the "grave" is the word TENEBRAS. This probable refers to the latin Post Tenebras Lux. Translates as "Light after Darkness". Probably appropriate for a grave.
I'm also unsure of his age but it is well after WW1 as he was living in Glamorgan till around 1928.
Sorry couldn't get any more info.
Also would a moderator move this post or do I do it and if so how  :P ?

Kinsey
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Ruskie on Thursday 25 October 12 00:52 BST (UK)
Is the insignia any clearer on the new scan?

I will ask a moderator to move this for you
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Thursday 25 October 12 03:29 BST (UK)
Is the insignia any clearer on the new scan?

 :-[ good question Ruskie, he never sent me the new scan  ;D
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: forester on Thursday 25 October 12 22:55 BST (UK)
It looks very much like the Order of St Michael and St George.

Phil
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Friday 26 October 12 00:30 BST (UK)
Thanks Phil, now all I have to do is try and find who it was made for  :P

Kinsey
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: codge01 on Friday 26 October 12 20:25 BST (UK)
Im not enitrely convinced that it is military, especially given its age, I may be wrong but I thought most military headstones were of a standard shape and from portland stone. I would plump more for civil award or even a society badge, just seems too ornate an headstone for military.

I may be totally wrong.

Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: Wiggy on Friday 26 October 12 21:27 BST (UK)
I reminds me of the grand order of St John badge which my uncle, a knight of the order, had on his knights cape.

But I think it has too many points on the star.  Like it though!    Google and see what you think - (the St John of the Ambulance)

Wiggy 
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: John915 on Saturday 27 October 12 01:11 BST (UK)
Good morning,

Phil is on the button with this one, Order of St Michael and St George. St Johns only has 4 arms on the cross.

John915
Title: Re: Help with Headstone
Post by: kinsey on Monday 29 October 12 12:13 GMT (UK)
Good morning,

Phil is on the button with this one, Order of St Michael and St George. St Johns only has 4 arms on the cross.

John915

I agree  ;D. Thanks again to everyone who has helped.

Kinsey