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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Canada Lookup Request => Topic started by: lululisa on Monday 06 August 12 20:00 BST (UK)
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I'm hoping that someone will be able to clear up the confusion surrounding my Great grandmother's maiden name. Her name is either Lizzie Wright or Lizzie MacDougal. According to my grandfather's birth certificate, she was born in Glasgow, Scotland and her maiden name was MacDougal. My grandparents' marriage certificate also says that her maiden name was MacDougall (2 Ls). However, according to Manitoba Vital Statistics, her maiden name at the time of her marriage, to my Gr. Grandfather Ralph Vipond, was Wright.
Here's the link: http://vitalstats.gov.mb.ca/DetailView.php
So, I'm not sure what to make of all this.
I've considered the fact that she may have been married before she married Ralph and that "Wright" might be her married name.
Also, here's more background information: She came to Canada with her sister Maggie. Maggie married a William Morgan (http://vitalstats.gov.mb.ca/DetailView.php).
Both Lizzie and Maggie came here to work as domestic servants. I believe they immigrated to Canada not long before Lizzie married Ralph.
Any help or suggestions about where to turn next would be greatly appreciated.
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Have you ordered the actual marriage cert to see what info it may have about her parents? As you can see from the detail view, there are spaces to enter parents' names in the record. No guarantees, of course, but the certs are not expensive and could help to clarify things for you.
Have you looked for a Wright death in the area prior to the marriage?
PB
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I haven't ordered the marriage certificates yet. I guess I should do that. I hadn't thought of trying to search for a "Wright" death, but I will. Thanks for the suggestion.
The one thing that I'm still confused about is that both Lizzie's and Maggie's surname at the time of their marriages was "Wright". Is there any other reason that they would change their surname from MacDougall to Wright, other than marriage?
Thanks!
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Well, they could have been born Wright, say, then their mother married a man called McDougall (or the other way round) and they also were known by their step-father's surname. Or their parents may have been unmarried, so the girls were registered in their mother's name but knew their father and also used his name.
If you know Maggie and Lizzie's approx date of birth, you may be able to find them on Scotlands People, both under either Wright or McDougal(l). I shouldn't worry about the exact spelling, many more people were unable to read and write in 19th century, so would just say their name and not know or check the spelling.
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Hi again,
Your links wouldn't open for me and the Manitoba Vital Stats website isn't working at the moment so I didn't realize the ladies both married as Wright. Under these circumstances, I would echo the comments of alpinecottage, in addition to obtaining the cert(s).
PB
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Yes, the MB Vital Stats site is finicky.
I'm getting frustrated as I have tried to find info on Lizzie before to no avail. I will order the marriage cert. and get back to everyone. In the meantime, if there are any other hints or advice anyone can give me, that would be great. Thanks again! :D
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Just another thought because of something I came across on my own family tree. Both women may have given their own mothers maiden name, so it may be worth checking out if their own mother was Wright before marraige. Some people misunderstood the question 'maiden name' and gave the maiden name of their mother, not their own maiden name..
I came across this on a baptismal certificate, where the grandmothers surname was recorded instead of the mothers surname.
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LucyBella,
Thanks for the hint. Someone pointed me to a 1916 Manitoba census record that has Lizzie's year of immigration as 1907. So I am going to search through the passenger lists to try and find her and her sister Maggie. Hopefully I will find more information on her.
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Hi again.
In case you didn't notice ...
The 1916 census image posted on the other thread (edit - oops, posted this in the wrong thread) has a Maggie Morgan age 22 b. Scotland as a lodger in the next household to the Viponds. She has a year if immigration of 1913. She is listed as married but William isn't with her. Perhaps away working? I believe if he was in the CEF he would still be recorded in the household with an indication that he was in the services (there are other examples of this on the same page; there was a special column to record same).
PB
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Hi again.
In case you didn't notice ...
The 1916 census image posted on the other thread (edit - oops, posted this in the wrong thread) has a Maggie Morgan age 22 b. Scotland as a lodger in the next household to the Viponds. She has a year if immigration of 1913. She is listed as married but William isn't with her. Perhaps away working? I believe if he was in the CEF he would still be recorded in the household with an indication that he was in the services (there are other examples of this on the same page; there was a special column to record same).
PB
polarbear,
Thank you for pointing that out.
I know that Maggie and Lizzie came to Canada together, so the differing immigration dates are confusing. Not sure whaere to go from here. Any suggestions?
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Differing dates often turn up in the records so you may still find them together. If Lizzie is 23 in 1916, a 1907 voyage would mean she was only about 14 and that doesn't seem to make sense?
I think your best plan of action at the moment would be to order at least the Vipond marriage cert and see what it says. Do you know who Lizzie and Maggie's parents are, BTW?
PB
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Differing dates often turn up in the records so you may still find them together. If Lizzie is 23 in 1916, a 1907 voyage would mean she was only about 14 and that doesn't seem to make sense?
I think your best plan of action at the moment would be to order at least the Vipond marriage cert and see what it says. Do you know who Lizzie and Maggie's parents are, BTW?
PB
Polarbear,
No, I do not know who their parents are. I am going to order their marriage certificates tomorrow. I will let you know what I find out! I just wish that the information recorded on census records was accurate!!
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Unfortunately, immigration info on censuses does seem to be rather hit and miss in general.
Hopefully, the certs will have some good parental info that you can use to trace the girls in Scotland. It sure seems strange that they would both put Wright as names. Any births of children Maggie had w/b protected by privacy laws but it would certainly be interesting to know what she put as mmn for any she had.
When you are looking at passenger lists you might want to look for an Elizabeth and Margaret as well, assuming these w/b their full names. And variations on the spelling of McDougall, such as one l or MacD. I don't think Wright gets changed a lot so that spelling s/b OK.
PB
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Unfortunately, immigration info on censuses does seem to be rather hit and miss in general.
Hopefully, the certs will have some good parental info that you can use to trace the girls in Scotland. It sure seems strange that they would both put Wright as names. Any births of children Maggie had w/b protected by privacy laws but it would certainly be interesting to know what she put as mmn for any she had.
When you are looking at passenger lists you might want to look for an Elizabeth and Margaret as well, assuming these w/b their full names. And variations on the spelling of McDougall, such as one l or MacD. I don't think Wright gets changed a lot so that spelling s/b OK.
PB
Polarbear,
Thanks again for the hints/advice. I have been doing ancestral research for a while now, but Lizzie's family has always stumped me. I think part of why I haven't purchased the marriage certificate is because I'm afraid I will be disappointed once again. A little silly on my part, I know. No more procrastination!
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Here is a photo of Lizzie.
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What a lovely picture! Thank you for sharing it.
I might start with ordering only one of the certs and see what it says before ordering the 2nd. You may be lucky enough to get what you need from the one; if not, then you could opt for the other one.
I'll let you know if I can think of anything else.
PB
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What a lovely picture! Thank you for sharing it.
I might start with ordering only one of the certs and see what it says before ordering the 2nd. You may be lucky enough to get what you need from the one; if not, then you could opt for the other one.
I'll let you know if I can think of anything else.
PB
You are right, I'm sure only one certificate is required. Thanks for the help. I appreciate it. I will let you know what I find out.
Lisa
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You have a request for passenger information but I will post it on this thread to try and keep all the information together.
you can look for passenger lists at
www.ancestorsonboard.com
I did have a quick look but didn't find anything that would definitely be your Lizzie or Maggie.
http://automatedgenealogy.com
I went to this site to see if I could find either Lizzie or Maggie on the 1911 census to see if I could confirm their arrivial in 1907 and I couldn't find them in Manitoba. I also couldn't find the husband of Maggie under Soldiers of the First World War. I checked the attestation papers at Library and Archives Canada.
Ralph Vipond was previously married to a Bella Harrison and they had two children. The oldest child shows up on the 1916 census.
I also checked the Home Children site at LAC to see if it was possible that the two sisters arrived under that program but again no luck.
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valeriec,
Thank you for trying. Someone was able to find a Lizzie and Margaret Wright arriving in1913. They were recorded as domestics headed for Winnipeg. She must not have known my great grandfather for very long before they married. (she arrived in June and they married in August) Do you think it is possible that she came here to work for him as a domestic/nanny? His first wife died in 1912 leaving 2 small children to care for. Do you know of any way I could find out if she did come to work for him? Maybe a newspaper classified ad? I guess that would be pretty difficult to find.
Anyway, thank you for the help and suggestions. It is greatly appreciated!