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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: carolosunny on Wednesday 25 July 12 21:35 BST (UK)
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Ive been researching my family tree for 18 months now...I applied to the GRO for a birth certificate and a death certificate for my Grandfather William Henry Downing (Hulme)..I need the birth certificate so I can contact the army so they can give me details of his service in the hope that there might be a photograph as no one in the family knows what he looked like. They sent me a copy of his death certificate but couldn't give me a birth certificate as they said there was too many William Henry Downings born around the same time and couldn't be certain which was my Grandfather. No one in the family knows his birthday so I'm really stuck :( Has anybody got any ideas of where I can go from here please? Thanxs XXX
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hi
unless the rules have changed to get his service records you should only need a death cert , who told you you needed a birth cert as well , i take it you have downloaded the forms from the veterans site www.veterans-uk.info/ .
regards
trevor
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Can you include details of his birthyear - how old was he on his death cert and what year did he die
If he was born in or after the September qtr 1911 - his mothers maiden name will be shown against the entry on freebmd
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If you know nothing about your grandfather or his parents, you really need his marriage certificate to your grandmother (assuming there is one). This will give his father's name and help you track his birth certificate.
Alexander
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It would be great if I only need a death certificate :) On his death certificate it says he died 1st January 1958 aged 62 years xx
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He was married 3 times and I have copies of 2 of the marriage certificates....his Father was also called William Henry Downing ;)
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What was his father's occupation on the two marriage certificates?
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So a birthyear of around 1895. You say (Hulme) in your opening post. is that where you know for certain he was born or is it where he lived after his marriage
What about any siblings - do you know their names? There are 2 censuses he could appear on - 1901 and 1911 so if you have any info re: siblings - let us know as it may lead to getting his parents names
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A likely candidate for his parents is this marriage
Marriages December qtr 1891
William Henry Downing Chorlton 8c 1079
Emily Mellor
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I agree, Carole, this is probably him in 1901:
1901 census: 3 Dearden St, Hulme
William DOWNING, Head, M, 30, House Painter, Lancs Manchester
Emily DOWNING, Wife, M, 29
Mary J. DOWNING, Daur, S, 11
Emily DOWNING, Daur, S, 9
William DOWNING, Son, S, 6
Harriet DOWNING, Daur, S, 8
Benjamin DOWNING, Son, S, 4
James DOWNING, Son, S, 1
Zachariah MELLOR, F in Law, M, 57, Shoemaker, Lancs Blackburn
Mary Ann MELLOR, M in Law, M, 49, Lancs Manchester
All children born Manchester
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1901 for 3 Dearden St Hulme - all b Manchester except Z Mellor
William Downing 30 house painter
Emily 29
Mary J 11
Emily 9
William 6
Harriet 8
Benjamin 4
James 1
Zachariah Mellor 57 father in law b Blackburn
Mary Ann Mellor 49 mother in law
RG13 Piece 3705 Folio 108 Page 41.
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2 possible births on FreeBMD:
Births Mar qtr. 1896
DOWNING, William Henry, Chorlton, 8c/879
Births Jun qtr. 1896
DOWNING, William Henry, Chorlton, 8c/908
Both births are on Lancashire BMD (http://www.lancashirebmd.org.uk/cgi/birthind.cgi), but one has Sub-District of Chorlton and the other Sub-Distict Hulme. Your William is probably the latter. If I were you I would order the birth certificate through Lancashire BMD.
Direct link - http://www.rootschat.com/links/0p2k/
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his 1st marriage to Edith Wallace was in 1915 and his father was a chain maker but due to other information on the certificate this might not be true...his 2nd marriage was 1935 to Mary Price and his Father was dead by then his occupation was a labourer then he married Agnes McDougall in 1946 and his Father was deceased and occupation was a chain maker (driving chain makers) ...I know my Grandfather had a Sister called Emily and brothers James and Fredrick but there were more siblings XX
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This is probably the other William Henry Downing as Stretford also came under Chorlton
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMRQ-VT5
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The 1901 is the correct family from what you say about siblings
Manipulation of the free 1911 index shows a Frederick Downing aged 10 in the same household as William & Emily
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wow thank you all so much :) I will order the 2nd William Downing certificate and get in touch with the army :)))) it would be so nice if there is a photograph of him somewhere :)))) XXX
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Ive ordered the birth certificate :D now onto the army!!! THANKS again EVERYONE XXXXX
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his 1st marriage to Edith Wallace was in 1915 and his father was a chain maker
Possibly a chair maker?
See here:
http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/Manchester/Hulme/stmark/index.html
Nell
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I have sent you a pm re: fathers occ as details cannot be posted here. I can confirm that we have definitely got the right family
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Hi
When was he in the army? If he married or had children whilst in the army then one of the certificates would hopefully have his regiment and number. That information, along with proof of death, is usually sufficient.
Andy
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Hi
I have a print out of the marriage certificate between William and Edith and I thought it said chair maker(the writing is hard to read) but on an actual copy of the certificate between him and Agnes McDougall it does clearly state chain maker so I presumed that it was the same occupation...there was a very big factory in Hulme during that time making chains so it all seemed to make sense. William and Edith had 11 children sadly 5 died in infancy. They were all seperated as children going to family members and Styal..the last surviving child died in March this year and that was James :'( This was the whole point in my search of William Henry to try and get a photograph to show James. Edith died in child birth when James was 1 years old so he didn't know his Mother and again there were no photographs...he was led to believe that his mother died during his birth but I was able to prove that she didn't and just that small piece of information gave him a great sense of relief. James was my Father in Law and was a wonderful man and I really did try to get a photograph of his Father before he died and I admit that I was deeply upset that I didn't but I am more determined now to find out as much as I can in memory of James :)