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General => Armed Forces => World War Two => Topic started by: stockton on Wednesday 13 June 12 19:55 BST (UK)
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:) Hi, are thier any International Brigade historians out there who can help me, for 3 years i have been trying to prove my grandfather joined the International Brigade and fought in the Spanish civil war,
I now believe he could have been rejected on health grounds because of wounds received on the Somme battle field 1st July 1916 { K.O.S.B 1912-18 } some men got as far as Dover, some even got to France and Spain before being rejected, iv'e been told by the IBMT that the list of names of those rejected are stored in the National Archive, has any one made a study of these men's names, has any one else had a family ancestor connected to the International Brigade who volunteered but rejected on health grounds.
A big ask i know but can any one help me solve the mystery of my grandad Robert Casey,
3 Casey's are listed in the Brigade, one of them was my relative he was Francis Casey from Glasgow, other two not related as far as i know, my late father a merchant navy veteran swore blind his father { my grandad } did join but its possible that grandad Robert was away from home travelling, got rejected then had to travell back home, after so long it would be nice to prove one way or the other, all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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hi derek
go to www.nationalarchives.gov.uk>documentsonline, or do a google search for international brigade as it gives a more direct link to tna section on the int brigade records apparently volunteer records are searchable online
regards
trevor
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:) Hi Trevor, thanks for reply, unfortunitly i dont have membership to Ancestry, would it be possible for some one who has access to ancestry to have a look and give me a file number if the docoment are on line.
Just the file number as a friend of mine is a memeber of ancestry but like me not to clever navigating around some sites and any file number would be of great help.
Its been 3 years now since i set out to prove my grandfather Robert volunteered for the International Brigade, i think this is the last chance i may have to find his name, as iv'e said he was badly wounded on the Somme battlefield 1st July 1916, these wound i believe would have been the cause for him being rejected.
My grandad was Robert Casey, 127 Swainby rd, Stockton on Tees. Co Durham, if the National Brigade
{ Spanish Civil War 1936-39 } names for health ground rejects are on line could some one kindly give me a file number, all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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derek
did you look at the national archives site only it seems to me you can find info directly from that , and are you saying that ancestry has these records as well ?!! [ i,m getting confused and it don,t take much these days ::) ]
regards
trevor
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??? Trevor you and me both ::)
I thought you had to be a member of Ancestry.co.uk to view files from National Archives
{ those on line that is }
I have over tha last 3 years been in regular touch with International Brigades Memorial Trust
and Karl Marx library London ;)
They have { both } names of men who went to Spain { Volunteers for Brigade } but not all men who volunteered are named.
My grandad Robert Casey is not on any list but!! its possible he is named on medical rejects for reasons i have stated.
This list as i ve' been told by IBMT and others are kept in the National Archives Kew, i have no way of viewing these files if they are on line as you have to be a memeber of Ancestry.co.uk { ??? i think }
If the medical rejects are on line to view would it be possible for some one to give me file number.
Hope this explains Trevor { coz its the best i can do ??? } hope some one can help my late father a merchant navy veteran WW11 a man of few words swore blind his dad { my grandad } did volunteer for the International Brigade and i would like to prove him right if possible, one important thing, thier are 3 Casey volunteeres named, only one of them is related to me, he was Francis Casey from Glasgow.
Any help would be greatly appreciated, all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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derek
you would only have to go through ancestry or other co,s such as bright solid who own find my past if they have exclusive copy right to show any records and i never saw anything to say that ancestry have that copyright to those records , now i know sometimes it isn,t easy to negotiate tna site believe me i,ve tried and failed but i,m sure someone else will be able too the usual thing with tna is that they do charge a small fee to dowmload a record which in the case of naval service records from ww1 cost £3.50 it,s all too do with the upkeep and such which is cheap i feel for something no one else has access too , go back to the tna site and have a read up on what records are available and the spectrum of the international brigade files there .
regards
trevor
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:) Will try Trevor but not that clever with computers thats why i asked for help, of course any fee would be worth while but not to sure how to go about it all ???
Any way see what happens ???
Thanks Trevor :) :D ;)
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:) Hi all, iv'e tried looking looking for Spanish Civil War Medical Rejects on National Archives but cant find any thing at all on Medical records on men rejected, please could i ask some one with more computer knowledge than me to take a look, just to see if records are on line to veiw and any file number ???
Hope some one out there can help, all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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:) Hi, the International Brigade had a recruitment office in London, from there volunteers would go to Dover land in France then travel onto Spain, although some men were medically rejected there and then some men did get to Dover/France/Spain before being rejected, its these files i'm trying to find out if they exist and are in the National Archives, if they do would it be possible for some one to give me thier file number, thanks Derek :) :D ;)
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I never tire of hearing the stories of those who chose to fight for a better life for all.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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whato derek
well in fear and trepidation i,ve just gone into the national archives [ i don,t know how to navigate through it either that,s why i told you too ;D ;D ] and came out unscathed and with just a little bit more knowledge that may help you try this do a google search put in international brigade national archives on results page should be 2 links to tna click on the one that,s got a heading spanish civil war , british volunteers list then on that page scroll down to other records click on fo889/1-3 this page gives you evacuation of british subjects and signatures of those wishing to stay in spain 1936 if you click on that heading it takes you to ordering or viewing options , now comes the nasty bit as it either means filling in online forms or you can order in advance the documents to be ready for you if you are in a position to got to kew to view them yourself or you would need a researcher to do it [ and cost involved ] for you , the above section on civilians in spain is a foreign office directive also it seems that some docs in tna are from mi5 docs as well [ spies get every where ]
i,ve no idea if any of the above helps but i,m at a loss as too what to offer in way of help for you .
regards
trevor
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:) Thanks Trevor, ??? i'm light years behind you but will give it a go.
I was told recently the thier was a Recruitment office in London that kept files on medical rejects, would any one know where this building was located in London, i have also contacted the TUC they did at one time have files on the International Brigade, also contacted the Karl Marx library in London, i'm hoping thier are some International Brigade historians out there who could help with medical files with names of the men rejected, i did say some men got as far as France and into Spain its self before being rejected, i'm sure thier names would have been recorded, any help to end this long search on my grandad Robert Casey would be greatly appreciated.
At the end of the day i may never find my grandads name connected to the International Brigade,
but its ok!! my late father told me its true and his words are set in " Stone " :) :D ;)
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hi derek
go on be a devil dive in both feet ;D ;D, as to your last comment regarding your dad if he was anything like my old POP a little bit of embroidery didn,t go amiss either ;D ;D , but do we love em course we do .
regards
trevor
ps will have a google for this recruitment office caper as well
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:) Hi Trevor, no my late father was one of the most stright forward up n down blokes you could meet,
it wasn't untill middle 90s i started to learn about his merchant navy days WW11, now have all his records including seaman's pouch, one convoy ONS 5 1943 his merchant ship torpedoed, he was picked up by flower class corvette Loosestrife, sailed on Empire Celia Russian convoys, never said a word about his time at sea, my dad lived for " for the day he got up " all else was in the past, when as a young lad dad would watch old archive film of the great war and would always fill up a little, it was to be many many years later i would learn about his father my grandad who served with Kings Own Scotish Borderes
fought in France/Gallipoli/France again for the Somme Offensive, fell badly wounded 1st July 1916, wounds to his leg bothered him all his life but!! he still volunteered for the International Brigade, thats why i would love to prove my late father right, all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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The TUC files on the Spanish Civil War are now all online at www.warwick.ac.uk/go/scw . They include two files on the International Brigade, but don't include any comprehensive lists of members of the British Batallion - the only Casey mentioned is a Charles F. Casey of Ipswich.
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:) Hi EJW, thier were 3 Casey's mentioned one you have named, other i forget i do have his named filed away, another was my relative Francis Casey from Glasgow, i'm hoping the list of names taken of men who were rejected on health grounds does exist, so far no one has been able to tell me it does,
i have been told such a file on mens names who were rejected for IB does exist and its in the National Archive, iv'e no way of getting down there to find out, i'm hoping my grandad would be on such a list, but have still not ruled him out for fighting, he survived the horrors of the great war so he would be no stranger to fighting.
Who know's one day i might just find his name some where.
All the best to all Derek :) :D ;)
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hi derek
sorry to have not got back to you sooner , but this last post has woken me up and i,ve just looked again at the tna site for a contact means , if you look on there home page along the top where you have , about us -education and the like click on archives sector on the next page scroll down to ask a question click that and from there you can e mail the team at tna ask them about the int brigade st least you,ll know for sure wether such a record is there .
and i sincerly hope you make your dream come true for you and dad and grandad .
regards
trevor
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:) Thanks Trev, will give it a go but not very good navigating around site, se ehow it goes though, thanks and all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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:) Hi Trevor, i found the contact form for National Archives, thanks, will tell you what they say when and if i get a reply :)
All the best Derek :) :D ;)
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:) Just had a reply from Warwick archives, they have not heard of any medical list of names of men rejected for International Brigade, so i'm hoping i get a reply from the National Archives as to wether they do hold such files.
All the best Derek :) :D ;)
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sitting here with everything crossed for you derek ;D.
regards
trevor
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;) Cheers mate ;)
all the best Derek :) :D ;)
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:) Hi Trev, i got a reply from National Archives just this minute, they cant tell me if they have the files with out doing a search, so unless some historian is researching the International Brigade and comes across medical files!!!!
All the best Derek :) :D ;)
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hells teeth derek what a let down so near yet so far , so in that case you may never hear if someones researching the int brigade or you would have to hire a researcher your self at what a cost who knows .you,d have thought that they would have some sort of index system of the records they have .
i suppose you lose nothing by looking around for a researcher and try to get an idea of cost it,s not as if you don,t have exact detail of what you need to know .
regards
trevor
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Hi, its been awhile since iv'e visited this thread, i contacted the Mitchell library in Glasgow recently
in the hope they might have any news paper archives dealing with the Glasgow lads who retuned from the Spanish civil war, i was hoping that the lads returning would have caused a stir with the news hounds of the day, sadly for me the Mitchell library had no archive news paper covering the returning Brigaders, can any one tell me who might have news paper archives up there in Glasgow
or Scotland.
When my relative Francis Casey returned one or two other lads were with him, this was 1937, still hoping to get hold of a photo of Francis Casey.
All the best Derek
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The TUC files on the Spanish Civil War are now all online at www.warwick.ac.uk/go/scw . They include two files on the International Brigade, but don't include any comprehensive lists of members of the British Batallion - the only Casey mentioned is a Charles F. Casey of Ipswich.
I'm hoping you can help me. I've been looking into the records for my Grandfather, Charles Frederick Casey of Ipswich, who you mention above. He was in the international brigade and fought in Spain. My Father found the record on the National Archive a couple of years ago, but we cannot locate it now. Would you be able to tell me where you found his details?
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Hi Lissyc_x,
Iv'e recently learned of Casey ancestors down in Ipswich,
can you please give any details on Charles Frederick Casey's parents,
looking forward to hearing from you.
Derek ;)
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Hi Lissyc_x,
Iv'e recently learned of Casey ancestors down in Ipswich,
can you please give any details on Charles Frederick Casey's parents,
looking forward to hearing from you.
Derek ;)
Unfortunately I don't know their names. I know that his Father was possibly from Cork, Ireland (he had at least lived there at some point) and fought and died in WW1.
His Mothers maiden names was Daykin/Daikin, possibly from Norwich/Ipswich.
Is this helpful at all?
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;) Not sure yet will check archives, the records and list of men who fought with the International
Brigade can be obtained from Karl Marx library London also the IBM, just google, will get back to you with any thing found on Charles.
All the best.
Derek ;)
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Hi all, after many a year i'm revisiting this post, i'm now trying to find information on Charles Frederick Casey from Ipswich.
Is Lissyc_X still around who posted she was related to Frederick Casey.
I'm trying to find out who Charles Frederick Casey's parents were:
I think its possible were could be related.
Any help much appreciated.
Derek.
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Hi again, just checked my files and came up with this that might help.
Francis Casey married Ann Sharkey.
Thier first child: Bernard Casey. Born 1861. Cove of Cork Ireland.
Bernard married Mary Higgins i believe this couple lived in Ipswich and Charles Frederick Casey could be decended from these Casey's.
Any help appreciated.
Thanks.
Derek
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Going back to Robert Casey, his WW1 service record has a copy of 2 letters he wrote in 1938, which you may have seen. One letter is dated 28th Feb 1938, which would be during the Spannish Civil War period.
He wrote as a member of the Old Contemptibles, requiring confirmation that he had been issued with the 1914 Star Clasp. In another letter, he states that the Old Contemptibles required a written statement that he was entitled to wear his clasp.
There was a branch pf the Old Contemptibles in Stockton and members had to be entitled to the clasp. They were entitled to wear their medals at their annual memorial parades. There was one in 1938, at Ashbrooke, at which the Sunderland Branch were part of the parade (reported in the Sunderland Echo 29 Aufg 1938, p.3). Preseumably his letter was in advance of this parade.
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Hi Sam, i'm one of those lucky people who's grandfathers WW1 records survived, Robert's son (my dad) was a man of few words, he him self was a merchant seaman during WW11, herdly ever mentioned his time at sea or!! his father's time in WW1, i had to learn about both just before computers were in peoples homes like today. My dad in early 80s spoke to jack jones (trade union leader of old) and asked jack if he'd met his dad Robert out in Spain, jack just said he met a lot of great lads out there in Spain, i've never stopped hoping some where thier is a photo of my grandad Robert Casey just waiting to be found, i never met him and no photo's of him ever came our way sadly.
I've often thought perhaps my dad remembers his father going off to join the international brigade but that he could have been rejected on medical grounds but!! My dad said his fathet went and thats set in stone for me.
Thanks for reply sam.
All the best.
Derek
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From memory sam, i think it was a Sunderland news paper that reported a story about grandad Robert from his hospital bed The Sunderland Royal Infirmary October-November 1914, when grandad said he had, like others been hit by a german dum dum bullet, if only they had taken photos that day for the papers, it was this incident that solved the mystery why grandad was on the kings own scottish borderes hospital rolls december 1914.
All tbe best.
Derek