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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: HALE39 on Wednesday 16 May 12 13:54 BST (UK)
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Who was Charles Boileau who married Sarah Thompson at St Bride Church Fleet Street on 1 October 1836?
He was of French origin, but who where his parents and did they come to London with him?
Were did he Serve his apprenticeship and with whom in Clerkenwell or near by maybe or even France, and who was his Master?
He was born 1812/4 in France he was 22 or 24 when married Sarah in St Brides church but no mention of his family members.
His early children are born [4] in Clerkenwell one each in St Lukes and Shoreditch before he moved to Coventry then finally Liverpool.
Finding his master might show his parents or guardians name or who paid for his apprenticeship either in France or England.
This was a highly skilled ocupation at that time and would have needed a large sum to get him trained in the craft.
Any ideas out there? unfortunatly I do not speak or read any French either.
Thanks for any information in advance.
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is this the charles Boileau listed in the 1860 Gore's directory of Liverpool where he's listed as an engine turner at 9 Stancliffe Street. This would suggest he made the cases and mountings for clocks and watches, rather than build the movements. Still a highly skilled job, but might come under a different type of appenticeship? As he was still young when he married, he may have apprenticed in England.
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Charles Boileau
I do not have that address from Gores but he was living in Liverpool at that time will check it out.
When he died in 1870 after 2 years of Paralysis aged 58, his occupation is given as Engine Turner on the death certificate,
His wife Sarah died a few months later and his occupation is given as Watch case and engine Turner on her death certificate.
My main problem is finding his family back in France lots of speculation and family rumours but no facts.
Thank you for you reply every bit helps.
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Hi,
slightly aside and you may have this info but both he and Sarah were buried in Toxteth Park Cemetery(10 june & 4 oct 1870) - but would they have had a headstone which may have more info on?
Junev
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In 1861 it says he is b. Paris.
Rather speculative, but you might want to look into a possible connection with Eugene Boileau (~1813-1869), of London, engraver/artist, b. France, may have naturalised in 1862. He lived in Clerkenwell from at least 1854 (patent notice) to 1861 (census).
There was also a Pierre Etienne Boileau, m. 1833 in St. Pancras to Candelaria Frilet. In the 1861 census he is listed as aged 79, b. Geneva, to his wife's 54 (b. Cadiz, Spain). Daughters are Mary and Amelia. In 1841 he is aged 55. He probably died in 1863 (indexed as Peter Stephen Boileau).
Now, familysearch.org shows a Pierre Etienne Boilleau had a son Pierre Louis Eugene Boilleau ("Pierre Louis" could be baptismal names, this boy could have gone by Eugene day to day), with (wife) Marie Charlotte Vetter baptised in Paris in 1814. This could easily be the same man who married in London in 1833, perhaps taking his son(s?) from his first marriage with him.
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Thank you junev and jorose
I did not know were they were buried will have to check that out.
Charles moved his family to Liverpool via Coventry between 1843 and 1846 [some of his children returned to Coventry in later years]
so the artist might be a related but how is the question.
1861 census giving Paris as place of birth, could be like" London rather than Liverpool" to impress others, Paris rather that the sticks.
I suspect his parents may be Jeane Baptiste Boileau and Marie Adelaide Flamain in Baulny district 55 married on 26 /06/1810
Charles death certificate gives age as 58 in 1870 so they are in the ball park.
But again this is pure speculation and has to be proved first.
At no time have I heard his parents names used, some personal contact was kept up with the family in Liverpool up to the first world war from France.
He should have been given the order of the Scarlet Pimpernel for covering his tracks.
Thanks again for your help
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I am a direct descendant of Charles Boileau. He was my GGG Grandfather, married at St. Bride's Church in London.
His son, Eugene Boileau married a Cullen from Ireland. They had several children in Liverpool, including my Grandmother, Ruth Monica Boileau. She met and married an American soldier from Montana, my Grandfather, Wendell Eugene Poore. They married at St. Anthony of Padua in Liverpool and settled in Cut Bank, Montana USA. My Father was one of six children later born in Billings, Montana.
Was anything else learned of Charles Boileau?
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Eugene Boileau was naturalised in London in 21st August 1862, a typographical engraver, married to a British subject with 3 children...1 of whom was Eugenie Catherine Boileau born 1845 in England. According to the naturalisation docs Eugene had lived in the UK for 51 years. He died 2/11/1869
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/23558/page/6405/data.pdf
I'm interested to find more about Eugenes history and his wifes name and other 2 children
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Jonlewis
My Charles Boileau married Sarah Ann Thompson on 1 Oct 1836
They had 9 children between 1837 and 1849, Died in West Derby Liverpool 6 June 1870. born about 1811-13 in France.
Although he is shown as a Watch maker he was most probably trained in France or England to make the Watch and or Clock cases a highly skilled job at the time,
He lived in Clerkenwell, Shoreditch, Coventry, and West Derby Liverpool.
I am closely related to the young lady above.
I have not found his parents yet or his birth place.
Good luck with your line, let me know how you go.
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jonlewis
Have a look at reply 4 above by "Jorose" that looks like your Charles more than mine.
Cheers
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HALE39
I am also a direct descendant of Charles Boileau, via his son Frederick (1842-1905).
I have been trying to find Charles’ parents for a number of years but have only just stumbled upon this forum thread. Have you got any further with identifying Charles’ parents?
In 1837, when his first son was born, Charles gives his occupation as “Jeweller and Engine Turner” on the birth certificate. However in 1839 he gives his occupation as “Tobacconist” on another son’s birth certificate!!!
He was living in Clerkenwell which was the watchmaking centre at that time so possibly changed direction from Jeweller to Watch Case Engine Turning as the watchmaking industry started to rapidly expand at this time.
Frederick moved from Liverpool to Coventry between 1861 and 1865. His brother, Eugene, followed him sometime between 1868 & 1870. I am interested in what evidence you have that Charles moved to Coventry.
I have records showing Charles living in London up until 30 Sep 1843 (Son Eugene’s birth) and then Liverpool from 21 Oct 1845 (Eugene’s baptism). I had always assumed that Charles moved from London to Liverpool and only made the occasional visit to Coventry.
Regards,
stevebo
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G'day stevebo
Charles Boileau B 1812/14 France
The Scarlet Pimpernel keeps on hiding!!
What I know is about the same as you, he was a " Rose Engine Engraver " look up the video series for this machine it's bloody brilliant but requires a hell of a lot of concentration probably caused his stroke in the end, there are two versions the Vertical and Horizontal Rose Engine lathe.enough of that for now, I live in Australia now so popping over to France is a bit time consuming and how the store their records is very complex. I am rapidly learning some Genealogy French though.
What I don't know is when Charles arrived in England and with whom?
Did he train in London it is possible but I have not found any records or relatives other than his children. he had 2 sons named Charles Richard both died sadly, the last son Richard survived so here I am.
I now think he was trained in the Department area of France Paris 75 or nearby in the watch and clock industries making watch and clock metal cases and engraving them with the complex patterns,
There was a clock maker [Horoleger] who may have been a relative who he may have trained under but his son was a master carpenter, 'Boileau a' Paris" on clock faces they had some very elaborate enameled and jewelled pocket watches plug the name into the net,\.
We do not know Charles's Parents names or where he was born, this is the big stumbling block, I am currently trawling through hundreds of Charles B's he may even have had other given names but it wasn't Ame'dee b 13 Feb 1815 Paris he was in France long after Charles left,
I lost contact with the Coventry Boileau's Elizabeth and Peter. he was in Hospital administration.
Sarah, Charles Wife's Father was a Sheet metal maker so it could be were they met in the first place
if he served time in France he was about 24 years old when he married basically a Journeyman just out of his trade training, I have not found his indentures in France either but they did exist,
He could have got his Jewelry skills from the above mentioned Horoleger.
My gran Adelaide said that the the French ladies that came over with their husbands to England before 1914 every year came from Piccardy, wine and pork merchants the Red / Auburn hair is a give away for Normandy in general but not proof.
So to progress we have to Know his parents names, where he was born, any siblings, did the family even survive The Great war Normandy was flattened then and later in ww2
Talk later
Hale 39
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Hello Jon,
1851 census 13 Crammer? Road Lambeth Surrey
Eugene Boileau 36 Artist engraver born Paris
Sarah 35 born Essex
Eugenie C 6 Middlesex
Adele A 11 months Surrey
Julia Goldham 19 Servant Essex
Adele Antoinette born 13 April 1850
Emilie Josephine born Sept qtr 1851Lambeth
Emily Josephine Boileau spinster born 6th July1851 London parents Eugene Boileau born France and mother Sarah Crane born England buried 20/4/1935 Akron Ohio USA
Adele Anoinette married Evan Thomas Gentleman from Breconshire Wales in Islington London looks like they went to America as well but he seems to have added a hyphenated Moore on to his name?
Jennifer
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Jennifer
Have you any details of your Eugene Boileau's parents names, and his siblings if any and exactly where in Paris they lived.
My Charles Boileau who married Sarah Ann Thompson in 1836 may be related, ages are close
but at this time I have not heard of any siblings in England or France.
see posting above this one for more details.
Talk later
Hale 39
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Hi Hale I am not related, just trying to help.
Jennifer
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30/5/1839 West Ham Essex marriage Eugene Boileau and Sarah Crane.
This certificate would give you his fathers name and occupation.
Jennifer
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Grove road Mile End Old Town 1841 census
Eugene Boileau 29 artist born Foreign
Sarah 29 not in the county
Ann Stevens 22 female servant born in the county
Jennifer
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Eugene Boileau and his father were both head engravers at Colsons Foundry in Chiswell Street London and also at The Bank of England. Eugene's daughter Eugenie Catherine Boileau married John David Mayer (Count Rossi) the 2nd great nephew of Count Pellegrino Rossi who was assasinated at the Vatican in 1848. John and Eugenie came to Adelaide South Australia aboard the ship ""City of Adelaide in 1878""
I am yrt to discover Eugene's fathers name but have put out feelers with some Authors and publishers of historical printing books to seek that info.
Jon Lewis
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/47771834?searchTerm=boileau&searchLimits=exactPhrase|||l-advstate=South+Australia|||dateTo|||notWords|||anyWords|||dateFrom|||requestHandler|||sortby=dateAsc|||l-category=Article
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The 1839 marriage certificate is not on line but you can send for a copy. It has been wrongly indexed under Eugena Boileau and Sarah Crane, the ref. I would order it under Sarah Crane marring a Boileau only, just encase it has been transcribe wrongly on the index, the ref. Is June qtr. 1839 vol 12 page 385. West Ham district.
This should give both parties address, father's name and all occupations. From the September qtr 1837 you can order a proper certificate, West Ham is one of the area's that do not have their church records on line. The record you have for Charles and Sarah is only a copy of the church entry, as I said, after 1837 you can order a full certificate.
Have a look at gro.gov.uk
Jennifer
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Eugene must have been quite successful at what he did as his probate was resworn in June 1870 to under £6000.
Jennifer
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It may be worth trying to contact the Bank of England museum if Eugene worked there in a valued position.
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Hi HALE39
Thanks for the comprehensive update.
You mention Peter Boileau and his wife Elisabeth; It was Lis who wrote to me in 1996 and got me started in family history. I had already created a tree going back to my Great Grand Parents by talking to my relatives. Lis had researched her husband’s Liverpool Boileau’s back to Charles and was able to link in to my Coventry Boileau’s. This was early internet days so all of our research was carried out in record offices and by purchasing BDM certificates.
I have been looking for information on Charles ever since. I spent many hours going through Immigration records at the PRO in Kew and Alien Returns in The London Metropolitan Archive but have not managed to find any record earlier than his marriage to Sarah Ann Thompson in 1836.
I thought that there may be a link to the other Boileau’s in London in the 1840’s but most of these are descended from the Huguenot Charles Boileau who fled to England in the 1690’s. There are two or three other Boileau families that have moved from France to England since then but tracing their parent’s back in France is proving just as difficult as for Charles. I have always thought that there could be a link to the Eugene Boileau (Artist/Engraver) that Jennifer mentions but I have found nothing so far. I had provisionally penciled in Eugene father's name as Etienne Marie Boileau but I cannot remember where that came from!! I have ordered the marriage certificate for confirmation.
There is also a William Thompson who was interred in Charles Boileau’s grave in 1904 aged 83 (see http://www.toxtethparkcemetery.co.uk/dbase/grave.php?grave=325§ion=A)
I assumed that he was related to Charles Boileau’s wife but this William was born in Shetland and I cannot find anything that links him to Sarah’s father the Tin Plate Worker in London.
I have also checked some of the French genealogy websites on the internet but my schoolboy French is very rusty and I find it a bit of a struggle. There used to be an Anglo French Family History Society that had some very useful guides on researching French ancestors but it appears to have folded and the website as now been taken down.
I will keep looking and if I find anything useful will post back to this forum.
Regards,
Steve
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I have just received the marriage certificate for Eugene Boileau & Sarah Crane which confirms Etienne Marie Boileau as Eugene's father. The details are as follows:
31 May 1839 - Parish of West Ham, Essex
Eugene Boileau full age bachelor Occupation = Artist residence = St Luke Co Middx Father = Etienne Marie Boileau, Artist.
Sarah Crane full age spinster Occupation = ------ residence = West Ham Father = Harry Samuel Crane, Chemist.
In the presence of H S Crane, E M Boileau and Ann Atherton
Regards,
Steve