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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: denisofessex on Wednesday 11 April 12 20:24 BST (UK)
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Would like to know what happened to this pub where I lived as a child approx 1932, I remember a school just opposite and the supplies to the pub brought on a cart pulled by shire horses. I seemed to remember the brewer to be Taylor Walkers whose phone number was HOP 2247.
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Would this have been in the Southwark area?
Carol
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Good afternoon Carol, re your query, not sure, afraid I dont know my Sth London too well.
I seem to remember Blackfriars Bridge being nearby.
I also remember the name of Sumner Street being mentioned and before we took up residence in the pub (I believe my father was manager) we lived in Mallais Street. All very sketchy, I'm talking about over 80 years ago.
Thankyou
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Hi
Yes, if it was south of Blackfriars Bridge then this would be Southwark.
This website has a "Horse & Groom" at 240 Blackfriars Road in the 1841 Census:
http://deadpubs.co.uk/LondonPubs1841/London1841-H3.shtml
If you look on Google Maps ( http://maps.google.co.uk/ ) and enter "240 Blackfriars Road" you can walk up and down the road and see if you can recognise any of the buildings that are left; unfortunately 240 doesn't appear to stand any more. There is a white building opposite with the word paper in the windows - does that look familiar?
Sumner Street is a turning off Southwark Street which meets Blackfriars Road just before the bridge. There was also a Horse & Groom in Sumner Street:
http://deadpubs.co.uk/LondonPubs/SouthwarkStSaviour/HorseGroom.shtml
The area has changed a lot since the war; in 1942 a bomb fell further down towards The Cut and demolished The Ring ( http://www.southbanklondon.com/walkthisway/BuildingDetails.php?building=16 )
KR
Gaie
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in 1944, Fredk Hy Collins was the landlord of the Horse & Groom in Sumner Street, if that's any help:
http://deadpubs.co.uk/LondonPubs1944/London1944H.shtml
KR
Gaie
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Gaie, looks like you've cracked it :D
I got Southwark from the phone number, but couldn't think of the name 'deadpubs' ::). Let's see what the OP thinks about your discovery!
Regards,
Carol
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Thank you Carol and Gaie, Seems Horse & Groom 24 Sumner Street was where I lived for a while, sorry that the site has been built over. I shall have to find if there was a school just across the road, if there was, that would confirm the location 100%. I dont expect there will be many pupils of 1932 around anymore. lol
Thanks again for your help.
Denis
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Hi Denis
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=65328
This page makes reference to a school in Sumner Street, originally St Saviour's grammar school, but later on a church day school for St Peter's parish. It was badly damaged during the war.
Here's a photo of Sumner Street, 1895 - scroll down the page:
http://thehenryline.freeservers.com/custom.html
A bit bigger:
http://thehenryline.freeservers.com/images/sumnerstreet1895..jpg
KR
Gaie
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A map showing Sumner Street with a pub on the south side, with a school opposite.
This is from a couple of years earlier than you quote, but may be of use.
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I'm so pleased to receive even more info on the Horse & Groom.
Thank you for the map of Sumner Street ReadyDale that just about sews it up because the relative positions of Horse & Groom pub and the school are just how I remember it to be all those years ago.
Also Thank you Gaie for the info on school and the photo of Sumner Street, I wouldn't be surprised if the Horse and Groom wasn't the building on the right with the large hanging lighting outside.
Despite the time lag, I remember going to a nursery class at the school and not being happy with the compulsory afternoon nap on a camp bed. I used to lie awake and it seemed ages before we could get back to playing with toys again. I recall the beer deliveries to the pub and watching the barrels roped down metal ramp to the cellar and then the a reverse for the empty barrels on to the cart. Sometimes I was allowed to sit on the top of one of the shire horses which seemed very high up to me.
I lost both my parents when I was quite young so thanks for helping me with glimpses of those early times.
Best wishes
Denis
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All,
I have added a few additional entries for the Horse & Groom. It takes me forever to update all of the Pubs on the site, all of the time.
Best
Kevan