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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Hampshire & Isle of Wight => Topic started by: raven-1 on Sunday 01 April 12 19:08 BST (UK)

Title: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: raven-1 on Sunday 01 April 12 19:08 BST (UK)
Has anyone the name Sinsbury in their family tree, Christchurch area. My grandmother was witness to the marriage of her brother George Young to a Bessie Sinsbury at Christchurch Priory in Dec 1913.
They subsequently lived in Hayters Cottages, Stony Cross Burton, which I believe were demolished when the Christchurch Bypass was constructed.
Sinsbury not Sainsbury seems unusual, so would be pleased to hear if more information about the family or area exists. I have seen pictures of the old cross on the old road.
Regards.
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 00:49 BST (UK)
Here's the 1891 and 1901 census for Christchurch for Bessie if it helps at all

1891 - all b Christchurch -  Address Hayters Cottages

John Read 53 widower agric labourer
Annie Sinsbury ??30 dtr married
Frank Sinsbury 34 son in law agric labourer
Frank Read 10 son
Jane Read 15 dtr
Harry Read 7 son
William Read 4 son
Bessie Sinsbury 2 g/dtr
Fred Sinsbury 8 months g/son
RG12 Piece 907 Folio 51


1901 all b Christchurch - 7 Pound Lane

John Read 62
Anne Sinsbury 37 dtr widow
Harry Read 19
William Read 14
Fred Sinsbury 10
Bessie Sinsbury 11
May Read 5 niece
RG13 Piece 1037 Folio 5 Page 1
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 01:14 BST (UK)
Bessie was illegitimate

Births September qtr 1889 
Bessie Frances Read     Christchurch  2b 643

Marriages September qtr 1890       
Annie Read/Frank Sinsbury   Christchurch  2b 1141   
 
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 01:17 BST (UK)
I have checked the 1911 free index for her and she is quaintly indexed as Bessie Kerces Ginsbury aged 22

Rootschat do not allow 1911 lookups so you would need to buy credits to view the entry

http://www.1911census.co.uk/search/tnaform.aspx
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: raven-1 on Monday 02 April 12 11:17 BST (UK)
Hello CaroleW
I need to think this one through!
Marriage cert gives Bessie as Bessie Frances Sinsbury 24 yrs. Father. Frank Sinsbury Deceased.
Regards.
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: Jebber on Monday 02 April 12 12:16 BST (UK)
It was was common for someone a stepfather as as their father on marriage, sometimes a grandfather or uncle, even a fictitious person to conceal illegitimacy.

I do know a SINSBURY from the area, but have been unable to link him to your family, although I suspect there is a connection if it was searched back.

Thought you may be interested in these pictures of where the family subsequently lived, Pound Lane, and the rear of Spicer Street, both lost in the development of the by-pass, although a tiny fraction of Pound Lane remains at the start of the by-pass.

Jebber
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: raven-1 on Monday 02 April 12 13:19 BST (UK)
Thank you both very much for your interest,
I’m not sure how common these illegitimate children were, but we do seem to have quite a few in various branches of the family tree!
Your attached photo’s are brilliant, I recall seeing the piles of debris left from the demolishment of Pound Lane, they were very poor buildings indeed, I think they were mainly Cob & Mud type construction.
Bessie’s given address was 3 Spicer St. I wonder if we may be looking at the actual house.
Thank you both very much.
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 16:42 BST (UK)
Hi

Here is Franks death reg so they were only married for 2yrs

Deaths June qtr 1892   
Frank Sinsbury  aged 36  Christchurch  2b 400

As Jebber says - many illegitimate children made up a fathers name when they married so as to appear "respectable"
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: raven-1 on Monday 02 April 12 18:15 BST (UK)
Hello CaroleW
I have found a dedication to a William George Read who was killed in France 1917 32yrs old, son of Mrs A Sinsbury of 3 Spicer St Christchurch.
I would like to think that John Read in his census return 1891 has indicated that Bessie was indeed a Sinsbury along with her full brother Fred.
Now trying to find John,s wife and when she died. Any help, thoughts welcome.
Regards.
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 18:23 BST (UK)
Hi

Have you checked the 1881 census which is free at

http://www.familysearch.org/eng/search/frameset_search.asp?PAGE=census/search_census.asp

Clearly Annie had more than one illegitimate child. 
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 18:46 BST (UK)
If you have seen that 1881 entry - you will know where Bessie got her name from

You need to go back to 1871 to find John's wife

1871 for Christchurch - all shown as b Church

John Read 33 agric labourer
Jane 32
Bessie   15
George 9
Annie   7
William   4
John   3
Kate  1
RG10 Piece 1177 Folio 74 Page 13
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 18:54 BST (UK)
Deaths June qtr 1880   Jane Read aged    42  Christchurch  2b 397
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 19:08 BST (UK)
Interesting - I don't think John Read was Bessies father as he was single in 1861

It also looks as though he was also illegitimate

1861 - all b Christchurch

Moses ...field  50 (can't decipher surname but it's not Read) - unmarried - bootmaker
Mary Read 54 unmarried charwoman
John Read 23 son
RG 9 Piece 666 Folio 53 Page 6

There is a marriage in June qtr 1861 with a Jane Vey on the same page


 
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 19:15 BST (UK)
1861 has Jane Vey b 1838 living with mother Kitty.  Bessie Vey aged 5 has been shown as grandmother instead of grand daughter and indexed as 53 instead of 5

All b Christchurch except Kitty

Kitty Vey 50 widow b Ringwood
Eliza   25
Jane   23
George   20
Elizabeth   14
John   12
Bessie   5 g/dtr
RG 9 Piece 666 Folio 54 Page 7
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 19:21 BST (UK)
Jane Vey was legitimate

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NKND-2YZ
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 22:27 BST (UK)
Another member has confirmed Moses surname was Fifield and that Mary Read was living with him in 1841 and 1851
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 02 April 12 22:33 BST (UK)
You may be thoroughly confused by now with all the various names etc so here's a quick sum up

Bessie Frances Sinsbury b 1889 was actually born Bessie Frances Read - illegitimate dtr of Annie Read

Annie did not marry Frank Sinsbury until 1890 and Frank died in 1892

Annie's father John Read was the illegitimate son of Mary Read

John Read married Jane Vey who had an illegitimate daughter Bessie Vey who is shown as Bessie Read on census entries.  Bessie was born 1856 and John & Jane only married in 1861

Jane Read (Vey) died 1880
Title: Re: Sinsbury. Christchurch 1900
Post by: raven-1 on Monday 02 April 12 23:03 BST (UK)
Thank you again Carole W.
It would seem that there is no Sinsbury blood flowing in this branch of the family tree,
Whatever his beginnings John Read must have been quite some man, even at 62 in the 1901 census his household is still caring for May a niece 5yrs old. If my great-aunt Bessie was a typical sibling of the family he made a pretty good job with their upbringing.
Your & others time and effort very much appreciated and thanks for your summary.
Regards.