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Some Special Interests => Occupation Interests => Topic started by: JenClark on Wednesday 21 March 12 10:48 GMT (UK)
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Hello All,
I am trying to solve a mystery regarding one of my master mariners. His name was John Lancefield and he was the Captain of the 'David Morrice' in the 1830's, I have several Lloyds Registers throughout this time which show him as Captain of this vessel, but what I would love to know is the whereabouts of the crew list agreement for the 1838 voyage from Black River, Jamaica to London.
There are several things I would like to check -
Firstly, the vessel is supposed to have run aground during this voyage as reported in the The Sailor's Magazine, and Naval Journal
By American Seamen's Friend Society – 1836 to 1838
"Barque David Morrice, left Black River Jamaica April 25th 1838, and ran on shore on the evening of May 10, near Castle Island. The Captain and Crew saved."
Secondly, my ancestor appears to have had a son named John baptised at Black River Jamaica on 11th Feb 1838, and I would dearly love to know if he was on board, or indeed any other family members. My Capt John Lancefield returned to England after this voyage and married for a second time on 4th July 1838 to Eliza Clayton.
I have attached the Lloyd's Register entry for 1837-38, showing the ships details.
If any one can point me in the right direction for accessing this crew list I would be very grateful ;D
Jenny
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Hope this is useful:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/records/research-guides/merchant-shipping-crewlists-agreements-1747-1860.htm
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Are the crew lists for London based ships from 1835-1860 at the National Archives then?
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In the research guide (previous post) the ref is to the series BT98, yes. The link there takes you to
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATLN=3&CATID=1569&SearchInit=4&SearchType=6&CATREF=BT+98
I've not followed one of these up myself but it looks like hard work!
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Thanks Graham, I've e-mailed them so we will see what they say.
Wish I could just pop in to the National Archives and have a look, but it is a long way from Australia ;)
Jenny
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If they have survived, the crew agreements for DAVID MORRICE 1835-1844 should be in this piece
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=4996735&CATLN=6&Highlight=%2CLONDON&accessmethod=0
I would use TNA research service. It would be a simple search given they have the piece number but if they come back with an astronomical quote, let me know and I will take a look next time Visit TNA.
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Thanks Seaweed!
I will wait till they e-mail back (which could take 10 days) and let you know how I went ;)
Jenny
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Well not so successful with the National Archives :-\
They have written back to say that I need to pay a researcher to locate the items to be copied before they can copy them, I gave them the piece number and everything like you suggested Seaweed.
Do you visit TNA often or should I ask elsewhere to see if someone can have a look for me?
Jenny
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The other place where British crew records are kept is in Canada - www.mun.ca - but I don't know what years they cover.
And very strange that on a crew list I have for a ship called Annie Archbell - luckily the ship was bound for Australia and so crew lists were published on the www.mariners.records.nsw.gov.au website - there is mention of a Mrs David Morrice being a passenger - arrived Sydney 30 October 1862.
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Hey BumbleB, I think the David Morrice was owned by the Morrice family, and named for a previous ship captian....so you never know!
I have tried the Canandian records in the past for other mariners I have in the family, I think their records are later though, more like turn of the century.
I am pretty sure that TNA have the docs I need.....if they have survived that is ;)
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I will be visiting TNA next Tuesday all being well and will take a look for you. As you are aware lots of these documents have not survived but fingers crossed.
MUN hold the majority of Crew Agreements from 1863 -1938 and from 1951-1976 The remainder are at TNA, NMM and a small percentage at County record office's.
Incidentally the London Standard of May 24 1838 says DAVID MORRICE was wrecked off Crooked Island.
The only Crooked island/s I can find is in the Bahamas and the other, which can be discounted, is in Hong Kong. I also believe the is a small island? of this name off the gulf coast of Florida but again I think this can be discounted.
Hopfully there is a logbook with the crew agreement which may give the true identity of the place where she was wrecked.
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Hey Seaweed that would be brilliant ;D
I realise that the records may not have survived, but he was captain of the David Morrice for a few years so any crew lists that exist for the ship back to 1835 would also be much appreciated if the one for his last voyage in 1838 is not there. This fellow is a bit of a mystery and I would love some concrete evidence about his life ;)
I have not seen the London Standard article, but I did see mention of the vessel being wrecked off Castle Island (as below) which is in the Bahamas...and as it was leaving Jamaica this area seems most likely, but would love to know for sure!
Hello All,
I am trying to solve a mystery regarding one of my master mariners. His name was John Lancefield and he was the Captain of the 'David Morrice' in the 1830's, I have several Lloyds Registers throughout this time which show him as Captain of this vessel, but what I would love to know is the whereabouts of the crew list agreement for the 1838 voyage from Black River, Jamaica to London.
There are several things I would like to check -
Firstly, the vessel is supposed to have run aground during this voyage as reported in the The Sailor's Magazine, and Naval Journal
By American Seamen's Friend Society – 1836 to 1838
"Barque David Morrice, left Black River Jamaica April 25th 1838, and ran on shore on the evening of May 10, near Castle Island. The Captain and Crew saved."
Secondly, my ancestor appears to have had a son named John baptised at Black River Jamaica on 11th Feb 1838, and I would dearly love to know if he was on board, or indeed any other family members. My Capt John Lancefield returned to England after this voyage and married for a second time on 4th July 1838 to Eliza Clayton.
I have attached the Lloyd's Register entry for 1837-38, showing the ships details.
If any one can point me in the right direction for accessing this crew list I would be very grateful ;D
Jenny
Got all my fingers and toes crossed that it has survived!!!
Thank you so much for your help :)
Jenny
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Searched BT98/362. What a jumble! Nevertheless found two Crew agreements for DAVID MORRICE. There was nothing about her last voyage and no mention of his son. If you send me your email address via PM I will send all the documentation I have.
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Thanks Seaweed!!! That is brilliant, I'll PM you now ;D
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I've just come across this and what I have to add may not be of direct interest to you.
David Morrice was my great great grandfather and I have quite a lot of information about him. He was Master of the Annie Archbell and sank it in the North Sea. He survived and became Master of the Pampero. I have crewlists/logs for this ships two voyages in 1868/9. All hands were lost in 1869 on the way from New Zealand to Shanghai. He was also Master of the Walter Morrice and I have details of voyages to Australia carrying immigrants n the late 1840s.
Keith
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Hi Keith - my interest is the Annie Archbell - my grandmother's name but not connected with this vessel or this Archbell family (so far).
Do you have the details of the sinking off the Terschelling Bank, North Holland? I have the information from the Schagen newspapers, plus the Queen granted a bounty to the captain and crew of the Terschelling pilot boat for rescuing 23 of the crew and passengers on 13 April 1867.
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I think I have the same information as yourself so probably can't help.
Keith
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Probably not - but do you know of any of his connections with the Archbell family? Othe than being the master of Annie Archbell?
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No, I have nothing else. The Morrices originally came from Aberdeen before this branch emigrated to Jamaica in the late 18th century. David Morrice had his family home in north London when he returned to England. Could possibly be a connection there but I don't know of it.
Best of luck,
Keith
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OK, thanks - I just wondered - and if you don't ask the question then you don't get an answer! ;)
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I've just come across this and what I have to add may not be of direct interest to you.
David Morrice was my great great grandfather and I have quite a lot of information about him. He was Master of the Annie Archbell and sank it in the North Sea. He survived and became Master of the Pampero. I have crewlists/logs for this ships two voyages in 1868/9. All hands were lost in 1869 on the way from New Zealand to Shanghai. He was also Master of the Walter Morrice and I have details of voyages to Australia carrying immigrants n the late 1840s.
Keith
How cool to find a relative of the real 'David Morrice'!! While I really am only interested in the ship bearing his name as my 4 x great grandfather was the master of it in the 1830's, it is always nice to hear from people interested in shipping...I descend from a fair few Ship's Captains...got salt in my veins too I reckon ;)